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Old 08-04-2014, 05:59 PM   #64941
Rossenrot
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Yeah that's what I'm saying. You paraphrased my point way better than I could have ever worded it.
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Old 08-04-2014, 07:16 PM   #64942
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossenrot
I feel good about our discussion Dave.


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Old 08-07-2014, 07:52 AM   #64943
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'George Galloway Declares Bradford an Israel Free Zone'

Why the **** would anyone want to visit that shithole anyway?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ne-9653894.html
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Old 08-20-2014, 03:23 PM   #64944
meh!
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Originally Posted by Fisheth24
Thanks, going to read it now! Will come back with further questions I think!



You should know that was horrendously biased. Just wow.

'5. Why are people asking for Israel to end the "occupation" in Gaza?

Because they have short memories.

In 2005, Israel ended the occupation in Gaza. It pulled out every last Israeli soldier. It dismantled every last settlement. Many Israeli settlers who refused to leave were forcefully evicted from their homes, kicking and screaming.

This was a unilateral move by Israel, part of a disengagement plan intended to reduce friction between Israelis and Palestinians. It wasn't perfect -- Israel was still to control Gaza's borders, coastline, and airspace -- but considering the history of the region, it was a pretty significant first step.'

That is genuinely hilarious. I mean... For one people ask for the end of the illegal occupation of Palestine and the end of the Siege of Gaza. Second, it's basically splitting hairs? What's worse military occupation or military siege, blockade, denial of aid, indiscriminate shelling etc. ending the occupation so as to make it an open air prison. Good stuff. Not to mention the continued occupation of Palestine with ever expanding settlements.

Side not: I remember meeting a man in the West Bank whose house (him, wife and two small children) was in the path of an expanding settlement. So they completely encircled his house with an electric fence and built a little tunnel to get out. From where he couldn't drive his truck because to do so he would have to cross the Israeli only road which is a crime. The idea is of court users etch to force Palestinians to leave so the land can be taken. If this 'soft approach' doesn't work the settlers themselves help with violence and threatens of violence

And then we're told that the reason fewer Israelis die is because of iron dome and cause israel cares. Lol. And maybe also because Gaza doesn't have any tanks, planes artillery or army of note with which to actually kill any Israeli civilians.


The fact that it is even referred to as the Israel-Palestine 'conflict' is disgusting. There is no conflict there is no capability for effective military resistance. It is occupation and gradual ethnic cleansing which has been progressing since 48. The Israeli state was founded in Palestinian blood and has carried on in that vein (see: deir Yassin massacre and other similar ones through to the massacres in gaza today).

On a lighter note. Two massive boosts for the yes vote in scotland with the future of England survey revealing the level of punishment England wants for Scotland in the event of a no vote and bores johnsons comments pointing out that Scotland should receive no new powers in the same event. Lulz.

Also hi
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Old 08-21-2014, 06:24 PM   #64945
Arthur Curry
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Hi meh! good post. And here's a supplemental image:



It's amazing to me that you've been to the West Bank. How'd you get there? Where'd you stay? Very interested
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Old 08-28-2014, 05:30 PM   #64946
Arthur Curry
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Isis was a goddess in ancient Egyptian belief.

Friend of slaves, sinners, and the downtrodden, she also listened to the prayers of the wealthy, aristocrats, and rulers.

She gave birth to Horus, the god of war.
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Old Yesterday, 11:05 AM   #64947
ChucklesMginty
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Hi, I've never posted here before.

Basically, I've avoided politics my whole life. But I really think it's time I got a better idea of where I stand.

I live in the UK, I grew up with my parents complaining about the Tories ruining everything. Now I have friends on Facebook complaining about bloody lefties ruining everything. I'm not really sure where to begin, I should probably get a better idea of how the government works.

I just avoid all the big topics on the news, I have only the vaguest idea what's going on the Middle East and of course right now in Gaza. I consider myself an intelligent person but I'm not well informed. But now it's getting annoying not being able to debate about anything I feel strongly about.

