Weird ideas


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Freepower
06-09-2005, 06:33 PM
To put it simply, last wee while, my chops have improved a fair bit (because i've started sweeping, mostly) and im just looking for some weird ideas to spice up my playing, lead and rhythym.

I play pretty much every genre that accepts guitars and is relatively well known (no indian sitar ragas - unless you get me a fretless guitar, of course).

Hopefully this thread can become a resevoir of cool ideas, and to start it off, heres what im using at the minute -

Inverted powerchords - so simple, so great.

Better phrasing on sweeping by more interesting sweep and taps.

Using pedal tones, and using whole arpeggios as the pedal tone.

Two handed chords - use fingers from both hands to finger a huge chord, pick it with spare fingers and thumb!

Touchstyle - i know its obvious, but a lot of people see tapping as limited to EVH style.

Single string arpeggios.

Odd modes and scales...for example, ones with 8 separate notes, like
G A B C D D# E F# G (hope to god i wrote that down right).




Thats a few ideas, i hope you got something, i hope you add something. Thanks!

kirkhammett1988
06-09-2005, 06:49 PM
My friend invented double power chords, it sounds pretty cool

I created it and have done this a few times, use your left hand or right (Which you ever you use for chords) and put it above the neck and play like that. Its confusing but fun...

Playing with teeth, it has already been done but still, very weird

Palm-tapping I technique I created, basically you tap with your palm. It is nearly impossible but I did it, the sound is not as good as normal tapping

Wammy Harmonics, self-explanitory

And finally the third of my created techniques knuckle tapping

oblique
06-09-2005, 07:21 PM
Well, you know how bass players play slap bass? I wrote a slap guitar riff, it sounds pretty cool. Also scratching is fun, you'll know what I mean if you listen to RATM's Bulls of Parade or Audioslave's Drown me Slowly. I'm not exactly sure how to do it, but I got a cool sound by turning my gain up to 10 and raking muted strings while running my left hand up and down the fretboard.

WindJammer
06-09-2005, 07:25 PM
^Scratching... left hand muting? See "the entire genre of funk rock."



Backwards soloing-- Hendrix (even a few brevities... Castles Made of Sand intro), John Frusciante (Give it Away solo, on his solo work),

Drum machine solos-- Take a bit of thinking to sustain one.

Monophonic songs-- These really test out your competence as a writer and can be great to listen to with practice writing them.

Good thread :cheers:

slash_pwns
06-09-2005, 07:37 PM
Eastern Scales and Timing- Harmonic Minor even works. Just emphasize the b6 to 7 and its rather eastern. Use X/16 time signatures at like (Sixteenth = 120) bpm and use 64th rests, etc... Kinda fun.

oblique
06-09-2005, 07:59 PM
Originally posted by WindJammer
^Scratching... left hand muting? See "the entire genre of funk rock."


It's different, it sounds like a dj scratching lps. It's kind of Tom Morello's trademark. Have you listened to rage against the machine at all?

slash_pwns
06-09-2005, 08:00 PM
And Tom Morello does that w/ left hand muting lol...

oblique
06-09-2005, 08:01 PM
Originally posted by slash_pwns
And Tom Morello does that w/ left hand muting lol...

I have no idea how he does it.:p: I meant left hand muting, wrote palm muting by mistake.

slash_pwns
06-09-2005, 08:02 PM
I for one love Tom Morello's style and I know he uses a lot of effects, so look out for that when trying to emulate him.

oblique
06-09-2005, 08:05 PM
Yeah, his solos are mostly impossible to play with my sad little rig. When I'm less broke I'll get some effects pedals and do some Morello covers.

WindJammer
06-09-2005, 08:07 PM
Anyways... monophonic line knowledge is a must for jazz bassists. Any of those in here? I just might have a few things to talk about.

Nonsensical (yet well-thought out) effects above bass and drums How interesting it'd be to see a band that does this consistently. RATM and The Mars Volta come to mind... but a guitarist that doesn't run at all on notes. Sounds ridiculous to a lot of people, but it'd be pretty nice in a modern rock band.

