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Old 12-16-2012, 03:29 PM   #21
W4RP1G
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Quote:
Originally Posted by develia21
Thanks! The one problem I face with the sound of this guitar is that it tends to sounds very muddy, especially on the lower notes. It is obviously more audible when with high gain metal distortions, but also when playing clean. It is worse when used in a band situation where the sound just doesn't cut through without drastic eqing which just ends up as too overpowering. Will the PAF Pros fix that problem? Its probably the wood that the lower notes just sound less defined, but will PAFs help me in any case?

Stop blaming the wood, it's not the problem. You're playing with stock Ibanez pickup, possibly through a lackluster setup(saying you're playing through a multi-fx unit is extremely vague. I can only assume that your setup is crap).
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Old 12-16-2012, 03:59 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W4RP1G
Stop blaming the wood, it's not the problem. You're playing with stock Ibanez pickup, possibly through a lackluster setup(saying you're playing through a multi-fx unit is extremely vague. I can only assume that your setup is crap).


yeah we need more info. right now you are using a dirt cheap guitar with bottom of the barrel pups so what do you expect. as mentioned knowing what setup you are playing through would help. to muddy well first lay of the gain as that is most likely just as much to blame as crappy pups. are you doing the mid scoop thing? new pickups played through crapisn't going to change the outcome much if at all.
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Old 12-16-2012, 04:03 PM   #23
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I thought we dispelled the idea the basswood was a bad tonewood?
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Old 12-16-2012, 05:08 PM   #24
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Well, basswood is a good wood when you've got a nice piece of it. Just as with every other wood, there is more to its quality than just the name.

Really, the main problem with Ibanez-style guitars isn't their use of cheap basswood, it's the thin necks and floating vibratos. You can't expect to get really good resonance when the neck is a piece of paper and the strings are attached to a wobbly metal plate. That's what you're battling with, really, not the basswood.

PAF Pros have a very clear tone, there's no reason for them to ever sound muddy. If you're getting an indistinct sound even without gain, though, I would suggest that perhaps you've got your pickups to close to the strings, or you may simply need to back down the bass on whatever amps you end up running through.
You can get pickups that are clearer than PAF Pros, but they tend to use ceramic magnets and then you get very harsh clean tones and it's harder to get those typical blues tones you're after. The PAF Pro was designed to be the best compromise between modern clarity and classic tone, so it's your best bet for getting both. The Seymour Duncan Jazz does pretty much the same job, too, so it might be worth looking into them in case they come up cheaper for you.
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Old 12-16-2012, 05:24 PM   #25
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Well the setup I have isn't really something big that I can boast of. Apart from a fairly modest set of guitars, I rely on my multi-fx unit, mostly making use of either the Marshall JCM 2000 emulation or the Mesa Boogie Dual Rec for my high gain tones, and a Fender Twin Reverb Emulation for cleans when Live, which I mostly run through the PA.

Being a Home Studio Producer while also trying to sustain a band really doesn't pay off enough that I can afford multiple expensive equipment, compromises have to be made . And having mixed enough tracks, I do not any more cut down the mids or boost the bass too much. there's always room for the Bass to be made. So I have tried this guitar through a variety of different sounds, used some expensive plugins, even tried impulse responses and the problem of a lacking clarity is somewhat of a recurring problem.

Changing the tuners, nut and even the bridge is also in my list, but changing pickups comes first. Thanks everyone for great suggestions!
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Old 12-16-2012, 05:45 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by develia21
Well the setup I have isn't really something big that I can boast of. Apart from a fairly modest set of guitars, I rely on my multi-fx unit, mostly making use of either the Marshall JCM 2000 emulation or the Mesa Boogie Dual Rec for my high gain tones, and a Fender Twin Reverb Emulation for cleans when Live, which I mostly run through the PA.

Being a Home Studio Producer while also trying to sustain a band really doesn't pay off enough that I can afford multiple expensive equipment, compromises have to be made . And having mixed enough tracks, I do not any more cut down the mids or boost the bass too much. there's always room for the Bass to be made. So I have tried this guitar through a variety of different sounds, used some expensive plugins, even tried impulse responses and the problem of a lacking clarity is somewhat of a recurring problem.

Changing the tuners, nut and even the bridge is also in my list, but changing pickups comes first. Thanks everyone for great suggestions!

What is the multi-fx unit? They aren't all the same, some are amazing, some aren't even worth using.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFlibble
Well, basswood is a good wood when you've got a nice piece of it. Just as with every other wood, there is more to its quality than just the name.

Really, the main problem with Ibanez-style guitars isn't their use of cheap basswood, it's the thin necks and floating vibratos. You can't expect to get really good resonance when the neck is a piece of paper and the strings are attached to a wobbly metal plate. That's what you're battling with, really, not the basswood.

