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Old 12-28-2012, 08:26 AM   #41
chronowarp
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lol. this really isn't a path you want to walk down, man. believe me.

The issue to me is that, like many others on this board, you assume an authoritarian position on any subject that you have an opinion - that's an issue. You shouldn't be talking to me like you're in a position of authority, because your playing ability, credentials, and musical knowledge just don't warrant it. I wouldn't even say they warrant you addressing me as an equal, but I'm not a big enough dick to even take it there on my worst day.

To be safe, I dispense advice and opinions as if the person I am talking to is at a similar level of understanding and musical development, even though that's rarely the case on an internet music forum. You'd be amazed how much mileage you get out of that.

Would you spew that "different view, ergo deficient" bullshit in a real life interaction with a musician you were barely acquainted with? Nah, I don't think so. You wouldn't even dream to be that condescending, because you'd be burning bridges left and right. So please don't tell me you're giving [me] solutions.

You're misunderstanding my point, because you're too egotistical to ask a question or engage in a discussion to clarify and uncover meaningful facts about the position.
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Last edited by chronowarp : 12-28-2012 at 08:28 AM.
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Old 12-28-2012, 09:48 AM   #42
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^^^ I find it highly amusing that you say you treat people with a similar level of respect when your first answer to me was "lol are you being for serious", then seek to attack the credentials of someone you don't know.

You're looking for an answer that simply affirms your point of view. The answer you're looking for is "there is no way you'll get a full sound without a second guitarist".

So find a second guitarist.

Otherwise my opinions come from experience, not an authoritarian viewpoint. This isn't condescending, it's advice.
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:26 PM   #43
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I find it amusing too. Unfortunately, for you, it doesn't change the validity of anything that I said.

Based on your misrepresentation of my point, again, I'm left with few options other than assuming that you have horrible reading comprehension skills. I don't need an answer that affirms my view, I know how valid my view is in the context we're talking about.

The simple fact is that you can't always reconcile not having a second guitar player in a variety of styles of music that built around a specific instrumentation. This has nothing to do with "LOL U SUCK GET A BTTER DRUMMER HEHE". It's just a ****ing fact.
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Last edited by chronowarp : 12-28-2012 at 05:29 PM.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:05 PM   #44
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The point that you're missing is that there is no "specific instrumentation" in this circumstance, it's an original band. We're not working off sheet music where it's actually required, it's a situation where you can do whatever you want.

So can you get a certain sound with only two guitarists? Sure.
Do you NEED that second guitarist for your band because you play x-core? Nope.

We can see many bands in many different genres with only one guitarist, the fact that "metal", "post" or "core" feature in the name of the sub-genre does not designate the requirement for two guitarists. My original argument is that when many bands have two guitarists, there's no good reason for having the second present, as they play the same thing the whole way through.

When a lot of people miss that second guitarist, what they're really missing is something filling in the sound when they do solos. If there's nothing filling it in, arrange the existing instruments better, fatten up your tone, change your approach to solos. The truth is that if it still sounds empty with the drums and bass present, it'll still be missing a quality (ie. the driving bass quality) when you add the second guitarist.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:13 PM   #45
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That's not even the point. Stylistically, there is a specific instrumentation that has historically become the standard for a variety of subgenres of rock music. There are plenty of situations where one guitar player will work fine, and many where it will be a hindrance that isn't going to be made up just by you being SUPER AWEOZMEZZ BEST DRUMEMR EVER FILL DA SPACE WID DA CYMBAL.

If he's starting or planning on starting a post-hardcore band, stylistically, that is a style of music that calls for 2 guitars. Does that mean it's the only option, no. Does it mean he can't start a band if he doesn't have 2 guitars, no.

But if you had the ability, there's no reason you shouldn't, because the music calls for it.
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Last edited by chronowarp : 12-28-2012 at 06:17 PM.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:23 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chronowarp
That's not even the point. Stylistically, there is a specific instrumentation that has historically become the standard for a variety of subgenres of rock music. There are plenty of situations where one guitar player will work fine, and many where it will be a hindrance that isn't going to be made up just by you being SUPER AWEOZMEZZ BEST DRUMEMR EVER FILL DA SPACE WID DA CYMBAL.

If he's starting or planning on starting a post-hardcore band, stylistically, that is a style of music that calls for 2 guitars. Does that mean it's the only option, no. Does it mean he can't start a band if he doesn't have 2 guitars, no.

But if you had the ability, there's no reason you shouldn't, because the music calls for it.
Good points. Just make sure you don't feel obligated to have both play at all times just to avoid standing on stage awkwardly. There's nothing worse than having superfluous parts.

