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Old 12-17-2013, 08:07 PM   #141
Tyson2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrisHQ
As long as you can hit the note, it does not have to be in a musical context.
When people post vocal-ranges on youtube or other places, they obviously only use notes from songs or other forms of media.
"Musically" is so subjective that discussing if a note is used musically or not, is not worth it

The reason I posted was because posts like this one:
"Mine would be F2-E6, with fry I can get down to maybe B1 and Falsetto somewhere in the 7th octave."

Does not really make any sense. Either something weird is going on, or this person is something very special.
I take the F2-E6 as being able to hit from F2 to E6 by mixing, which for males is simply not possible.
Everything is debateable though, since some would argue that even A5's are purely falsetto. What people often refer to as "head-voice" is in fact just a mix between modal voice and falsetto, the higher you go in pitch the more falsetto you apply, which is why most high-notes can be difficult to distinguish.


yeah...I think part of the discrepancy might be in different nomenclature for the octaves, as i know it differs around the world, but I think a lot of people just don't know what they are talking about.

Speaking of which, head voice is not mixing modal voice and falsetto. falsetto is a completely different vocal mechanism than the modal voice. "chest voice" and "head voice" are just references vocalists use to describe how they are approaching a note with regard to their passagi. head voice still uses the vocal chords in their entirety, whereas falsetto "zippers" the chords together, with only the very tips of them vibrating, it is a different production method entirely.

and for pretty much any male other than a countertenor or some other rare variation (sopranista or something), an A5 is not going to be hit modally. I'm a classically trained leggiero tenor and my usable range caps off at an E5, and even that is stretching it (I probably wouldn't include more than 1 to 2 of those in a set). The highest written demanded note in classical music is an optional ending F5, and it is very rare to see that done by any tenor outside of a recording session, it is almost never performed that way live. I can hit it and up to the F#, but I would never take it into performance because it sounds awful. Thats part of the reason I said a note shouldn't be considered a part of someones "range" if they can touch it, but can't sing it. It is useless to a performer if it doesn't sound good.

Last edited by Tyson2011 : 12-17-2013 at 08:10 PM.
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Old 12-18-2013, 04:27 AM   #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyson2011
yeah...I think part of the discrepancy might be in different nomenclature for the octaves, as i know it differs around the world, but I think a lot of people just don't know what they are talking about.


Reminds me of a friend of mine who keeps convincing me that middle C is C1 and none other, because that's what his music teachers here in Slovenia said, and won't hear me when I say people place it differently in other parts of the world. .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyson2011
and for pretty much any male other than a countertenor or some other rare variation (sopranista or something), an A5 is not going to be hit modally. I'm a classically trained leggiero tenor and my usable range caps off at an E5, and even that is stretching it (I probably wouldn't include more than 1 to 2 of those in a set).


That is assuming that every person's vocal range fits their vocal type like a glove. A dramatic baritone, for example, might have just his G2-A4 "standard" range, much like the leggero tenor's standard of a C3-D#5. But we see enough singers every day who have wider ranges than their vocal types dictate.
Tenors have sung notes that we normally hear basses singing before, and vice versa. Enough males have, after completely undergoing puberty (and then some years after), retained ranges that are borderline what has on this thread been described as "impossible" to prove otherwise. You could say these singers have anomalies on their vocal folds that enable them such wide ranges, or that there is too few of them to use them as part of discussion, but they are there nonetheless. As I understood, head voice is to be considered part of one's modal register, so yeah...
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Old 12-18-2013, 05:15 AM   #143
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Old 12-18-2013, 05:38 AM   #144
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Bass 2/ Almost Oktavist: I can pretty consistently hit an A#1 or sometimes an A1, and I go up to a D3 in natural voice. I haven't bothered to measure my falsetto but it probably ranges into high baritone/low tenor.
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Old 12-18-2013, 09:49 AM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Navi_96
Reminds me of a friend of mine who keeps convincing me that middle C is C1 and none other, because that's what his music teachers here in Slovenia said, and won't hear me when I say people place it differently in other parts of the world. .



That is assuming that every person's vocal range fits their vocal type like a glove. A dramatic baritone, for example, might have just his G2-A4 "standard" range, much like the leggero tenor's standard of a C3-D#5. But we see enough singers every day who have wider ranges than their vocal types dictate.
Tenors have sung notes that we normally hear basses singing before, and vice versa. Enough males have, after completely undergoing puberty (and then some years after), retained ranges that are borderline what has on this thread been described as "impossible" to prove otherwise. You could say these singers have anomalies on their vocal folds that enable them such wide ranges, or that there is too few of them to use them as part of discussion, but they are there nonetheless. As I understood, head voice is to be considered part of one's modal register, so yeah...