Help me be less stupid pls
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Old Yesterday, 03:12 PM   #64948
Dave_Mc
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It's very, very difficult to get proper information because everyone is biased (some are more biased than others, of course, but still).

Wikipedia is pretty good if you want to look up about all the different political types- look up conservatism and neoliberalism (more or less the tories, though modern labour was pretty neoliberal too under blair), neoconservatism (sort of republicans in the USA, though they're also neolibs as well to a certain extent), social democracy (generally the more left-wing parties in europe), libertarianism (generally a more american thing with guys like ron paul; generally when used alone it means the right-wing form), left-libertarianism (that's what i am, more or less), and communism. EDIT: fascism too I knew I'd forget something obvious I've probably forgotten some other obvious ones, too.
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Old Yesterday, 04:14 PM   #64949
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Dave's given you a pretty good list. You'll probably find links to other interesting topics on those pages, and so gaps will be filled in.
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Old Yesterday, 04:36 PM   #64950
Dave_Mc
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Yeah that's what I was hoping. In any given wiki page (at least one about any big subject) there will be tons of follow-on material.

Also would be useful to look up some stuff about economics, since economics and politics are very closely intertwined. I suppose the economics and capitalism pages would be worth a look (again the thinking being that there will be tons of links from within there which will lead to more in-depth subjects).

Also, you're not stupid ChucklesMcGinty
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I had a Blackstar. I felt like I was lied to by Chappers, that fat ****.


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Old Yesterday, 06:52 PM   #64951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChucklesMginty
how the government works.


It doesn't really, but speaking of politics:

Ronpaul does everything he can to destroy his sons political aspirations:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...r-tin-foil.html

Ronpaul isn't quite a truther but isn't quite not a truther enough to not have had a negative impact on the credibility of his progeny.
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Old Today, 05:52 AM   #64952
meh!
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Originally Posted by Arthur Curry

It's amazing to me that you've been to the West Bank. How'd you get there? Where'd you stay? Very interested


you can travel relatively freely to the west bank. Lots of people fly in through tel aviv. Me and the people i was with flew to jordan and crossed the allanby/hussein bridge into the west bank. We stayed in a hostel in east jerusalam for a while to speak to people around there. crossing is painless for a whiter person with a uk passport. I said i was there to party in tel-aviv and it was fine. Others say they are there for religious studies, or gay pride.

We stayed in some other places around the west bank such as hebron/al-khalil where we stayed with families of contacts. This was often very stressful. Staying in hebron for example, we stayed with a family - on our first day with them their child was hit by a settler woman. She stopped her car specifically to hit this child who was just playing outside their house. Her family came out to see and the settler woman drove away. we were then all temporarily questioned and detained by the IDF. (Who watched the whole thing and did nothing).

This is not an exaggeration. The IDF are there to protect settlers who are incredibly violent towards Palestinians. Many settlers are religious extremists and already come from war-torn areas. They are aggressive and usually armed. There is no co-existence. Palestinian markest in al-khalil and kept under wire - to stop the stones and rubbish thrown at them from above. Though of course it doesn't stop the shit and other waste they try to throw on the fabrics they sell (to ruin them, so they can't sell them, so they leave).


It cannot be stressed enough how much Palestinians live under the yoke. Within '48 Israel Palestinians are second-class citizens who are not properly represented, their culture is not taught in school, they do not receive the same funding as jewish schools etc etc.

In the west bank movement is controlled by hundreds of check-point at which you can be detained, for no reason, indefinitely. Of course the apartheid wall cuts of whole communities from one another. It alo swoops round important land. Palestinian water is controlled by Israel, which provides barely enough water to survive (and the IDF make sure to shoot Palestinian water tanks whenever they invade) whilst being pumped into american funded WATER PARKS.

We don't need to talk about gaza: seige, border and air control. then massaccre after massacre.

And why? all so palestinians will leave. israel has proven that once the4y steal the land (48, 67, ongoing) they don't have to give it back.

It is ethnic cleansing and israel is a racist state.
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