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Old 08-21-2013, 02:21 PM   #41
notafishmonger
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Wow I spent a day jamming alongside that those brilliant tracks!
Do improvisers have to hit the tonic of the bar that is being played for the sake of consonance or should I continue to improv with whatever tune that comes in mind?
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Old 08-21-2013, 02:44 PM   #42
mdc
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Whatever comes in mind. You mean the root, not the tonic. The tonic is entirely different.
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Old 08-21-2013, 07:35 PM   #43
MaggaraMarine
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Originally Posted by notafishmonger
Wow I spent a day jamming alongside that those brilliant tracks!
Do improvisers have to hit the tonic of the bar that is being played for the sake of consonance or should I continue to improv with whatever tune that comes in mind?

No. That's just limiting. If you don't feel like hitting the root of the chord, don't play it. Improvising is all about playing what you feel. So you shouldn't limit yourself. But of course if you are after a really consonant sound, do it. And if it sounds good to you, do it. Do whatever sounds good to you.
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:02 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notafishmonger
Wow I spent a day jamming alongside that those brilliant tracks!
Do improvisers have to hit the tonic of the bar that is being played for the sake of consonance or should I continue to improv with whatever tune that comes in mind?


Hitting a specific chord tone on every change/measure is a good exercise for practice, but it's not always very musical. Playing to the harmony is very foundational, but it doesn't mean just rocking triad arpeggios on the downbeats.

For practice, I would first on hitting chord tones with every change, and then work on how you're approaching those chord tones. Eventually you'll get to where you can play the sound of the harmony without simply outlining.
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Old 08-22-2013, 04:15 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notafishmonger
Wow I spent a day jamming alongside that those brilliant tracks!
Do improvisers have to hit the tonic of the bar that is being played for the sake of consonance or should I continue to improv with whatever tune that comes in mind?

It's exactly as others said. Play whatever tune that comes in your mind.

The only purpose of these backing tracks is to help you develop a feel for the tones of a currently sounding chord. In time, you will be able to "see" them without referring to the visual part of the backing tracks. To illustrate what I mean... Below is a backing track in G major. Play f# on the very first chord (which is G major). Most likely, you will feel an urge to move one semitone higher, to play g. And this urge is what I mean by "seeing" the tones of a currently sounding chord. But having the ability to see these tones doesn't mean you have to play them. If you would play only the green tones, your improvisations would be very boring. Developing the above mentioned ability is not a "solution" to improvisation. Think of it as a step towards being more musical. And being musical is a key to improvisation.



The analogy with learning a language from the video Blind In 1 Ear posted is very fitting. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you haven't been musically active since your childhood (or at least not non-stop). This means that for you, music isn't your native language. But don't feel bad about this. In this analogy, music isn't my native language either. The point is, when you learn a second language as an adult, you tend to view the language as a system to be understood through some set of rules (word orders, tenses, etc.). And this is OK. Adults are used to learn this way. But the greatest progress in learning a language will not be made by studying grammar, but by being exposed to the language and - above all - using it yourself. And later on, when you're confident enough, you will no longer feel an urge to use some rules to justify the correctness of the things you say. You will simply speak the language. And this is your goal with music, I think. It's not easy. But it's not that hard either. It just takes time...
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Old 08-23-2013, 12:52 AM   #46
notafishmonger
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Right, so don't be limited to chord related notes
Aha so I went and played a little more, my head gradually started to create tunes often around mid ways through the song, I can also whistle a track that is kind of like an improv guitar line with songs now. The only trouble is I can't for the life of me replay whatever tune that came out of my mouth on the guitar.

I was just wondering as I was improvising, if I strictly followed the notes in the playing chord starting with the root, then whatever that comes after that I saw fit, that does technically make a walking bassline instead if I were to play it on the bass??
Is this why guitarists don't go for full consonance?
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Old 08-23-2013, 03:25 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by notafishmonger
The only trouble is I can't for the life of me replay whatever tune that came out of my mouth on the guitar.?


That will come in time, just keep practicing .
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Old 08-23-2013, 06:39 AM   #48
MaggaraMarine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notafishmonger
Right, so don't be limited to chord related notes
Aha so I went and played a little more, my head gradually started to create tunes often around mid ways through the song, I can also whistle a track that is kind of like an improv guitar line with songs now. The only trouble is I can't for the life of me replay whatever tune that came out of my mouth on the guitar.

I was just wondering as I was improvising, if I strictly followed the notes in the playing chord starting with the root, then whatever that comes after that I saw fit, that does technically make a walking bassline instead if I were to play it on the bass??
Is this why guitarists don't go for full consonance?

There's nothing wrong with only playing consonant notes. If it sounds good, play it. But usually it starts to sound a bit boring if you only play consonant notes. It lacks the tension.

Not using any chord tones sounds bad because then there's only tension and no release. It will only sound like you can't play the guitar.

Oh, and to be able to play what you sing, learn the intervals. It helps a lot.
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Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

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Charvel So Cal
Ibanez Blazer
Digitech RP355
MXR Micro Chorus
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Hartke HyDrive 210c
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Old 08-27-2013, 02:26 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notafishmonger
Aha so I went and played a little more, my head gradually started to create tunes often around mid ways through the song, I can also whistle a track that is kind of like an improv guitar line with songs now. The only trouble is I can't for the life of me replay whatever tune that came out of my mouth on the guitar.

It's great that you have some concrete tunes in your head when improvising. You're halfway there. As you said, the only thing left is to learn to play them on the guitar. And as has been also said, this is something which takes time.

Btw, improvisation isn't the only way to go here. Just think of some distinctive melody from a song you know well and try to play it. Technically, you will be doing the same thing you do when improvising. The only difference will be in skipping the part where you construct the melody yourself. But since that part doesn't seem to be where the problem is, I think you should give this exercise a try. Also, you may find it more entertaining. After all, you'll be playing songs you like.
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