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-   -   Small Tube amp dilemma (http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1587650)

Stijnson 02-11-2013 06:33 AM

Small Tube Amp but need high-gain!
 
Greetings,

I have a dilemma regarding my next purchase in my pursuit of tone. I know the old, small, high gain tube amp threads are getting boring, but my case is slightly different.
I already own a small tube amp, it's a Fender Vibro Champ 77' silverface. So the old model.
A 7 watt all tube, one channel, beautiful sounding amp. But it only really does cleans, slightly overdriven if pushed really hard. Since this amp was a heritage gift I wont sell it.
But I play mostly high gain stuff, most kinds of metal, some shred stuff, you know...
So I've been running a GT-8 straight into it, (it has no FX loop) which is pretty ok, the fact that the amp is all tube definitley makes it the GT-8 sound much warmer. But playing dynamics are basically non existent with it, none of this beautiful, breaking up overdrive either.

So forever I've been wondering if to buy another amp which can satisfy those needs, I'm leaning mostly to the 6505+ 112, I know it can get the gain I need from it, and I already have a nice amp for cleans so. I am mostly a home player, but would like to have something I could maybe gig with, considering I am looking for a band.

But I'm also considering maybe running a very good pedal in front of the amp to give it the gain and overdrive I need, it would be cheaper than a new amp, so my budget is quite high considering a pedal. I heard a demo of that carl-martin Plexitone for example, and I love the sound of that. It doesnt need to be extremely high-gain, I have an EMG equipped guitar. I do love smooth, high gain, saturated lead sounds, and I play alot of high gain metal, but also really love that overdriven marshall esque sound for leads. So I still need some versatality.

Sorry I'm rambling on! Just wanted to explain my situation.
Have you guys got any suggestions? Would it just be better to buy a new amp?
Thanks in advance!

As for providing info:
Budget: about 600 euros
Genre: mostly metal, shred
New or used: Probably new, smaller choice in 2nd hand market
Home or gig: Mostly home, gigs possibly someday
Closest city: Stockholm
Current gear: Jackson soloist, Fender 77' vibro champ, Boss Gt-8

c0rn1x 02-11-2013 07:50 AM

Orange Dark Terror Head will suit you well, i will probably get one, costs about 500 Euros NEW, its a 15Watt / switchable 7 Watt Tube Amp with very high gain suitable for metal, but has very nice cleans as well. Check out some demos on youtube to get an idea :)

It has a FX Loop for your GT-8 as well, usually all Orange Terror do not have a FX Loop, so its a great deal

TheNameOfNoone 02-11-2013 09:23 AM

http://www.mesaboogie.com/Product_I...win/v-twin.html

This one might be a little expensive, but it's up to you.

Stijnson 02-11-2013 09:29 AM

Thanks for the replies guys!
c0rn1x, i have contemplated them too. But i think i'd rather go with either a combo or a good pedal as i mentioned. Getting the Orange would imply me to also buy a cab. Ofcourse having the gt-8 already would also make it nice to buy an amp with Fx loop so i can keep using that for effects.

That pedal looks good! ill check some sound clips. Thanx. So would tube driven pedals work better than SS pedals together with my amp?

festivalinhell 02-11-2013 11:09 AM

Try getting an eq pedal. If you boost the treble end of the signal and use a good high gain distortion it should sound good. I play a 68 Sunn Sorado through a 4x12 cabinet and can get any tone i want if i tweak my effects properly. Originally the Sorado was a bass head but i am using it for guitar so you would expect creamy thick sound. I can get that by dialing back the treble control but for my uses an eq and proper distortion does a perfectly fine job for that high gain stuff. When was the last time it was serviced. It could also be an issue of lossy signal due to bad tubes. Are you losing volume or anything like that?

Dave_Mc 02-11-2013 12:15 PM

just get the 6505

Blktiger0 02-11-2013 01:13 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_Mc
just get the 6505


+311

siddiq4321 02-11-2013 01:29 PM

Laney lc15, laney lv series-tube emiluting, SS with a tone bone/blackstar tube dist pedals.

TheNameOfNoone 02-11-2013 02:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by festivalinhell
Try getting an eq pedal. If you boost the treble end of the signal and use a good high gain distortion it should sound good. I play a 68 Sunn Sorado through a 4x12 cabinet and can get any tone i want if i tweak my effects properly. Originally the Sorado was a bass head but i am using it for guitar so you would expect creamy thick sound. I can get that by dialing back the treble control but for my uses an eq and proper distortion does a perfectly fine job for that high gain stuff. When was the last time it was serviced. It could also be an issue of lossy signal due to bad tubes. Are you losing volume or anything like that?


