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Preparing For A Musical Degree, date: july 22, 2009
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Preparing For A Musical Degree

author: Weeping_Demon7 date: 07/22/2009 category: the guide to
rating: 6.6 / votes: 9 
POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 06:35 am
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More Weeping_Demon7's columns:
+ Becomming A Well-Rounded Guitarist the guide to 06/16/2009
+ Breaking Onto The Music Scene the guide to 06/12/2009
 38 
 comments posted
 
 m 
  :
Play all your modes of minor. (All 5 positions in the CAGED format)

I disagree entirely. Modes are not just scales. You can't play G Mixolydian just by starting C Major on G. Modes are not positional.

POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 08:22 am / quote |
Talon_Leader :
Colohue m :
Play all your modes of minor. (All 5 positions in the CAGED format)

I disagree entirely. Modes are not just scales. You can't play G Mixolydian just by starting C Major on G. Modes are not positional.


He's right, if you're going to do that you'll have to know more than just the modes, like the order they're in.

POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 09:33 am / quote |
metallicafan616 :
i'm pretty sure colleges are usually jazz OR classical?

What is the CAGED format?

POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 01:58 pm / quote |
Weeping_Demon7 :
I meant that as a guide scale.

CAGED are the five basic scales based on the C A G E and D chords.

POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 07:06 pm / quote |
Pepefloydean :
This is the ideal perspective of a someone preparing for a musical degree, but in the reality you just need to be able to sight read and have a small concept of theory. A few months ago I thought that an aspiring music student needed to be as great as this article explains plus a great technical ability, but talking to people that are already studying music this isnīt always true. Of course it is recommended to know all of this stuff but it isnīt necessary.
POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 08:48 pm / quote |
rhoadsfan92 :
how bout contemporary music schools (berklee, new school of music, musicians institute, etc)???
POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 09:49 pm / quote |
rhoadsfan92 :
srry for the double post, but i have a question. isnt the CAGED sequence mostly for chords? and maybe arpeggios?
POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 09:52 pm / quote |
Dr. Guitar :
This can't be correct. If you know all this stuff before you go to school, what the hell do you need to go to school for?
POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 10:07 pm / quote |
Radical Bob :
This would be true for high-end well recognized music programs.. the average college/university music programs, however, won't have this kind of minimum requirements. Of course, it helps to know as much as possible because the school is going to take the most qualified applicant.
POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 10:12 pm / quote |
Guitarfreak777 :
Radical Bob wrote:

This would be true for high-end well recognized music programs.. the average college/university music programs, however, won't have this kind of minimum requirements. Of course, it helps to know as much as possible because the school is going to take the most qualified applicant.


I agree. This is far far far greater than what my guitar teacher told me to know and practice before going to just a general college. If I was going for one of the schools geared toward music then perhaps, but not normal schools.

POSTED: 07/22/2009 - 11:25 pm / quote |
TheGreifer :
Some of the more selective music programs in the country do have tough requirements. The point of going to such schools isn't necessarily to learn all the basic theory (yes all the scales he mentioned are fairly basic theory on any instrument) but how to apply it most effectively.

Don't expect to get into a "good" music program on any instrument knowing only a few scales.

POSTED: 07/23/2009 - 02:46 am / quote |
mdwallin :
this sounds about right to me. I've spoken to a few teachers at the school I hope to get in to, and they've mentioned everything on here (and as you said) more.
The only thing not mentioned was knowledge of music periods (baroque etc.)

POSTED: 07/23/2009 - 05:12 am / quote |
LordArbiter :
...what's CAGED format?
POSTED: 07/23/2009 - 08:28 am / quote |
gerardk :
Thanks,helped a lot!!
POSTED: 07/23/2009 - 08:52 am / quote |
BSM123456789 :
Dr. Guitar wrote:

This can't be correct. If you know all this stuff before you go to school, what the hell do you need to go to school for?


yea really

are you going to learn more? or is it simply to get a certificate?

POSTED: 07/23/2009 - 07:01 pm / quote |
countrychris01 :
Id like to debate this one too. The big thing that was missing, is the key to all chords, modes and thats scale harmonization. The chord scale. That is they key to remember it right there.

Colohue> why cant you play G mixolydian starting off the G in the C major scale? If you resolve what your playing to and from G, using the C major position, your still playing the mixolydian mode. Its the exact same arrangement of notes, which is what a scale is.

POSTED: 07/23/2009 - 10:08 pm / quote |
countrychris01 :
and Colohue> modes are positional. Just like any other scale on the guitar, you can play them from anywhere. Most of my modal work usually works off the major scale in the given key im playing. for instance if im looking at a 2-5-1 progression in C. thats Dminor, Gmaj, Cmaj. Im gonna use a C major scale, but on the D minor, im gonna resolve the C major scale to the D. Whether im in first position or seventh, im still using a D Lydian mode. Look at a piano, ur still playing the same major scale if your on a piano, ur just starting and ending at a different note.
POSTED: 07/23/2009 - 10:25 pm / quote |
CG138 :
Pepefloydean wrote:

This is the ideal perspective of a someone preparing for a musical degree, but in the reality you just need to be able to sight read and have a small concept of theory. A few months ago I thought that an aspiring music student needed to be as great as this article explains plus a great technical ability, but talking to people that are already studying music this isnīt always true. Of course it is recommended to know all of this stuff but it isnīt necessary.


