Hardcore vs. Post-Hardcore


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SAINTJIMMY9999
11-27-2008, 03:32 AM
I know what hardcore is, but this whole post-hardcore thing really confuses me.

I mean, every "post-hardcore" band I've listened to just sounded like a less than talented metal band.

Is there anything that sets "post-hardcore" apart from metal?

tomohawkjoe
11-27-2008, 03:33 AM
...
wha?

Spiritual_Cramp
11-27-2008, 03:35 AM
A lot of things.

Listen to Rites of Spring, then listen to...I don't know. A metal band?

EDIT: I don't know what the hell kind of post-hardcore you've listened to, so here's a few to check out.

Rites of Spring^^
Nation of Ulysses
At The Drive-In
Drive Like Jehu

Amuro Jay
11-27-2008, 03:36 AM
post hardcore? idk like listen to at the drive in (i think thats what they are) then listen to megadeth, or necrophagist, then tell me what the difference is

edit: yeah it seems they are pHC. woo!

SAINTJIMMY9999
11-27-2008, 03:36 AM
I thought they were emo.

Spiritual_Cramp
11-27-2008, 03:37 AM
I thought they were emo.

ATD-I?

Far from.

tomohawkjoe
11-27-2008, 03:38 AM
rite of springs is
At The Drive-In is post hardcore though
Million Dead is also a pretty good example

lordofthefood1
11-27-2008, 03:39 AM
A lot of 'emo' bands can be considered post-hardcore
being that emocore derives from hardcore...

Kartman
11-27-2008, 03:43 AM
Post-Hardcore. Anything Ian MacKaye or Joe Lally does is magnificent.

waldorphPRS41
11-27-2008, 04:15 AM
Bear Vs Shark

kryptonite22
11-27-2008, 05:31 AM
Million Dead is also a pretty good exampleMillion Dead is awesome. Fact.

recklessnick
11-27-2008, 09:44 AM
to me, post-hardcore is stuff like bear vs shark and at the drive-in
but i'll also use the tag to describe music like a day to remember and alexisonfire

treflip
11-27-2008, 11:02 AM
Yeah, I use it to describe modern stuff like Glassjaw as well. Bit of a loose term really.

Also, listen to every band recommended in this thread. Especially Million Dead and ATDI.

nashawa
11-27-2008, 07:37 PM
rite of springs is
At The Drive-In is post hardcore though
Million Dead is also a pretty good example

rites of spring was the original emo band
well, along with fugazi
and im sure there were a few more
but i guess true emo is a type of post-hardcore...

comeback kid is a great example of post hardcore...

Righteous Heart
11-27-2008, 07:40 PM
comeback kid is a great example of post hardcore...
No they're not.
Comeback Kid is hardcore.

nashawa
11-27-2008, 07:43 PM
well, they refer to themselves as post hardcore

zayG
11-27-2008, 08:15 PM
well, they refer to themselves as post hardcore
no they dont

saxaxe
11-27-2008, 08:26 PM
Ok so is emo a type of post hardcore? That's always confused me, with bands like Rites of Spring and Fugazi.

nashawa
11-27-2008, 08:41 PM
Ok so is emo a type of post hardcore? That's always confused me, with bands like Rites of Spring and Fugazi.

well i personally dont think so
but since everyone else seems to, i guess theirs no point in arguing
i think PH was just a natural progression from emo...

and yeah i have a revolver magazine where theyre asked about their genre and all the music label nazis out there and the say melodic hardcore, which = post hardcore

every band should have their own genre...
dibs on "majestic jazzcore"!

zayG
11-27-2008, 08:44 PM
and yeah i have a revolver magazine where theyre asked about their genre and all the music label nazis out there and the say melodic hardcore, which = post hardcore
melodic hardcore and post hardcore aren't nearly the same...

nashawa
11-27-2008, 08:45 PM
prove the difference

zayG
11-27-2008, 08:48 PM
melodic hardcore
http://www.myspace.com/fcfive

post hardcore
www.myspace.com/lifeatthesespeedspdx

Righteous Heart
11-27-2008, 10:02 PM
FC Five = <3

JxD
11-28-2008, 01:56 AM
When I think post hardcore, I think Quicksand. When I think emo I think of either the early stuff like Embrace or Rites of Spring, or the later stuff like Orchid and such. Post hardcore overlaps with so much stuff though, you could make convincing arguments that an endless amount of bands fall under that sub-genre.

recklessnick
11-28-2008, 01:58 AM
screw you guys, im going home

IcePh0enix
11-28-2008, 01:19 PM
Oh my god, they killed Kenny!