+100

Many people don't realize just how much a thin neck and floating bridge can affect the tone and sustain.
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Old 12-16-2012, 06:52 PM   #27
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I had a similar fairly cheap RG a while ago. It was a 350DX or something so a little better than the Gio guitars, but it had a DiMarzio Breed in the neck, a DiMarzio single coil in the middle and a Super Distortion in the bridge and sounded EPIC for all manner of things.

That guitar was basswood, like a lot of RGs. Like others have said, STOP blaming the wood. Having opinions on the tonal differences of different species of trees is something best left to those with greater all round experience

Basswood, like poplar and a few others, gets a bum rap from people who don't really know what they're talking about but have read posts on forums from other people who don't really know what they're talking about, who have read posts on forums from other people who don't really know what they're talking about ad infinitum.

Last edited by Wesbanez : 12-16-2012 at 06:56 PM.
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Old 12-17-2012, 08:04 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by develia21
Well the setup I have isn't really something big that I can boast of. Apart from a fairly modest set of guitars, I rely on my multi-fx unit, mostly making use of either the Marshall JCM 2000 emulation or the Mesa Boogie Dual Rec for my high gain tones, and a Fender Twin Reverb Emulation for cleans when Live, which I mostly run through the PA.

Being a Home Studio Producer while also trying to sustain a band really doesn't pay off enough that I can afford multiple expensive equipment, compromises have to be made . And having mixed enough tracks, I do not any more cut down the mids or boost the bass too much. there's always room for the Bass to be made. So I have tried this guitar through a variety of different sounds, used some expensive plugins, even tried impulse responses and the problem of a lacking clarity is somewhat of a recurring problem.

Changing the tuners, nut and even the bridge is also in my list, but changing pickups comes first. Thanks everyone for great suggestions!


what the hell is a Home Studio Producer? dude i have a home studio and use a POD XT into a Zoom Digital 8-track and get great results (see profile for proof) i'm not made of money but have a reasonably good live set up as well. with smart buying you can get decent gear and not be rich. sounds like you have some technical issues tome that won't get solved with new pickups.
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Old 12-17-2012, 08:06 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wesbanez
people who don't really know what they're talking about but have read posts on forums from other people who don't really know what they're talking about, who have read posts on forums from other people who don't really know what they're talking about but have read posts on forums from other people who don't really know what they're talking about but have read posts on forums from other people who don't really know what they're talking about, who have read posts on forums from other people who don't really know what they're talking about

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Old 12-18-2012, 04:33 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by monwobobbo
what the hell is a Home Studio Producer? dude i have a home studio and use a POD XT into a Zoom Digital 8-track and get great results (see profile for proof) i'm not made of money but have a reasonably good live set up as well. with smart buying you can get decent gear and not be rich. sounds like you have some technical issues tome that won't get solved with new pickups.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you're telling me I can sound like satch or vai with an entry level made in china ibanez with cheap pickups, then to me seems. you clearly don't know what you are talking about.

I never complained having a not-so-expensive gear. I merely gave a reply to the earlier gentleman who was interested in knowing what my amp was, which really does matter if you own a good quality amp, which I don't. I own a Pod Studio UX2 which uses the same drivers as a Pod x3 Live (which is in theory an advancement over pod xt), and I never complained about the sound quality or the quality of tones. I might be a newbie here on UG, but I'm not a noob when it comes to guitars, I have assessed all my financial options and availability of gear in my area and then come here to ask suggestions for a good pickup combination.

As far as smart buying is concerned, when I did have the cash saved up, I thought it wise to spend it on buying a set of good Studio Monitors, on a good Audio Interface, on a good Mic than buying a big new fancy tube amp which I won't even get to use Live since almost always I have to plug in my multi fx unit through the Live PA. When I did buy my multi-fx unit, I did a vigorous A/B comparison with other units that my pocket allowed and chose the one I liked best. I have also mixed enough tracks of a variety of genres to know how to get a good sound out of my system. Its this one guitar that just sounds not as good as other guitars (read more expensive guitar with better quality pickups and hardware) that just doesn't sound good. I hate to be talking back on a thread I started myself, but I think you should read better what I said earlier. Thanks for taking the time to read through this thread and replying to my queries and throwing in you 2 cents to this discussion.

As for the "home studio producer" bit, I believe its pretty much self explanatory, but if its some incorrect sentence phrasing or just sounds stupid, I apologize. Feel free to correct me on that one. Good Day to you! Cheers!

Last edited by develia21 : 12-18-2012 at 09:53 AM.
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Old 12-18-2012, 09:45 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by develia21
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you're telling me I can sound like satch or vai with an entry level made in china ibanez with cheap pickups, then to me seems. you clearly don't know what you are talking about.

You can sound LIKE Satch and Vai, but whether or not it's close enough to their tone for your standards is different. It basically boils down to this: If you can't get fairly close to the tone you want with your POD X3 right now, then upgrading your pickups won't get you there.