Those kinds of ranges are anomalies as you have mentioned....and I think we have just a few too many of them in this thread for them to be accurate
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Old 12-18-2013, 10:45 AM   #146
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Naah, I also think many posts weren't accurate - to put it gently, but one or two of these peeps just might have a grasp over the many octaves they lay claim upon

Last edited by Navi_96 : 12-18-2013 at 03:19 PM.
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Old 12-18-2013, 02:13 PM   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyson2011
Speaking of which, head voice is not mixing modal voice and falsetto. falsetto is a completely different vocal mechanism than the modal voice. "chest voice" and "head voice" are just references vocalists use to describe how they are approaching a note with regard to their passagi. head voice still uses the vocal chords in their entirety, whereas falsetto "zippers" the chords together, with only the very tips of them vibrating, it is a different production method entirely.

I guess that depends on how you think of the terms "chest" and "head voice".
I never use those terms myself, and neither does any of the singers I know. To us both head-voice and chest voice would fit the category I call mix.
But I believe in common use, the "chest" voice would be the standard voice that we use for speaking etc, and head-voice referring to mixing.
I've seen people on youtube claiming to show "head voice" and then falsetto, when in reality what they show are both falsetto, but with a different sound color, also referred to as mode by for instance Cathrine Sadolin.
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Old 12-18-2013, 11:15 PM   #148
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My F2-E6... The F2 is my lowest note, it can border on fry, but is full, my E6 is also full, Although much warming up is required to hit it, in most musical situations its not needed, the highest note for musical purposes I have had to hit was a G5.
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Old 12-19-2013, 08:34 AM   #149
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mastercore
My F2-E6... The F2 is my lowest note, it can border on fry, but is full, my E6 is also full, Although much warming up is required to hit it, in most musical situations its not needed, the highest note for musical purposes I have had to hit was a G5.

I assume you're male, and then E6 is impossible in modal voice.
Are you getting the octaves confused? E5 seems more likely.
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Old 12-19-2013, 03:00 PM   #150
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People could post proof and stuff, then there'd be a much more constructive thing going on...
Anyway, here's mine, as promised. First is a head voice run that goes G5-A5-B5-D5, then in falsetto A5-B5-C6-D6-E6-F6-F#6-G6, and the last two notes are a sharp G6 and a slide up to a sharp G#6 (today wasn't exactly the ideal day )

This was recorded with a dynamic mike directly onto a sound card that is integrated onto the motherboard (thank god for Cubase at least - otherwise it'd be dreadful), so the sound isn't as good and thus notes sound weaker than they actually are, especially the falsetto ones. The recording seems to omit all the "twang" in the voice, strips it down... I need better equipment. I know how the notes feel to me so all the way up to G6 they felt strong. A professional singer who helps me out with vocals also tells me I sound chunky up there, so this is not just me. The G6 also felt stronger than usual today. The recording is here:

https://soundcloud.com/kolundez/hea...setto-top-notes

Last edited by Navi_96 : 12-19-2013 at 03:04 PM.
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Old 12-19-2013, 03:30 PM   #151
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Okay. So. This was actually very useful for our discussion.
Thanks for posting those clips.
The reason for this being is that the notes you are hitting are actually a whole octave lower than what you described.
The first note is in fact a G4 and the highest note in "head-voice" which is really mixing is a D5.
The highest note in falsetto is a G#5, which some would argue not really counts since it's not really hitting the note, but just sharpening the G (since it's not totally on pitch). I know that sharpening the G makes it G#, but just because people sing flat, that doesn't mean they are actually singing a semi-tone lower consistently. That said, the G5 is definitely clear, so I'd assume you can also do the G# better
I don't know if people refer to different octaves depening on where they are from, that might be an issue, but none the less this definitely proves that there has been some miscommunication ^^
This is not an attack on you or anything, I think it's great that you wanted to post those clips
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Old 12-19-2013, 05:54 PM   #152
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Damn, you're actually right... I thought I had a whole octave more than I do. I don't know what to say. I feel like a huge idiot right now...

EDIT: it's one day later and I am not bummed out anymore... I have now a motivation to break past my current limits and get as close as I can to what I had thought I was already at! So, in time, I'm confident it will be another story. For what it's worth, I'm sorry I came out on the ignorant side in the previous posts. Wish me luck!