This is the reality. Also, though jazz is essentially the accepted format when it comes to college level music, most places are becoming more lenient. To be frank, if you can show some range in your style and a basic ability to read music and grasp theory, You'll probably be fine. Unless, as someone said, you're going to Berklee or something.

POSTED: 07/23/2009 - 10:56 pm / quote |
StonaLemons :
Not a bad article, but you should have said this is only for the really prestigious music colleges.

And another thing i think is that to go to uni/college and do music, you shouldnt just love listening to music, you should love the understanding behind it, all the theory application and whatnot and obviously performing it.
Honestly its not worth getting a music degree if you wouldn't want to teach music because its one of the only viable jobs to go into after your degree.

POSTED: 07/24/2009 - 12:24 pm / quote |
StraitsSantana :
Not bad, but this stuff isnt really aimed at your traditional bluesman.
POSTED: 07/24/2009 - 03:45 pm / quote |
Guitarfreak777 :
StonaLemons wrote:

Not a bad article, but you should have said this is only for the really prestigious music colleges.

And another thing i think is that to go to uni/college and do music, you shouldnt just love listening to music, you should love the understanding behind it, all the theory application and whatnot and obviously performing it.
Honestly its not worth getting a music degree if you wouldn't want to teach music because its one of the only viable jobs to go into after your degree.


Why can't I just go to further the knowledge of music and my instrument?

POSTED: 07/24/2009 - 05:26 pm / quote |
Gottlos :
Guitarfreak777 wrote:

Why can't I just go to further the knowledge of music and my instrument?


Why pay for a 4 year music related degree if you're not going to go into music? That's an easy way to go through 100 grand fast. And if all you want to do with music is write, I can almost guarantee (unless you're writing classical music) that you won't find any applications for over half of what you learn in college. I've taken Jazz Band and two music theory classes (scored a 4 on my AP music theory exam) and I don't think I've used anything I learned in those classes since school ended.

POSTED: 07/24/2009 - 06:41 pm / quote |
Elrafa :
I don't get the the CAGED format thing, can anyone explain please??? I know my scales quite well... but wtf is the CAGED format????
POSTED: 07/24/2009 - 06:50 pm / quote |
jamsea :
I'm at the university of windsor at the moment and strongly looked into their music program before I decided to go into computer science (to get a job). The ONLY REASON you need a degree in music is if you want to get a job teaching high school/grade school. Every other career (writing music for television/film, session player) is found by having a portfolio or having previous experience.

At the U of W you could either get a bacholor in music or a bachelor of fine arts in music. The bacholor in music requirements included an audition and pretty much everything else this guy wrote in his article. A bacholor of fine arts in music required that you have a pulse. As you could guess, the second degree won't even get you a job teaching high school.

POSTED: 07/24/2009 - 08:23 pm / quote |
 
 m 
  :
countrychris01 wrote:

and Colohue> modes are positional. Just like any other scale on the guitar, you can play them from anywhere. Most of my modal work usually works off the major scale in the given key im playing. for instance if im looking at a 2-5-1 progression in C. thats Dminor, Gmaj, Cmaj. Im gonna use a C major scale, but on the D minor, im gonna resolve the C major scale to the D. Whether im in first position or seventh, im still using a D Lydian mode. Look at a piano, ur still playing the same major scale if your on a piano, ur just starting and ending at a different note.


If you're playing over a C major chord and not resolving to C then you're not playing modally.

POSTED: 07/25/2009 - 11:08 pm / quote |
12212012 :
I think im gonna cry :*(

This is very hard for a self-taught guitarist!
Well, at least I'm in Marching/Concert band

POSTED: 07/26/2009 - 04:27 pm / quote |
Windwaker :
12212012 wrote:

I think im gonna cry :*(

This is very hard for a self-taught guitarist!
Well, at least I'm in Marching/Concert band

It is hard. If you honestly plan on trying to become a professional musician, it is in your best interest to take advantage of local professional players who offer lessons, or any learning opprotunities. You CAN make it on your own, but it is a lot easier if you have some help.
Taking lessons from a seasoned jazz player was the best decision I made in high school, more so than joining the schools concert and jazz bands. While I knew my theory going into both lessons and school, school concentrated almost entirely on my proficiency, whereas my lessons incorporated applications of what I knew and enhanced my ability in a much larger number of aspects.

(Gotta get this out of the way now) I'm attending Berklee starting this fall as a result of my work. If anyone has any further questions on auditioning (regardless of school) I'll do my best to help you out if you give me a PM.

POSTED: 07/26/2009 - 08:19 pm / quote |
countrychris01 :
If you're playing over a C major chord and not resolving to C then you're not playing modally.