Even more interesting when you couple this guitarist with a monophonic musician who would rely purely on notes.

DorkusMalorkus
06-09-2005, 08:34 PM
Originally posted by WindJammer
Anyways... monophonic line knowledge is a must for jazz bassists. Any of those in here? I just might have a few things to talk about.

Nonsensical (yet well-thought out) effects above bass and drums How interesting it'd be to see a band that does this consistently. RATM and The Mars Volta come to mind... but a guitarist that doesn't run at all on notes. Sounds ridiculous to a lot of people, but it'd be pretty nice in a modern rock band.

Even more interesting when you couple this guitarist with a monophonic musician who would rely purely on notes.

I'm confused

Like some Sonic Youth? Is that what you mean? Because they have nonsensical stuff that goes well...For example, The Burning Spear. I believe Thurston Moore puts a drum stick behind the 12th fret uses some weird effects and hits the stick. And later on Lee Ranaldo takes a drill to the wah pedal.

DorkusMalorkus
06-10-2005, 12:19 AM
I guess there are weird things like feedback songs, where feed back is used a lot, it is hard to pull it off well though.

Freepower
06-10-2005, 05:11 AM
^ i once did a song where there were very few actual notes, it was mostly precussion using the guitar and me putting out some random stuff over it...

Thanks for the ideas lads, great work - WJ, you want an example of the scratchy thing morello does, check out "Ashes in the fall" it almost sounds like dance music - I always assumed he was scratching with the pick using with high gain.

ILoveHarmonics
06-10-2005, 05:48 AM
On the site of steve vai he talks about circle vibrato. It's like combining classic with rock vibrato in a circle motion so you let the pitch go down a bit aswell. Tapping with the plectrum real fast is nice combined with a slide where you follow your left hand like a train. I'm also practising bending 1/4 steps and repeating a riff ending on one and finally ending with a whole step.

SilentDeftone
06-10-2005, 08:39 AM
^ http://vai.com/LittleBlackDots/84/vibrato.html

-SD :dance:

WindJammer
06-10-2005, 10:33 AM
Originally posted by oblique
Well, you know how bass players play slap bass? I wrote a slap guitar riff, it sounds pretty cool.

Also try that with wah (clean guitar, of course).

pavan
06-10-2005, 11:17 AM
freepower, do you want a few indian scales to spice up yer solos ? I know a ton of them. And you dont need a fretless guitar for most of them. in april i made a thread on this, and got a whopping response of 3 replies

You should probably listen to some nice classical music or jazz and you will get a good lot of wierd ideas.

Maybe try extreme ocatve jumping, switching modes very frequently, wierd ultra wierd time signatures, whammy bar abuse.

very strange chord progressions sometimes may turn into something good.

i think putting passion and wit will make a pretty good song.

good luck my dear shredola espagnola

Freepower
06-10-2005, 02:49 PM
^ did you submit those into the lessons as well? Because i may well have seen them, i think i'll give em a try once im done experimenting with an extremely jazzy tuning i just found.

Lol, and why were you referring to shredola espagnola?

slash_620
06-10-2005, 03:30 PM
ahhhh,i rember pavans thread.

i only rembered one scale though,sounded kind of scary.

it was the major scale with a flat second.

try it.

doesn't tom morrello do that scratching thing on 'people on the sun'?

the craziest thing i ever heard of was daron malakian of SOAD using a dildo as a pick.

nightwind
06-10-2005, 03:36 PM
Harmonizing artificial harmonics. Their is a classical piece I came across, where this ocurrs. ****ing beautiful.

For acoustic or classical players, slap the body of the guitar while you play a rhythm. Make sure it's a jumpy fast one, and it always gets your groove going.

Learn how to strum without using a pick. I don't mean like, strumming with your fingers as if they were holding a pick, I mean upstrokes with the thumb, and down with the fingers. If you can get a decent rasgueado going, you'll have a great time playing rhythm this way.



