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-   -   6505/5150 vs 5150 II/6505+ Tonal Differences (http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1588773)

rlheart 02-18-2013 03:42 AM

6505/5150 vs 5150 II/6505+ Tonal Differences
 
I know the tonal and aethestic differences between these two amps (5150 has more low mids and is more aggressive. 5150 II has an extra preamp tube, is brighter and has more upper mids; better cleans due to the extra EQ).

I cannot however, find a sound comparison between the two so I can actually hear it with my own ears.

The only 6505 I was able to find in my area was messed up (I pointed this out to the store owner and he sent it back to Peavey; he said it looks to be about 3 weeks before they'll get it back or get a new one). They had a 5150 II there as well. I was hoping to A/B them but couldn't. Every other store in my area only has the 6505+ (or in the case of the store I was at originally, a 5150 II; same thing so I'm still SOL in that regard).

Can somebody who owns both a 5150 and a 5150 II A/B the lead channels with the same settings for each amp?

I have looked everywhere for a good comparison and cannot find one. The closest one I found was a 5150 vs 5150 II vs 5150 III but the 5150 II was modded to 5150 specs, so it wasn't really helpful in that regard.

Also, I'm fully aware of the clips MatrixClaw has. The 5150 clip is louder than the 5150 II clip, so it sounds a lot better to my ears, but I find it to be rather unfair because it sounds so much louder.

Also, yes I am aware of tonefinder.com.

I'm hoping to have a NAD fairly soon here, as my 6505+ 112 combo is just too heavy and big for easy transport (heavy I can handle, but it's huge on top of it. My 4x12 cab I have is easier to transport than that combo.) so I'm looking to physically downsize to a head.

Thanks everyone!

Offworld92 02-18-2013 04:03 AM

Have you seen this video?



:shrug:

rlheart 02-18-2013 04:10 AM

Yes I have.

It's not miced, and he's standing in front of the amp heads at the end so you can't tell if the settings are the same or not.

Thanks for trying though man. If that one at the store wasn't broken I'd have this answered by now.

Offworld92 02-18-2013 04:12 AM

You really have to play them yourself anyway. You're already well aware of the basic differences between the two - at this point anything we say won't really matter. You have to stand in front of them and see which you prefer anyway.

You don't necessarily have to A/B them though. Assuming the different stores aren't a PITA to get to, and you're using the same guitar, it shouldn't matter if they're right next to each other or not. Take a couple trips and go back and forth a couple times if you have to.

Assuming you don't have short term memory loss, that is.

rlheart 02-18-2013 05:06 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Offworld92
You really have to play them yourself anyway. You're already well aware of the basic differences between the two - at this point anything we say won't really matter. You have to stand in front of them and see which you prefer anyway.

You don't necessarily have to A/B them though. Assuming the different stores aren't a PITA to get to, and you're using the same guitar, it shouldn't matter if they're right next to each other or not. Take a couple trips and go back and forth a couple times if you have to.

Assuming you don't have short term memory loss, that is.


I checked all of the guitar centers in my area (including ones that are over an hour away) and they're all carrying the plus.

For audio clips I was hoping for an A/B situation, and if this store didn't have a broken one I could have an easy answer.

TL;DR: Nobody seems to carry a regular 6505 anymore, not in my area at least.

KailM 02-18-2013 08:40 AM

I can't help you much, because I'm in the same boat; I've never seen an original 5150 or 6505, but have played the + version extensively. I'll be watching this thread closely. :cheers:

Judging by what people say and certain albums that used the standard 5150/6505, I think I'd prefer that one. However, I doubt you'd be disappointed with either one. The + is still one badass amp...

BoneAndDream 02-18-2013 12:40 PM

if you want a smoother distortion get the II/+

if you want a grindier more ballsy distortion get the regular version


proud 6505 owner here

R45VT 02-18-2013 12:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoneAndDream
if you want a smoother distortion get the II/+

if you want a grindier more ballsy distortion get the regular version


proud 6505 owner here


5150/6505 has more balls.

rlheart 02-18-2013 02:29 PM

I think you guys are missing the point.

It's absolutely ridiculous that I can find a mic'd amp shootout tone comparison between just about everything (dual rec vs 6505, marshall jcm800 vs ENGL, etc.) except for the 6505/5150 vs 6505+/5150 II.

These are two of the most popular metal amps ever made yet you can't find this anywhere.

Saying the 6505 has more balls doesn't mean anything if I can't hear it in comparison to the one I'm used to.

I know the difference between the two; I want to actually hear it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KailM
I can't help you much, because I'm in the same boat; I've never seen an original 5150 or 6505, but have played the + version extensively. I'll be watching this thread closely. :cheers:

Judging by what people say and certain albums that used the standard 5150/6505, I think I'd prefer that one. However, I doubt you'd be disappointed with either one. The + is still one badass amp...


lol, we literally are in the same boat. From what I've heard I think I'll prefer the original as well, but I'm very hesitant to plunk down my tax return on an amp that I've never played and sounds better to me in theory alone.

dkunick 02-18-2013 04:04 PM

You could always try this: http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/foru...d.php?t=1530322

So much easier to use the head alone with either cab, and as you probably know it sounds quite good thru a 412.