Well, there are worse things, but that's beside the point...
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:29 PM   #47
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I think I've said this previously, but there are plenty of things to be doing on stage besides playing. I take non playing as a prime opportunity to interact and pump up the crowd, or tune, or go get a beer.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:34 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chronowarp
That's not even the point. Stylistically, there is a specific instrumentation that has historically become the standard for a variety of subgenres of rock music. There are plenty of situations where one guitar player will work fine, and many where it will be a hindrance that isn't going to be made up just by you being SUPER AWEOZMEZZ BEST DRUMEMR EVER FILL DA SPACE WID DA CYMBAL.

If he's starting or planning on starting a post-hardcore band, stylistically, that is a style of music that calls for 2 guitars. Does that mean it's the only option, no. Does it mean he can't start a band if he doesn't have 2 guitars, no.

But if you had the ability, there's no reason you shouldn't, because the music calls for it.

The thing is, you shouldn't choose the "sub genre" you belong to. First write some music and see what genre it fits, don't try to make the music fit a specific genre. You don't need to fit any existing genre. If you just copy what others are doing, you will never come up with anything original. So what AlanHB is trying to say is that you can always experiment. There are no rules for sub genres. And many times the second guitarist is there just for playing rhythm parts behind solos. There's nothing wrong with that but you can also learn to play different kind of solos or arrange the rhythm instruments differently. We are just giving advice and different kinds of answers. One answer is to find another guitarist. But if finding another guitarist is hard, then try to cope with only one guitar and arrange your parts differently. That's not a reason not to start a band.
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:10 PM   #49
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oh my.
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Old 12-29-2012, 12:13 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by AlanHB
I mean, considering at the amount of "lol"s you've responded to me and the extensive amount of recordings you've uploaded, it's quite obvious that you have an awesome grasp on music.


I take my comment about being pointless back. This was worth keeping it open.

Back to circular bickering, though, I presume.

And FWIW, Alan is out gigging for money on a weekly basis. He knows what he's talking about. I'm not suggesting that you, chronowarp, don't know what you're talking about, but you haven't established that much credibility. That's not me calling you out on your join date, but reiterating the fact that you don't have any of your own material uploaded, and your profile is largely incomplete. I wanted to find out, "who is this guy?" and came up with nothing. For all I know, you started playing last year.

CT
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Old 12-29-2012, 03:54 AM   #51
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I question that Alan "knows what he's talking about" based on the playing I've heard on his profile. I'm not interested in anyone's online credibility, especially when they're posing as an expert. And I'm even less interested in what you think I know, because...I happen to know what I know, and what I can do. And yet, I still don't try to prescribe advice to a beginner or intermediate player like I'm above them, because I think that's ******edly ineffective. But since you're so interested in me:
I've been playing guitar for 10+ years.
I have a degree in Instrumental Jazz Performance on Guitar
I've been highly invested in learning, retaining, and developing music theory knowledge since I was a child.
I routinely teach guitar and music theory to private students
I've been actively playing in bands for years, and I'm involved in multiple projects at the moment
I have a lot of experience managing, leading, and promoting a band
I've worked in professional studios as an assistant and have engineered & mixed many recordings for other bands, as well as my own
If you asked me to voice a fr+6/VI in C#m it'd take me about 2 seconds.
I mean, what else do you need to know about me?

I'm not the one initiating conversations and prescribing advice like I'm a definitive expert on any musically related matter. All I'm interested in is the exchange of knowledge, and the rationale when advice is given. I've described why my opinion exists. Alan's method is "different opinion, ergo deficient", which is the biggest thing about this forum that I can't stand, and it's an attitude that's constantly perpetuated by players that aren't even developed enough to be dispensing advice to beginners. I hate taking digs at people for their playing, because we all have things we could be better at, but there's nothing more frustrating/offensive than somebody you could blow off the stage addressing you as if they're your superior. It's something that would never happen in real life. I would never do it. You would never do it.

tl;dr
You should assume everyone as an equal when you know nothing about them.
You don't need to know my life story and qualifications in order to engage in a conversation

edit: Why would I upload anything to this site, when a link to one of my band's is directly in my sig, and there's an EP linked to that facebook page that you could just listen to :-\
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Last edited by chronowarp : 12-29-2012 at 03:59 AM.
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Old 12-29-2012, 04:40 AM   #52
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Axeman is right. There's little focus on the topic, and a whole heap of circular bickering. Closed.
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