I honestly don't get post-hardocre that much either. At the Drive-In, Fugazi, and Thursday all sound very different, yet they're all considered post-hardcore. The only thing I can think of which would really make a band post-hardcore is the vocal style, yet other emo bands have a very similar vocal style.

:wtf:

HelpTravesty
11-28-2008, 01:23 PM
I see post-hardcore as hardcore that has gone through the "alternative rock car wash".

Faded Grey
11-28-2008, 10:58 PM
I've yet to hear a Hardcore band that has ANYTHING on Alesana.

zayG
11-28-2008, 11:28 PM
I've yet to hear a Hardcore band that has ANYTHING on Alesana.
get out

tomohawkjoe
11-29-2008, 12:15 AM
I've yet to hear a Hardcore band that has ANYTHING on Alesana.
leave before you pollute this forum any more.

RawrSlinky
11-29-2008, 12:21 AM
I've yet to hear a Hardcore band that has ANYTHING on Alesana.

:haha

Righteous Heart
11-29-2008, 12:27 AM
I've yet to hear a Hardcore band that has ANYTHING on Alesana.
Why the hell does he have the account name of Faded Grey?
:mad:

(Reason I'm mad. (http://www.myspace.com/armyofkids))

saxaxe
11-29-2008, 12:28 AM
I've yet to hear a Hardcore band that has ANYTHING on Alesana.
:haha
Pure gold. I'll disagree with everyone else. Stick around. I need some more good laughs.

Faded Grey
11-29-2008, 12:59 AM
Come on guys, Alesana may be a little bit on the "Emo" side, but they're awesome.

You've got to admit that their dual vocals are amazing.

RawrSlinky
11-29-2008, 01:02 AM
Come on guys, Alesana may be a little bit on the "Emo" side, but they're awesome.

You've got to admit that their dual vocals are amazing.

:haha Omg please go on

zayG
11-29-2008, 01:03 AM
Come on guys, Alesana may be a little bit on the "Emo" side, but they're awesome.

You've got to admit that their dual vocals are amazing.
yea man

alesana is def emo

they sound a lot like sunny day real estate, who are one of my favorite bands

oh yea like mineral as well!

saxaxe
11-29-2008, 01:05 AM
yea man

alesana is def emo

they sound a lot like sunny day real estate, who are one of my favorite bands

oh yea like mineral as well!
Yea dude, Alesana is like...bad ass. They take emo and totally mix it with metal. And their breakdowns are sick, brah. They like mix in the southern stuff and its so original.

RawrSlinky
11-29-2008, 01:08 AM
Yea dude, Alesana is like...bad ass. They take emo and totally mix it with metal. And their breakdowns are sick, brah. They like mix in the southern stuff and its so original.

Yeah foreal son, when their guy does those like growlz?? that is tha most br00tal.

zayG
11-29-2008, 01:11 AM
fkn brutle

saxaxe
11-29-2008, 01:17 AM
br00tal as fvk

attheian
11-29-2008, 01:29 AM
i hate hardcore

most of the bands people consider "hardcore" are just plain punk.

Its like people used hardcore as and adjective to describe how punk a band is
"that band is hardcore punk""that band is mega punk"
only difference being a bunch of tards thought the meant it as a genre..

stuff like bad religion and black flag and fugazi is punk to me

id say comeback kid is a little more hardcore but still punk ish

but like old afi? not hardcore

dont even get me started on metalcore :confused: :confused: :confused:

saxaxe
11-29-2008, 01:33 AM
stuff like bad religion and black flag and fugazi is punk to me
:
Then listen to bands like Verse, Have Heart and Ruiner.

zayG
11-29-2008, 02:07 AM
i hate hardcore

most of the bands people consider "hardcore" are just plain punk.

Its like people used hardcore as and adjective to describe how punk a band is
"that band is hardcore punk""that band is mega punk"
only difference being a bunch of tards thought the meant it as a genre..

stuff like bad religion and black flag and fugazi is punk to me

id say comeback kid is a little more hardcore but still punk ish

but like old afi? not hardcore

dont even get me started on metalcore :confused: :confused: :confused:
hardcore is a style of punk you ****ing tard

ps. listen to infest

recklessnick
11-29-2008, 04:03 AM
alot of post-hardcore bands sound different because post-hardcore basically means hardcore that is taken to a different direction and style. am i correct?