I'm playing over a C major progression if you read correctly. Chords in that progression that i selected are D min, G maj and C maj. Thats the second degree, the fifth degree and the fourth degree. A C major scale will work fine over all these chords. However, if I start changing the scale per chord change. I would go..D Dorian, C Lydian, G Mixolydian. However, I can play all of these using a C major scale, just resolving to the individual chord tones. C major resolved to D over the D chord, which is a D Dorian mode. Same with the rest. To say that modes are not positional is just misinformation.

POSTED: 07/27/2009 - 01:21 am / quote |
countrychris01 :
Sorry i just read the error above. I be using a C Ionian, or a standard major. My bad.
POSTED: 07/27/2009 - 01:23 am / quote |
Paul Tauterouff :
Elrafa wrote:

I don't get the the CAGED format thing, can anyone explain please??? I know my scales quite well... but wtf is the CAGED format????


CAGED is a system of 5 fretboard boxes based off of the 5 open chords (C, A, G, E, D). When you play a chord as the 5 moveable (barre) chords, they follow each other in order on the fretboard which spells out CAGED. This pattern repeats just as all scale patterns do. Sorry if this doesn't help much, but this is too complicated to explain thoroughly in a comment.

I searched here on UG and here are some lessons on this. http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/search.php?s=CAGED&w=lessons

POSTED: 07/27/2009 - 10:13 am / quote |
Paul Tauterouff :
Sorry for the double post - just wanted to add that this is a good list of things to prepare for music university.
POSTED: 07/27/2009 - 10:14 am / quote |
Icarus Lives :
Oh no!! I really want to go to music college but it looks like I have SO much learning to do. This is a real bubble-burster, ball-breaker and general reality check. FFFFFUUUUU!!
POSTED: 07/27/2009 - 12:17 pm / quote |
goldenslumbers :
Dr. Guitar wrote:

This can't be correct. If you know all this stuff before you go to school, what the hell do you need to go to school for?
I agree, I plan on going on into music and I know a good deal of music theory already and multiple instruments but, I don't plan on learning EVERYTHING before I even go into college. That is why I go, to learn.

POSTED: 07/27/2009 - 03:27 pm / quote |
(BNDR) :
i agree. although i think that if music is your passion you can make it. the reason its so tough is that it weeds out people who aren't serrious and will hold everyone back. give it your all.
POSTED: 07/28/2009 - 12:06 am / quote |
miskatsu :
Radical Bob wrote:

This would be true for high-end well recognized music programs.. the average college/university music programs, however, won't have this kind of minimum requirements. Of course, it helps to know as much as possible because the school is going to take the most qualified applicant.


If Mozart, Beethoven, Edward Grieg etc. would revive and start an music academy, an royal one, with only private lessons, this could be the knowlegde you need. I don't think such guitarists as Slash or Eddie Van Halen went to an music college, or even to an music school with such high requirements. Like c'mon! I can solo on pentatonic scale, but who the hell needs about 125 scales to fu**ing improvise one f**king solo?!

POSTED: 11/15/2009 - 01:29 pm / quote |
miskatsu :
(BNDR) wrote:

i agree. although i think that if music is your passion you can make it. the reason its so tough is that it weeds out people who aren't serrious and will hold everyone back. give it your all.


And I say that you have to be one freaking nutcase perfectionist if you want to learn this much music theory before you even go to damn college! I want to be an pro guitarist, but not to learn every bloody little detail of music theory, dammit!

POSTED: 11/15/2009 - 01:32 pm / quote |
miskatsu :
Windwaker wrote:

12212012 wrote:

I think im gonna cry :*(

This is very hard for a self-taught guitarist!
Well, at least I'm in Marching/Concert band
It is hard. If you honestly plan on trying to become a professional musician, it is in your best interest to take advantage of local professional players who offer lessons, or any learning opprotunities. You CAN make it on your own, but it is a lot easier if you have some help.
Taking lessons from a seasoned jazz player was the best decision I made in high school, more so than joining the schools concert and jazz bands. While I knew my theory going into both lessons and school, school concentrated almost entirely on my proficiency, whereas my lessons incorporated applications of what I knew and enhanced my ability in a much larger number of aspects.

(Gotta get this out of the way now) I'm attending Berklee starting this fall as a result of my work. If anyone has any further questions on auditioning (regardless of school) I'll do my best to help you out if you give me a PM.


dammit I live in Finland, in a town of 50 000 ppl, we have the only bloody conservatorie in 200 km range, which is freaking corrupted! One my friend has tried to go there for something 4 years (to play drums!) but one little looser in my class gets the place, and the dude is so shit in music an everything else, he is an social looser and he has AD/HD, gets the place! I think his dad has something to do with music, but how the heck I can get teaching in music, when my music teacher wants to play on music lessons Finnish pop songs from the 70's and 60's, dammit! I have trained for nearly one year on my own, and I can play 12 bar blues, little lead, shit solos, know all the chords (majors and minors!), can barré and know the basic amount of guitar theory, and only thing I think I have to learn is to sweep pick, learn more scales, and maeby more scales and music teory... But I have learned bloody fast!

POSTED: 11/15/2009 - 01:40 pm / quote |
miskatsu :
And my school has maeby only one band, it plays metal. Not every place has bloody jazz bands and seasoned players. And I don't dammit need them!
POSTED: 11/15/2009 - 01:42 pm / quote |
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