Descant of Derision (Technical BlackCore) C4C Baby!


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JazzDeath
03-02-2011, 01:55 AM
Here's a moi again with a new song just fresh out of draft mode.

This is my latest one, it's kinda different and kind of the same, like most of my stuff if you've listened to my previous offerings on this forum =D.

I'm looking for constructive criticisms of all kind, from actual riff content, song structure, general feeling of the song, the actual instruments themselves and how everything meshes together sonically.

As always C4C would be my pleasure, you write a lot, I write a lot, you write pertinent, I write pertinent... if you don't, well, we'll see what I feel like writing for you ;)

DiminishedFifth
03-02-2011, 02:00 AM
Fo'got the file!

JazzDeath
03-02-2011, 02:04 AM
Added it now, sorry about that.

hildesaw
03-02-2011, 02:15 AM
I though it was pretty interesting! I have a friend how writes a lot of stuff similar to this, kind of in the blackened death metal, maybe without the "core" but it doesn't seem that there is much "core" in this piece anywho. Maybe the chugs at the end. Anyway, It was an interesting song, and I'd like to hear it full recorded with vocals and what not. I think vocals would be the make or break thing for me. But then again they always are. I'm going to shut up now.

Burning_Angel
03-02-2011, 03:39 AM
I liked that song quite a bit. It reminded me a lot of Asmodee and/or Reverence [especially Reverence, actually]. The French one.

The chorus ****ing made it.

Not much else to say than that. I loved the chorus though. Without that, it wouldn't have been quite so excellent.

JazzDeath
03-02-2011, 04:20 AM
Well thank you, I'm glad you enjoyed it man.

It is not that core-ish but there are some elements of the genre I like to incorporate into my music, to give it a modern type of edge.

I_I
03-02-2011, 05:44 PM
This sounds great. I'd love to hear a real recording with vocals.

Your riffing syntax is very creative, it really makes the song for me.

JazzDeath
03-02-2011, 06:34 PM
Well thank you.

Don't be afraid to say negative stuff people, I like constructive criticism!

carldw1988
03-02-2011, 06:54 PM
I would say that quite a lot of the fret positions seems quite bizarre given that you could play the same note without having to change hand position...but if thats the way you play it then fair play. However that doesnt make much difference to how the song sounds....which does sound very good, some imaginative riffing...also your screen name makes a lot of sense now as well. Can't fault the structure or the mix of instruments, everything fits together, and nice to see someone not neglecting the bass. Also liked the addition of keyboards at the end. I did feel the outro may have dragged on a little long, however i would guess that vocals would sort that out. Also the section marked lead, i don't know if that is intended to have vocals over it, but if not i feel it might only need to be played after one of the choruses rather than both times. Overall though a well put together piece with good riffs and the right mix (for me at least) of melodic and heavy.

JazzDeath
03-03-2011, 06:39 AM
Yes disregard the fret positions, for this particular song I composed some riffs on my guitar ( the basic guideline to the piece, the rhythm) and then I added leads and embelishments on Guitar Pro itself so some of those things are done solely by ear and not in any regard to the person playing it, I haven't adjusted those yet...

Thanks for the feedback though, and yes there will be vocals placements on top of the end as to break the monotony of the single chords before the chug part.

Imm0rtal
03-04-2011, 08:33 AM
WTF is BlackCore......?

JazzDeath
03-04-2011, 02:24 PM
A lot of my music focuses on harmonies and chord voicings found mainly in black metal, plus blastbeats are included and there's tremolo picking, and distorted guitars with let rings a la Emperor - therefore the black metal.

Most everything I write is technical and also has influence from Technical Death Metal or bands like Cynic, later Death, Gorod, Gorguts, stuff like that, therefore it's technical.

And this song has a breakdown in it that I imagine could be considered "Core" but it's in reality more akin to Meshuggah's play on rhythmics than anything else..

Anyway just listen to it if you really want to know, generally the wacky genre titles I write are meant to be both goofy and kind of self mocking (Technical Blackcore sounds really dumb but it's funny and it does still reflect the song in some way), and at the same time it grabs people's interest doesn't it? :P

Life Is Brutal
03-05-2011, 08:29 PM
Very good stuff.

Intro is cool, but I don't know about the chromatics in the transition at 9. Next section is good, but I love the chords in 19-20. All the stuff following is also very good.

Chorus is Awesome. The lead is also great, but It may convey too much brightness, although I see the importance of it for contrast.

Post-Chorus is also awesome and very building. Following material is a Good refrain to the beginning stuff.

Same awesome sections follow... And the Ending is Crushing. I don't know how I like the breakdown section, but the chords preceding it are awesome. Keyboard here is very awesome.

Can you actually do the drums for most of your pieces?

valdean
03-06-2011, 05:19 PM
Alrighy.

(Not using RSE)
Disregarding fret positions as you've explained that.
Introduction: I dunno, the tapping seems kinda fast? It kinda makes it sound as if the song doesn't know where to go, or what mood it's in. Drums are doing fine, and I like the bass going with the bass drum in bar 3-4.
Bar 9: Nice transition. Changes the mood nicely and gives an impression of what's to come.
Verse 1: The first two bars sound very "occult", with lack of better words. The Morbid Angel-esque blasts fit nicely. The next part with the tremolo picked notes is great, however I would rather have them all be sixteenths. Further up to the chorus it's all good. The chords add some flavour to it. Also, the bass is great. I really enjoy it when it's playing a part of it's own like that. Especially the slapping. Groovy.
Chorus: Some cool dissonant riffing here. Bass going solid in the back. Unfortunately ghost notes aren't as loud as you'd want them to be here, so the drums aren't audible to their full extent, however I see what you're going for and I like it.
Lead: Really good stuff. Although the first 4 notes on bar 36 I'd like them not to be tied, seems and sounds unnecessary, but it might sound better when played for realz.
Post-Chorus: Dunno what to say really, it's all good here, with the chords and notes going at it together. The drumming at bar 44 reminded of Gene Hoglan.
Verse 2: Someone has been listening to Bleed! You might have to hire Mark King to slap that for you, unless you can do it yourself, if so, kudos to you. Otherwise great.
Ending: The Rhodes piano sounds awesome with that. Great atmosphere.
However I'm not too sure about the octaves joining in. Makes it sound more "pretty" and "harmonic" rather than "dark" and "scary".
I'm not a fan of breakdowns, so that part didn't do anything for me. I would have ended the song before that, but that's just me. Rhodes piano fading out was a nice touch and a good way to end it.