He said it's one-channel amp, it doesn't have an overdrive channel.

randomguy2000 02-11-2013 02:20 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by siddiq4321
Laney lc15, laney lv series-tube emiluting, SS with a tone bone/blackstar tube dist pedals.

er....
don't do that.

Dave_Mc 02-11-2013 03:45 PM

^ +1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blktiger0
+311


:cheers:

RStrat 02-11-2013 04:37 PM

Assuming you're looking for a small amp (the title of this thread), I wouldn't recommend the 6505+.

I don't really know what's available in Britain in terms of high gain and small tube amps.

:/

Stijnson 02-12-2013 06:16 AM

Thanks for the replies guys. The 6505 does seem to be the most logical choice ofcourse, it's and upgrade in many ways, distortion/gain wise, bigger speaker, more volume, has an fx loop for my gt-8, although I remember reading the fx loop was a little noisy?
But I've been youtubing all night mostly listening to these wampler pedals, and damn they do sound good though. Anyone have real life experience with these (eg. the Triple Wreck?)

It's still like half the cost of the amp. And currently being slightly poor that becomes important.
I'm just getting sick of the digital sound, I dont know if anyone has ever had that feeling where you've been hearing your own tone for so long you start to think it's good, then when you hear other 'real' tone you realize your digital tone sucks!

Rstrat: the amp doesnt have to be small, preferably combo though. But my amp is small :P Oh and I live in Sweden, selection of high gain amps in shops here is quite minimal.

Good ol' GAS, fun and confusing!

TheNameOfNoone 02-12-2013 09:57 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stijnson
I'm just getting sick of the digital sound, I dont know if anyone has ever had that feeling where you've been hearing your own tone for so long you start to think it's good, then when you hear other 'real' tone you realize your digital tone sucks!

Welcome to the world of analog purists, dude. Enjoy your trip.

Arby911 02-12-2013 11:24 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNameOfNoone
Welcome to the world of analog purists cork-sniffing, self indulgent placebo-seeking tone snobs, dude. Enjoy your trip.


FTFY.

TheNameOfNoone 02-12-2013 12:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arby911
FTFY.


Can you tell me the name of any digital processing station that sounds better than 6505 or Twin Reverb.
You can't? Then stop acting like we are wrong.
You can? Then, what are you waiting for?

Maineguitarist 02-12-2013 12:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by c0rn1x
Orange Dark Terror Head will suit you well, i will probably get one, costs about 500 Euros NEW, its a 15Watt / switchable 7 Watt Tube Amp with very high gain suitable for metal, but has very nice cleans as well. Check out some demos on youtube to get an idea :)

It has a FX Loop for your GT-8 as well, usually all Orange Terror do not have a FX Loop, so its a great deal

+1 tried the dark terror myself. It made me wish I had 700 USD on me at the time. It is awesome

Arby911 02-12-2013 12:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNameOfNoone
Can you tell me the name of any digital processing station that sounds better than 6505 or Twin Reverb.
You can't? Then stop acting like we are wrong.
You can? Then, what are you waiting for?


Well, "Better" is subjective, but in a blind test against an Axe FXII, how many could tell the difference? Could you? Are you sure?

How about a Kemper Profiling amp?

Again, are you sure?

Because people that have owned both say no, especially against the Kemper.

"Digital sucks" is a kneejerk reaction that isn't always the case, and is becoming less the case every day.

Dave_Mc 02-12-2013 02:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RStrat
Assuming you're looking for a small amp (the title of this thread), I wouldn't recommend the 6505+.

I don't really know what's available in Britain in terms of high gain and small tube amps.

:/


assuming he's looking for a high gain amp, though (not the title, but in the OP) i wouldn't really be looking at low wattage amps, either. you're massively narrowing down your options for debatable (at best) gains.

Offworld92 02-12-2013 10:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arby911
Well, "Better" is subjective, but in a blind test against an Axe FXII, how many could tell the difference? Could you? Are you sure?

How about a Kemper Profiling amp?

Again, are you sure?

Because people that have owned both say no, especially against the Kemper.

"Digital sucks" is a kneejerk reaction that isn't always the case, and is becoming less the case every day.


Come on now.... I'm pretty sure that it's pretty safe to say that the average Joe isn't looking at or considering a Kemper or a Fractal. There's no need to be pedantic...



@TS if you're planning on playing with other people, I'd honestly throw the thought of a dirt pedal through your amp out the window. A lot of the "oomph" of a beastly metal tone comes from the beastly power section in an amp specifically designed for that - IE, the exact opposite of your amp's design. A little 7W won't cut it at all compared to, just for instance, a 6505. The amp designed for metal will tear the dirt pedal into a little Fender to shreds.


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