Last edited by Navi_96 : 12-20-2013 at 01:47 PM.
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Old 12-20-2013, 12:24 PM   #153
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this is a more recent clip of my voice, although it's improved since then too. mostly with tone, the range is the same. i have got some lower notes now and some higher. in here i'm going from Db2 to Gb5. i tried to sound like a female for some of the parts so that it sounded like different people.
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Old 12-20-2013, 04:55 PM   #154
KrisHQ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Navi_96
Damn, you're actually right... I thought I had a whole octave more than I do. I don't know what to say. I feel like a huge idiot right now...

EDIT: it's one day later and I am not bummed out anymore... I have now a motivation to break past my current limits and get as close as I can to what I had thought I was already at! So, in time, I'm confident it will be another story. For what it's worth, I'm sorry I came out on the ignorant side in the previous posts. Wish me luck!

Dont be bummed. Your range is decent.
But at some point you've got to acknowledge the fact that there are physical limitations to the voice. Males will never sing in the 6th octave using their mixed voice, but as I said, I've heard a B5 from very high tenors, so that's only a semi-tone from the C6.
That said; you can easily surpass the D5 with practice, good luck!

Blind in 1 ear:
Sounds pretty neat I love harmonies!
Just remember that your highest notes are in falsetto, therefore they are not an indication of your range
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Old 12-22-2013, 02:43 AM   #155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrisHQ
Dont be bummed. Your range is decent.
But at some point you've got to acknowledge the fact that there are physical limitations to the voice. Males will never sing in the 6th octave using their mixed voice, but as I said, I've heard a B5 from very high tenors, so that's only a semi-tone from the C6.
That said; you can easily surpass the D5 with practice, good luck!

Blind in 1 ear:
Sounds pretty neat I love harmonies!
Just remember that your highest notes are in falsetto, therefore they are not an indication of your range

actually it's vocal fry which technically means you can't go into falsetto from what i've read. you can do vocal fry throughout your whole range, they key is to back off on it and not sound like axl rose all the time. singers like bon jovi or mark farner from grand funk railroad do a more cleaner version of it. what i did was back off on it a lot, and tried to sound more like a girl so i could have different parts. i filled out the bass and baritone parts so compared to them, they probably sound like falsetto. if you listen close, you might hear that the voice is still pretty bright and strong, where as falsetto usually sounds softer and weaker.

but i'm not really going to argue that too much, i don't really count that as my full range. to be honest, i don't know where to cut off my range. i keep getting better so i just find it best to not think about it. i find it best not to think of limitations too much when singing.
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Old 12-22-2013, 04:58 PM   #156
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Originally Posted by Blind In 1 Ear
actually it's vocal fry which technically means you can't go into falsetto from what i've read. you can do vocal fry throughout your whole range, they key is to back off on it and not sound like axl rose all the time. singers like bon jovi or mark farner from grand funk railroad do a more cleaner version of it. what i did was back off on it a lot, and tried to sound more like a girl so i could have different parts. i filled out the bass and baritone parts so compared to them, they probably sound like falsetto. if you listen close, you might hear that the voice is still pretty bright and strong, where as falsetto usually sounds softer and weaker.

but i'm not really going to argue that too much, i don't really count that as my full range. to be honest, i don't know where to cut off my range. i keep getting better so i just find it best to not think about it. i find it best not to think of limitations too much when singing.

It's a common misconception that falsetto is either: "breathy", soft, weak or anything else. Falsetto can vary a lot in tone.
Those highnotes you are hitting are definitely falsetto, it's easy to hear
As for the last part:
It's great not to think about limitations. Just do your thing and practice!
Also: It doesn't really matter that much what your range is, or if you sing something in mix or falsetto, if it sounds good; it sounds good
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Old 12-29-2013, 05:24 PM   #157
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No, E6 in full voice isn't impossible, trust me. It's very possible, but I never really need to hit it. Besides its a very hard note to hit, I still never have the need to have to go past G5.
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Old 12-29-2013, 07:25 PM   #158
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No, E6 in full voice isn't impossible, trust me. It's very possible, but I never really need to hit it. Besides its a very hard note to hit, I still never have the need to have to go past G5.

I'm gonna need some evidence on that claim.
Until then, it's still not possible.
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Old 01-10-2014, 01:25 AM   #159
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Low E string on a standard tuned guitar to Soprano C, I once made it up to Soprano D, but it wasn't fun...and useless. Most of my vocal range is just there to impress people, my usable vocal range is the octave and a half before Tenor C, anything else is just....Spencer Sotelo trickery.
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