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danyal92 12-17-2012 04:37 PM

transcribing
 
when transcribing do u first figure out the key of the song? can you figure out the key just by listening to it? or is the key figured out for improvisation. how do i go about transcribing im very confused.

primusfan 12-17-2012 04:41 PM

transcribe the root motion/chords first. then transcribe the melody/solo. you can do it the other way. but I think the chords first helps narrow down the melody/solo notes if you're having difficulty with that at first.

I had a teacher who said narrow it down to the bass notes and melody notes. then fill in te chords in between if you're having difficulty hearing the changes.

macashmack 12-17-2012 04:44 PM

Yes I figure out the key first. You should be able to hear the tonic note, it sounds the most "Sweet" for lack of a better way to explain it.
When you start transcribing start by working out short melody lines. Then start wiring on chords. I don't actually transcribe to work on my ear i find singing works my ear better than transcribing. I transcribe when i want to figure out a specific lick or just want to learn a song. Why do you want to transcribe?

danyal92 12-17-2012 05:00 PM

i basically want to train my ear to figure out songs without the use of tabs

joeythedrummer 12-17-2012 05:05 PM

Think of it this way. A particular note is the same no matter what key it is in, so technically, you can transcribe a song without ever knowing the key. What the key does for you is help you to guess what a note might be. Even a trained musician might have difficulty identifying whether a note is a G or a G# without a reference. The key of a song gives us that reference to make the transcription a little easier.

Hope that helps :)

fanapathy 12-17-2012 05:40 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeythedrummer
Think of it this way. A particular note is the same no matter what key it is in, so technically, you can transcribe a song without ever knowing the key.


I can testify to this

When transcribing, the first thing I do is to find the lowest note or chord that's being used in the song. It is useful as a reference so that I know which tuning I can(not) use or which one is most likely used in the song. I admittedly transcribe without knowing the key ;) But you can probably be much more effective if you do.
Transcribing the bass early is very useful. Because of harmonies and what not, depending on the song it's sometimes hard to tell which root notes of chords are used, and generally the bass line will give you a great idea of what's going on

mdc 12-17-2012 05:53 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by danyal92
i basically want to train my ear to figure out songs without the use of tabs

What songs are you working on?

danyal92 12-17-2012 05:56 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdc
What songs are you working on?


well my ear training is basically zero so i thought id start of by simple stuff like


mdc 12-17-2012 06:03 PM

... and how are you getting on with that? Any ideas on the key and chord progression yet?

danyal92 12-17-2012 06:11 PM

i basically figured out the lead dont know if im correct. i think its in the key of G. i slide from the 12th of the G string as the opening note.

mdc 12-17-2012 06:12 PM

Does the tonality of the key sound major or minor? G is correct.

danyal92 12-17-2012 06:30 PM

thats where im stuck. i dnt know if its major or minor.

mdc 12-17-2012 06:39 PM

Play a Gmin chord where it occurs in the song, i.e the very beginning and again at 7 secs (just to get you started.

Now play a G major chord in the same places.

Which one sounds better?

Here's a little tip:

When transcribing the melody, listen to it in small chunks, then hit pause. If you can sing it back perfectly, both pitch and rhythm, then you'll be able to play it perfectly.... just find the notes on the neck.

If you can sing it, you can play it. Cuz it means you have it internalized, and that is what's important.

danyal92 12-17-2012 06:53 PM

u were able to figure out the key of G just by listening to it?

mdc 12-17-2012 07:03 PM

Yes. :shrug:

danyal92 12-17-2012 07:29 PM

how do u do that? am i on the right path and will more practice make my ear as good as yours?

mdc 12-17-2012 07:55 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by danyal92
how do u do that? am i on the right path and will more practice make my ear as good as yours?

You don't need a good ear to work out the key of a song like that. No offense. S'just that comment of yours is a bit too much sugar for me! :o

Sure, I guess it's hard for some, I mean... dunno, man. Guess it's "in the genes" or something.

Believe me, though, there's some hard stuff out there.

macashmack 12-17-2012 08:19 PM

mdc do you have PP? Or just really good tonal memory? You were able to hear G without checking on a tuner?
OP, that song is a good start. Its easy but it's melodic. :)

mdc 12-17-2012 08:40 PM

No, just relative pitch. This is why transcribing real music (as opposed to exercises) is so good for the ear.

The more you transcribe, you'll digest/assimilate music in larger chunks (what you labelled as tonal memory I guess), as your ear develops.

Unless you're Danny Gatton.

macashmack 12-17-2012 09:33 PM

So basically, you could hear it was in G because you transcribed and memorized music in G and (due to the Levitin effect) you could hear it was in the same key as those songs?
Thats cool. I can hear when songs are in Db sometimes. But only sometimes.


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