BoneAndDream 02-18-2013 04:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rlheart
I think I'll prefer the original as well, but I'm very hesitant to plunk down my tax return on an amp that I've never played and sounds better to me in theory alone.



lol, that's what i did. i had never played my 6505 before i ordered it from an out-of-state GC because the one i can get to only has the +. i took the risk and i'm quite happy i did.

Robbgnarly 02-18-2013 05:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rlheart
I think you guys are missing the point.

It's absolutely ridiculous that I can find a mic'd amp shootout tone comparison between just about everything (dual rec vs 6505, marshall jcm800 vs ENGL, etc.) except for the 6505/5150 vs 6505+/5150 II.

These are two of the most popular metal amps ever made yet you can't find this anywhere.

Saying the 6505 has more balls doesn't mean anything if I can't hear it in comparison to the one I'm used to.

I know the difference between the two; I want to actually hear it.

It is not ridiculous just because you want something and it is not available :shrug:
Like has been said the 5150/5150II are very similar. the 5150 being a little more raw and ballsy in tone. The 5150II has a little smother gain and a better clean ch. thats about the extent of it.

I don't think you can go wrong either way honestly if your after that 5150 type of sound.

BoneAndDream 02-18-2013 08:07 PM

if you do end up getting the 5150/6505 experiment with both channels EXTENSIVELY. everybody and their brother uses the red channel for metal, so i was originally just following in that line but i've found the green is more brutal. even with no boost.

rlheart 02-22-2013 07:37 PM

Just an update.

I've decided I'm going to buy both a 5150/6505 and a 5150 II/6505+ with my combined paycheck + tax refund (found a 6505 for $500 and a 5150 II for $650. My budget was about $1200 so I'm getting both). I'm also about to put a OS Rectifier cab on layaway (I have a cab, but it honestly sucks).

Once I get all three together and find a good mic placement I'll reamp them at the same settings (or if I can't figure out reamping, I'll just do the same cover twice or something).

So, unless something changes (car wreck, tax refund gets refused or the like) expect a decent amp comparison thing to show up soon from me.

Will keep you guys posted.

KailM 02-22-2013 08:14 PM

^^ I'll look forward to it! :cheers:

evmac 02-22-2013 08:42 PM

I don't have any experience doing this, but the slight differences between the two could probably just be compensated for with a good EQ pedal or just the onboard EQ. They aren't that different that they couldn't be tweaked to sound very similar if not identical IMO. It's just nitpicking at this point.

Robbgnarly 02-22-2013 08:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by evmac
I don't have any experience doing this, but the slight differences between the two could probably just be compensated for with a good EQ pedal or just the onboard EQ. They aren't that different that they couldn't be tweaked to sound very similar if not identical IMO. It's just nitpicking at this point.

+1
They will sound a little diffrent with the exact same settings, but if you EQ to sound and not the actual same dial settings you'll probably never know which is which.

MatrixClaw 02-23-2013 09:20 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rlheart
Also, I'm fully aware of the clips MatrixClaw has. The 5150 clip is louder than the 5150 II clip, so it sounds a lot better to my ears, but I find it to be rather unfair because it sounds so much louder.

I've been meaning to remaster all those tracks so they're more accurate. I'll see if I still have them later and get them all at similar volumes.

Either way though, none of my clips were definitely not dialed in with the same EQ settings, they were dialed in to where I thought they sounded best :shrug:

That being said, I wouldn't say the 6505+ is a brighter amp, nor does it have more upper mids. It's smoother, which usually means it's darker and has more low mids. I've still yet to find an amp (aside from the 2 channel Recto) that I thought justified the increased price tag over my 5150, though.



*edit* Uploaded "remastered" tracks of all the files I could find here:

https://soundcloud.com/matrixclaw/sets/tone-tests ;)

rlheart 03-03-2013 12:24 AM

Awesome MatrixClaw! Thanks for doing that!

Also, an update: Got the 6505 today ($500; will be doing a NAD soon)

Working on the cab next, then a 6505+/5150 II

madmax33096 03-03-2013 01:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by KailM
I can't help you much, because I'm in the same boat; I've never seen an original 5150 or 6505, but have played the + version extensively. I'll be watching this thread closely. :cheers:

Judging by what people say and certain albums that used the standard 5150/6505, I think I'd prefer that one. However, I doubt you'd be disappointed with either one. The + is still one badass amp...

I've had the pleasure of playing an Original 5150, not the II version, and it sounded great, but it was a little messed up as well. It didn't stay in the store long. It was gone within the week it had arrived. Even though they're discontinued, they still sell like hotcakes.


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