Rasgueado (http://www.guitarpeople.com/classical/Rasgueado.asp)

SHANANDO
06-10-2005, 04:19 PM
Hey Pavan, if you could post those Indian scales then that would be helpful for me. Thanks :cheers:

Oh and Slash_620, Morello uses an Allen Rench for that track. Druing the verse he scratches the strings to create a B/C type pitch if you get me.

pavan
06-11-2005, 04:49 AM
this thread is slowly slipping into oblivion! i think you should start a similar thread in the shred forum. you'll get way more ideas and replies there.

Shanando, I will. I am making up a list. will do it sometime soon.

SHANANDO
06-11-2005, 11:08 AM
Cool, cheers Pavan. :cheers:

LVKE NAVMANN
06-11-2005, 06:13 PM
One day I was just sitting around with my eletric and I grabbed a capo and starting sliding it across the strings like you would with a violen bow. It sounded kind of like space ship from a sci-fi movie.

slash_pwns
06-11-2005, 06:14 PM
Using the entire arpeggio as the pedal point (posted by Freepower in first post) is fantastic... Just using it now, and its amazing.

Freepower
06-12-2005, 06:21 AM
^ why thank you! Bloody hell, i better not see you on TV shredding your ass off with my fave idea.

If you want something to do, use a small part of the arp, say, the 3 notes, and add onto the end of it each time you use it.

Start with a 3 string sweep, then a 5, then a 6, then a 6 and tap, then a four octave monster to finish off. Thats my dream lick!

Corwinoid
06-12-2005, 08:39 AM
Alright, to really appreciate why I love this so much, you probably need to hear it... so I threw it up on my dmusic site as Cool Scuff (http://corwinoid.dmusic.com).

We were playing a show up in malibu, and during the sound check my lead guitarist palmed over the neck with her left hand, and started drumming on the neck of the guitar, two handed. Came up with a very percussive sound... was the first time I'd ever seen anybody do this.

I was lucky enough to have a recorder on the channel at the time, and I like dove across the control room to hit record, nothing was set and we weren't really ready, so the levels aren't great (you might need to turn it up a bit).

In the recording she ****s up right about the 50s mark... but still pretty incredible. You can barely hear it in the recording, but the high noise is her lining up harmonics on her left as she's playing this rhythm.

So, I couldn't get the levels right, and ended up not recording the actual show. She played this as a fill (and nailed it) over a drum solo to end the show. When she had the distortion on... very crazy, very ****ing cool. Absolutely incredible.

I'm not sure drumming on your neck is exactly good for your guitar... but wtf, it sounds cool.

Edit: In retrospect--this would probably be even cooler in an open tuning.

MonkeyAteMySoul
06-12-2005, 09:39 AM
check out www.freakguitar.com this guy is my favourite guitarist and he's a master of this kind of thing, especially his impresive work with harmonics

Freepower
06-12-2005, 09:59 AM
Cor, i think shes a bettencourt fan, thats pretty nice - he does it slightly better, does a great horse impersonation!


Lessee, heres one i've been using today, find fingerings for chords entirely made of harmonics.

slash_pwns
06-12-2005, 10:07 AM
Heres what I was doind w/ your crazy idea:

4/4
Gtr I
|-17-16-17-13-17-12-17----17----17-------------------------------------------|
|----------------------15----13----------15----17-15-17-13-17----17----17----|
|----------------------------------16-17----17----------------16----14-------|
|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|


7/8
|-------------------------------------------------------------12----|
|----17----------------------------------------------------13-------|
|-13-------------16-17-16-17-14-17-13-17----17----17----14----------|
|-------16----18-------------------------16----15----14-------------|
|----------19-------------------------------------------------------|
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|


4/4
|-13-------12-13----------12-13----------------12----16-----------------12----|
|-------13-------13----13-------13----------12----12----12-----------12-------|
|----14-------------14-------------14----13----------------13-----13----------|
|-------------------------------------14----------------------14--------------|
|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------|

120bpm, tripelets throughout.

I used as part of a solo for one of my songs :D

EDIT: Fixed somewhat, but the bars need to be shown too! :p:

Corwinoid
06-12-2005, 10:14 AM
slash, clean up the bloody tab!