Pardon the repeated usage of boring adjectives, but when everything actually is good and great, it's hard not to. I hope you understand it as such instead of me just listening and going "yeah, I guess this is good/nice".
Otherwise, maybe a little to much of the Chinese cymbal.

Just ask if there's anything else you want me to mention.

Wanna crit mine? It could be something for you.
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1419014

JazzDeath
03-07-2011, 02:23 AM
Can I do the drums for most of my pieces? More or less. There are things I would alter on my drumset that are more ergonomic, perhaps as cymbal or tom choices which may not be the best choices when it comes to movement economy.

Most of it is a question of learning the actual section, but there are a few things that I would have some trouble learning because it's inherently complex to play well, such as the section at bar 44-45 which is relatively complex to play tightly (for me at least).

Other than that there's nothing impossibly complex in this particular song, but some other pieces of mine are rather ridiculous on drums - right off the bat the hardest I can think of is Sensory Overload, by far the drums on that are just stupidly fast (so is everything else) and at the same time very complex - I'm not on a high enough level to perform that piece.

Thanks for the listen, Dylan.

Oh and Valdean no I can't do slap bass for shit, I'll probably just remove the slap for that section entirely - just thought it sounded cool for now ;). And yes, I'm definitely a big fan of Gene Hoglan.

Also they're not octaves harmonies at all , but your comment is noted, I might end up changing that.

For the introduction, tapping like that really sounds like shit on Guitar Pro in my opinion because the lower register notes are much more flagrant and clearly defined than they are when the riff is played on guitar - I don't really like how it sounds on GP to be honest, but I love how it sounds on guitar so yeah, it's meant to be exactly like that.

I'll check your song tomorrow man, I have a day off =)

Life Is Brutal
03-08-2011, 10:26 PM
Thanks for the listen, Dylan.

HOW DARE YOU!

Its Dillon. :p:

Tarbosh
03-27-2011, 04:03 PM
I just saw a link to this in another thread and thought I'd give it a whirl because I'm usually a fan of your work.

Critting as I go:

Starts off interesting enough, I dig the contrast in verse 1. Aha, there's that trademark JazzDeath chromatic descent staccato thing. Thing at 21, I mean. I've just noticed you like to use that, ahaha. Sweet progression in the chorus, with a cool lead following the chords nicely after, not much to say there.

Not sure how I feel about those chords you let ring in verse 2, it could just be the contrast between them and the rest of the verse, but whatever.

I think the rest at 32 should be half as long.

Ending is alright, but it's not really what I was looking forward to for an ending to a song like this. Doesn't seem intense enough, really. Maybe it's the rhodes, because that's always been a "mellow" instrument, everything about the timbre of that instrument is mellow. It's a cool a progression, though, I think if you orchestrated it differently it would be more effective.

Another thing I think you could use is some kind of bridge, it seems a bit...brief. It really just repeats two verses, two choruses, and is over. I'm left wishing there was more, some other kind of section. You can change it or not, but if you're like me, you won't want to touch a song when it's deemed finished.

Anyway, outside of those few minor flaws, really good work here. Do you think you could perhaps take a look at my little symphonic thing here when you have the time?
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1423791

JazzDeath
03-27-2011, 05:04 PM
The let ring chords have been arranged, they let ring but not into the Bleed-esque rhythmic section.

I actually switched the ending to a harpsichord lead instead of the Rhodes, I do agree that the tone is a bit too.. bubbly, for lack of a better word, than the song calls for, and I think the Harpsichord has that nice, dark tone for a keys type lead.

And I did originally feel it was a relatively short piece (certainly for me, it's out of my usual form), so this is an issue I struggled with at first. THe thing is, since I'm used to it now, I have no idea what I could add to really make the piece better and still keep the drive the song calls for, so I'm not particularly sure where I would add a section. You have any ideas?

And yeah, I love chromatic passages, and as transitions I find em pretty cool, something I've been trying to apply more and more to my pieces is using a transition theme as a sort of mini hook in a piece and using variations of that same theme to bridge all my riffs together, it's kind of my little touch that I find makes it unique.

guitar_jew
03-27-2011, 07:50 PM
Thanks for all the compliments and suggestions you made on my piece. Really made me feel good about myself. :P

I'm not as big on tech death as I was when I first came to these forums, but as far as the genre goes, this is the cream of the crop. The tapping bit at the beginning was nice to listen to, very melodic black metal-ish. All the riffs transition great into each other, and the whole piece has this great drive, like 'let's get to the next note, NOW!' But unlike most works with that feel, you haven't sacrificed melody to get that desired effect, and it's awesome.

I thought it was a little odd how the diatonic sound from the intro never returned, but that's fine. That was my least favorite part of the song. Diatonic stuff just sounds plain and uninteresting to me for the most part in metal.

I wish I had more than just ass-kiss compliments to give, but really, I don't. IMO, this is your best since Sensory Overload. Congrats! It's just a damn shame it's not as long as some of your others.