Most of the tone is going to come from your amp. Changing your pickups is like fine-tuning that tone. This is the order of things(as I see it): AMP->Technique->Pickups->Guitar

That order is up for debate. I know some people will put technique first. And pickups and the guitar kind of work together, but I think an EQ pedal can get you pretty far if they don't compliment each other.
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Old 12-18-2012, 10:06 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by W4RP1G
You can sound LIKE Satch and Vai, but whether or not it's close enough to their tone for your standards is different. It basically boils down to this: If you can't get fairly close to the tone you want with your POD X3 right now, then upgrading your pickups won't get you there.

Most of the tone is going to come from your amp. Changing your pickups is like fine-tuning that tone. This is the order of things(as I see it): AMP->Technique->Pickups->Guitar

That order is up for debate. I know some people will put technique first. And pickups and the guitar kind of work together, but I think an EQ pedal can get you pretty far if they don't compliment each other.


I agree with what you said. But as far as amps go, I am limited to as far as my multi fx unit, the Pod Farm software, and vst plugins go. I pretty much have a tone that I'm almost happy with. I have been working on a solo project, and my Floyd Rose on the EMG equipped guitar developed some trouble, due to which it spent better half of two weeks at the luthier's, which made me come back to playing my old Ibanez again.

I tried all the tricks in the book, multitracking guitars, spent the two weeks trying every possible amp/pedal combination and recording it in Cubase, but soon as I got my main axe back, it totally blew away everything the Ibanez had done out of the window. Eqing does help, but only so much. Belonging to a school of thought that does not believe in "fix in the mix" ideology, I like to get the right tone at the source itself, and then work my way down. In studio its all great too, but once I step live, the Ibanez somewhat struggles to cut through live. It just doesn't have that natural presence of the other guitar, perhaps if you'd play the guitar you'd understand.

I see this thread is becoming more of a "fix your amp" debate than a simple list of great combinations that are known to work with basswoods. I guess I'm a bit of a UG noob
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Old 12-18-2012, 03:11 PM   #33
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Well it's no surprise that a guitar with active pickups can make itself better known on stage than one with passives. I've lost count of how many times I've had to explain to people that the reason why they can't be heard and I can is because they're using premium-priced PAF copies and I've got standard EMGs.
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Old 12-18-2012, 08:18 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by develia21
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you're telling me I can sound like satch or vai with an entry level made in china ibanez with cheap pickups, then to me seems. you clearly don't know what you are talking about.

I never complained having a not-so-expensive gear. I merely gave a reply to the earlier gentleman who was interested in knowing what my amp was, which really does matter if you own a good quality amp, which I don't. I own a Pod Studio UX2 which uses the same drivers as a Pod x3 Live (which is in theory an advancement over pod xt), and I never complained about the sound quality or the quality of tones. I might be a newbie here on UG, but I'm not a noob when it comes to guitars, I have assessed all my financial options and availability of gear in my area and then come here to ask suggestions for a good pickup combination.

As far as smart buying is concerned, when I did have the cash saved up, I thought it wise to spend it on buying a set of good Studio Monitors, on a good Audio Interface, on a good Mic than buying a big new fancy tube amp which I won't even get to use Live since almost always I have to plug in my multi fx unit through the Live PA. When I did buy my multi-fx unit, I did a vigorous A/B comparison with other units that my pocket allowed and chose the one I liked best. I have also mixed enough tracks of a variety of genres to know how to get a good sound out of my system. Its this one guitar that just sounds not as good as other guitars (read more expensive guitar with better quality pickups and hardware) that just doesn't sound good. I hate to be talking back on a thread I started myself, but I think you should read better what I said earlier. Thanks for taking the time to read through this thread and replying to my queries and throwing in you 2 cents to this discussion.

As for the "home studio producer" bit, I believe its pretty much self explanatory, but if its some incorrect sentence phrasing or just sounds stupid, I apologize. Feel free to correct me on that one. Good Day to you! Cheers!


prepare to be corrected and i'm guessing you didn't check out my profile otherwise we may not be having this discussion.

your POD farm doesn't care about the guitar or pickups to a pretty fair degree. as i said i use a POD XT to record and it really doesn't show much of a difference between my top of the line Fender Strat+ and my much lower end Vineyard Strat copy (granted that is better than your gio) feel free to listen to Valley Of Gwangi and tell me which parts were played by which strat.

through an amp is a whole different thing. better quality amps will make up for a portion of a guitars weakness but not all. slapping good pups into a cheap guitar won't make it play better. it will most likely sound better. but.... if you are using digital modelling that isn't really high quality (think axe-fx) then you get diminishing returns from "better" pickups.
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Old 12-18-2012, 08:35 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by develia21
I see this thread is becoming more of a "fix your amp" debate than a simple list of great combinations that are known to work with basswoods. I guess I'm a bit of a UG noob

I gave my suggestion. The Satch signature pickups are pretty great.
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