Free, which bettencourt? ;)

slash_pwns
06-12-2005, 10:17 AM
^Ouch. Will do.

He might be talking about Nuno? I wouldnt know :p:

Freepower
06-12-2005, 12:47 PM
lol, "Hi, im Nuno. Bettencourt, in case you get confused with all those other nunos out there..."

Great line from the man himself.

Anyway, was just playing there, can i stress playing in altered tuning should be essential for all guitarists? Just playing in drop D, got some nice heavy prog metal, got a beautiful japanese piece, did a little bach, then moved on to Van Halen style 80s cheese.

Who says its just for punks and slipknot wannabes?

Another thing, dont ignore other instruments! Watching Mike Portnoys "Progressive Drum Concepts" gave me all kinds of ideas - even if i cant do a 32nd note filll alternating feet and hands, im sure that if i alternated left hand and right when playing touchstyle i could (once i get my touchstyle chops of doom ;) ).

Hence, slap guitar - Cor's lead drummer/guitarist, all that stuff.

pavan
06-12-2005, 12:52 PM
i just read somehwere that you could make your power-chords thicker by adding a 2nd to them...... and they do !

slash_pwns
06-12-2005, 12:56 PM
^sus2? :p:

While playing a D5 open in drop D and moving around chords underneath w/ mucho distortion you get a nice wall of sound :D


D D5 E11 Dsus2 D7sus2 Dm Dm6 Dmaj7
|---------------------------------14----|
|-7--10--9--10-----5-----10--12---14----|
|-7---7--9---9-----5-----10--10---14----|
|-0---0--0---0-----0------0---0---12----|
|-0---0--0---0-----0------0---0----0----|
|-0---0--0---0-----0------0---0----0----|

Freepower
06-13-2005, 09:09 AM
Something to try again, tonewise, try really, really extreme distortion, its a lot of fun, and as long as you keep things simple, the riffs can be awesome....

And try and get new flavours out of old scales - i wrote "little birdy" i my dmusic using mostly the pentatonic minor - does it sound traditional? **** no! In fact, if you look closely, you'll hear plenty of harmonics as pedal tones and some weird harmonic arps.

pavan
06-13-2005, 12:31 PM
Try extreme distortion, this time tune your 6th and 4th to a low C and 5th to F.

WindJammer
06-17-2005, 11:49 AM
Anything that involves quartal harmony... It concentrates on the P4, P5, m7, M2 intervals... the term "quintal harmony" is sometimes applied to music favoring the P5.

Major and minor triads are used to a far smaller degree...

Intervals of higher dissonance-- m2, M7, m9, tritone... are not part of pure quartal harmony; in works that feature quartal harmony they appear in places where a higher level of tension is required.

Quartal sounds can be dervied from a pent. scale obtained by stacking fourths and fifth-- for example, B-E-A-D-G.

What does this yield? The third mode of the major pentatonic scale.

There's a few tips if you're into Asian or Middle Eastern music.

WindJammer
06-17-2005, 11:59 AM
One more nifty thing about notes themselves:

Try making weird cells... like these:

1. ascending semitone followed by descending tone
2. ascending tone followed by descending semitone
3. descending tone followed by ascending semitone
4. descending semitone followed by ascending tone

All nifty...

biohazardous59
06-17-2005, 09:54 PM
i dont know man

derek trucks plays the ragas on his guitar, check that **** out

WindJammer
06-17-2005, 10:28 PM
Victor Wooten was decent at slapping with a drumstick at a show of his that I saw. His guitarist also had a ton of delay and flange on while tapping which was cool and very ethereal.

ThisPerishedMin
06-17-2005, 10:48 PM
chorus + wah mixed with natural and pinch harmonics (the pinchs are really hard to pull off with no distortion but so worth it for the sound) and the ocasional open note can render some really crazy surreal sonds. i can waste away a half an hour playing around doing that...built around a main concept/riff....quite the amazing powerful thing if done creatively i think.