Internal Chaos
11-29-2008, 12:03 PM
My understanding:

Hardcore - contains melodic, tough guy, etc
Post-Hardcore - bands like A Day To Remember, Alesana, At The Drive-In, etc

Emo refers to emotive hardcore, begin with the aforementioned bands Fugazi and Rites of Spring. Screamo developed from it, but because I've been listening to it for a few weeks, I don't really understand the difference, but time will tell. Often, bands like Escape The Fate and Alesana are called Screamo, but they actually know they're not, and like Post-Hardcore.

zayG
11-29-2008, 01:04 PM
My understanding:

Hardcore - contains melodic, tough guy, etc
Post-Hardcore - bands like A Day To Remember, Alesana, At The Drive-In, etc

Emo refers to emotive hardcore, begin with the aforementioned bands Fugazi and Rites of Spring. Screamo developed from it, but because I've been listening to it for a few weeks, I don't really understand the difference, but time will tell. Often, bands like Escape The Fate and Alesana are called Screamo, but they actually know they're not, and like Post-Hardcore.
ADTR and Alesana aren't post-hardcore either...

I'd throw Fugazi into post hardcore as well, honestly it has a LOT of overlap with emo and screamo. It is more or less more upbeat emo, closer to hardcore, or at least all the post hardcore I listen to would fall under that category.

Faded Grey
11-29-2008, 10:31 PM
What does the POST in post-hardcore mean anyways?

RPExecutor
11-29-2008, 10:54 PM
not sure. i think they may be making the bold statement that hardcore is dead, or they're "progressive" hardcore (which is oxymoronic anyway) or they may be just hardcore for people that can't take a few rounds of brutality more than what they pack.

zayG
11-29-2008, 11:33 PM
post just means it came after...

JxD
11-29-2008, 11:51 PM
not sure. i think they may be making the bold statement that hardcore is dead, or they're "progressive" hardcore (which is oxymoronic anyway) or they may be just hardcore for people that can't take a few rounds of brutality more than what they pack.

It's depressing to see someone from a city that has such a vibrant hardcore scene make such a ridiculously ignorant and generally moronic statement. Hardcore isn't brutal. Stop trying to be different and start listening to the top 50 again.

Faded Grey
11-30-2008, 12:29 AM
not sure. i think they may be making the bold statement that hardcore is dead, or they're "progressive" hardcore (which is oxymoronic anyway) or they may be just hardcore for people that can't take a few rounds of brutality more than what they pack.

Lololol, progressive hardcore, that's funny.


And where the heck is the hardcore influence in post hardcore?

recklessnick
11-30-2008, 02:14 AM
ok. thats it. someone come up with a definition. one sentence, not one paragraph, straightforward, something that we can all understand

IcePh0enix
11-30-2008, 02:49 AM
A loosely defined genre that developed from hardcore punk, consisting of hand picked rock bands that yell a lot.

pmeg568c
11-30-2008, 02:59 AM
this thread has some of the worst posts in it i have ever seen haha.

attheian
11-30-2008, 03:42 AM
hardcore is a style of punk you ****ing tard

ps. listen to infest


i know what hardcore is..

and i know what bands are hardcore..

i listened to that stuff like 10 years ago.. and its still bad....

nashawa
12-03-2008, 08:15 PM
Come on guys, Alesana may be a little bit on the "Emo" side, but they're awesome.

You've got to admit that their dual vocals are amazing.

alesana is just a bunch of posers failing at being AFI

and yeah
if DK was hardcore and Bad brains were hardcore and descendents were hardcore, then old AFI was most definately hardcore

just because it doesnt have burly screaming doesnt mean its not hardcore

Faded Grey
12-03-2008, 08:27 PM
alesana is just a bunch of posers failing at being AFI

and yeah
if DK was hardcore and Bad brains were hardcore and descendents were hardcore, then old AFI was most definately hardcore

just because it doesnt have burly screaming doesnt mean its not hardcore

Dude, what are you talking about, they sound way different.

waldorphPRS41
12-03-2008, 08:29 PM
Dude, what are you talking about, they sound way different.

Old AFI is definitely hardcore.

Internal Chaos
12-04-2008, 01:25 AM
Alesana sound nothing like anything AFI has ever released.

TBC Guitarist
12-04-2008, 03:53 AM
Hot damn its retarded in here.

recklessnick
12-04-2008, 12:28 PM
aaaahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha god

Cory Smash
12-04-2008, 01:49 PM
Old AFI is definitely hardcore.

Agreed.

Maybe not the most mega-awesome-bite your face off hardcore, but I think it's still hardcore.

nashawa
12-04-2008, 07:58 PM
Alesana sound nothing like anything AFI has ever released.

to be perfectly honest, id only heard one alesana song
what even one was on the Warped 08 comp
so maybe im off base
i didnt buy it... it was a gift...
a horrible gift...

RPExecutor
12-04-2008, 08:52 PM
It's depressing to see someone from a city that has such a vibrant hardcore scene make such a ridiculously ignorant and generally moronic statement. Hardcore isn't brutal. Stop trying to be different and start listening to the top 50 again.

you're not going to attack me based on a statement that can be interpreted about ninety different ways, are you? ****, what tense idiots we have here that lash out whenever they see someone talking about brutality, genres, etc...

i never said that hardcore was brutal. i said "more" brutal. it is a heavier sound than post-hardcore. maybe it's an incorrect term, maybe i should have said "heavier", but who the **** do you think you are talking down to me after a statement i made that you interpreted incorrectly? "stop trying to be different"... i like the music because it's good music, asshole. i've never hardcore danced in my life, you couldn't pick me out of a crowd as someone who listens to heavy music, and i think people whose hair takes longer than 10 minutes to fix are generally stupid.

to everyone else: sorry to bring a stupid argument in here, but when people decide to be condescending dicks i tend to fight back.

Alesana sound nothing like anything AFI has ever released.

so what? nile sounds nothing like amon amarth, but they're both metal. same thing here.

zayG
12-04-2008, 09:07 PM
alesana isnt hardcore in any way shape or form

and you probably dont listen to hardcore, get out

RPExecutor
12-04-2008, 11:17 PM
alesana isnt hardcore in any way shape or form

and you probably dont listen to hardcore, get out

post hardcore.

read previous posts before deciding to be a jerk.

Faded Grey
12-04-2008, 11:22 PM
alesana isnt hardcore in any way shape or form

and you probably dont listen to hardcore, get out

Dude, the effing thread title is Hardcore vs. POST HARDCORE.

JxD
12-05-2008, 01:00 AM
who the **** do you think you are talking down to me after a statement i made that you interpreted incorrectly?

Evidently I'm an elitist piece of ****, deal with it.

Internal Chaos
12-05-2008, 01:32 AM
Okay, let me sum this up so we can shut the fuck up. No one actually knows what the argument is about, it looks like people are trying to say Alesana are trying to be AFI.

Summary point 1
- Alesana sound nothing like AFI, and never will. They are completely different

Summary point 2
- This thread is about discussing Post-Hardcore, so AFI are irrelevant. As Alesana are regarded as a post hardcore band, they are relevant.

All people who want to discuss PH, stay. Others, pull your cocks out of your thighs and wander home, unless you wish to observe how normal discussions take place.

Thank you.

RPExecutor
12-05-2008, 02:06 AM
Evidently I'm an elitist piece of ****, deal with it.

evidently.

steering this rather unstable train of a thread back on topic: has no one mentioned Alexisonfire because they're so freaking mainstream or what? their early stuff is quite good

stratstrummer40
12-05-2008, 09:29 PM
first off, who cares. second off, thursday.

zayG
12-06-2008, 12:24 AM
Dude, the effing thread title is Hardcore vs. POST HARDCORE.
and they arent post hardcore either

zayG
12-06-2008, 12:25 AM
evidently.

steering this rather unstable train of a thread back on topic: has no one mentioned Alexisonfire because they're so freaking mainstream or what? their early stuff is quite good
old alexisonfire rules, once again, not post hardcore

waldorphPRS41
12-06-2008, 12:35 AM
first off, who cares. second off, thursday.
Hey there birthday buddy.

RPExecutor
12-06-2008, 02:18 AM
old alexisonfire rules, once again, not post hardcore

then pray tell what exactly the hell they are, because alesana is definitely PH and i don't know what to call old AOF if they're not.

zayG
12-06-2008, 02:22 AM
then pray tell what exactly the hell they are, because alesana is definitely PH and i don't know what to call old AOF if they're not.
alesana is pop rock with screams

old alexisonfire is just poppy metalcore, new stuff is rock

Internal Chaos
12-06-2008, 02:26 AM
They're post-fucking-hardcore

--ATREYUROCK--
12-06-2008, 09:20 AM
Alexisonfire are post-hardcore

At least, thats the way Ive always thought of them...

Suav Nitebeest
12-16-2008, 12:29 AM
Eh, my understanding of any PH is pretty much limited to Helmet and Quicksand, so I'm pretty satisfied at the moment.

IlikeTheSKA
12-16-2008, 12:49 AM
rites of spring was the original emo band
well, along with fugazi
and im sure there were a few more
but i guess true emo is a type of post-hardcore...

comeback kid is a great example of post hardcore...
Fugazi? I hope you mean Embrace.

Haymaker17
12-16-2008, 01:12 AM
Fugazi? I hope you mean Embrace.

yeah im assuming thats waht he meant cause embrace came before fugazi for mackaye