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Old 04-01-2013, 01:49 PM   #1
TrailOfMe
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Monitoring sound while recording

I'm using Boss BR-80 as the interface to record guitar with my PC. I'm using Reaper as the DAW. I'm having a problem with the monitoring sound. What I would like to achieve is to record the dry signal so I can try different software effects in it. I would still like to monitor a signal with effects in it for obvious reasons.

I think this is a common scenario so how does everyone else achieve it? I can always monitor the PC output but I think this will introduce a lot of latency and makes it hard in every way? If I monitor the sound from interface output, I will get also the dry signal.

BR-80 has great effects built-in but it has no way to monitor the sound with the effects on and still record the dry sound. Does any other interface allow me to do this? I know BR-80 is not the best tool to use as an interface but so far it has served me well. Everything works fine if I record the sound with effects on but now that I want to record dry signal and monitor with effects, I'm hitting problems.

Suggestions?
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Old 04-01-2013, 02:54 PM   #2
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Buy yourself a Scarlett2i4 or a Saffire6. Then, use a DAW to add effects.
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Old 04-01-2013, 03:06 PM   #3
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Wouldn't that still force me to use PC speakers for monitoring instead of the interface's output? I would still be suffering from latency? Although I've been already looking at Scarlett, I don't see how it would change my situation to any better?
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Old 04-01-2013, 03:58 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailOfMe
Wouldn't that still force me to use PC speakers for monitoring instead of the interface's output? I would still be suffering from latency? Although I've been already looking at Scarlett, I don't see how it would change my situation to any better?

Well, you should get a better interface anyway. That said, you're right. You probably will need a set of studio headphones.
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Old 04-02-2013, 02:23 AM   #5
TrailOfMe
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And how does studio headphones change things? I already have decent studio headphones but I still cannot figure out a good way to get the sound with effects for monitoring without using PC output. From what I have heard this will generate a lot of latency but how else would this be possible? Or am I wrong about the latency? I can try that today to hear it myself.
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Old 04-02-2013, 02:45 AM   #6
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Are you using ASIO? if not, you should be. If the BR80 doesn't have ASIO drivers then get ASIO4ALL and use that.
If it has proper ASIO then just set it to a clean patch, put the effects on in your DAW, and enable track monitoring (there's usually a little speaker icon somewhere on the track). With ASIO the latency should be just about unnoticeable. This will then output from your BR80's output.
if it doesn't have proper ASIO then open up ASIO4ALL and select the BR80 as the input device, and either select it as the output as well or you could select your computer speakers as output. Then it's the same as the other way, put effects on the track and enable track monitoring. Latency typically isn't as good with ASIO4ALL but it can be (depending on the device it might even be better than native ASIO) and it still shouldn't really be noticeable.
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Old 04-02-2013, 03:04 AM   #7
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Yes it has ASIO but if I set it up as you described, I will also get the dry signal to output and it's a bit confusing to hear both signals at once. I've asked from Boss and there's no way to prevent that.

If I go with Scarlett 2i4 (or some other proper interface), does this work differently and I won't get the dry guitar signal to output?
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Old 04-02-2013, 03:16 AM   #8
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I've just switched to audio interface (Focusrite 2i4) and VST amp sims. However, there is some demand on CPU with this solution. Sounds like my old setup would suit you perfectly - I used a POD X3 Live and monitored through the pod but recorded dry for reamping later. 0 (well...) latency and a dry track for reamping. I would say the dry recorded signal is much better with the Focusrite though.
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Old 04-02-2013, 03:31 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailOfMe
Yes it has ASIO but if I set it up as you described, I will also get the dry signal to output and it's a bit confusing to hear both signals at once. I've asked from Boss and there's no way to prevent that.

If I go with Scarlett 2i4 (or some other proper interface), does this work differently and I won't get the dry guitar signal to output?

Then I would try using the ASIO4ALL workaround. Install ASIO4ALL, select the BR80 as the input device and the computer speaker/headphones as the output.
Although I find it odd that you can't drop the dry signal away, even my DigiTech BP355 (floor multieffects unit) has the option to just output from the USB.
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Old 04-02-2013, 03:54 AM   #10
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I'll try the setup where I switch the monitoring from BR-80 to PC speakers/headphones and let you know how it works.

For those that are interested, here's the reply I got from Roland:
"There is no way to turn off hardware monitoring on the BR-80 (i.e. the guitar signal being sent to your computer via USB will always also be sent out to the LINE OUT of the BR-80)."
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Old 04-02-2013, 11:55 AM   #11
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I tested this today and I was correct. Using the PC speakers for output and interface for input generated a small latency. Not much but still noticeable. I'm still wondering that how does other people do this? Seems to me that this would be really common scenario? Anyone out there who is recording dry guitar signal? How do you handle the monitoring?
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Old 04-02-2013, 01:04 PM   #12
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Other people take the output directly out of the interface. Instead of forcing it through the PC.
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Old 04-03-2013, 02:00 AM   #13
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But if they want to record the dry signal, the output would be a dry guitar signal or is that just a problem in my interface?
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Old 04-03-2013, 03:13 AM   #14
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Bus the dry signal to an effects AUx and make that aux output to your interface..plug in headphones.
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Old 04-03-2013, 04:52 AM   #15
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Others have better interfaces with lower latencies that don't have this issue. The more ghetto rigged your setup is, the more issues (and latency) it will have.

I also just learned to deal with latency. If you suck it up and play with it for a bit you'll get used to it.
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Old 04-03-2013, 06:33 AM   #16
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1 foot of electronic cable=1ms of delay.
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Old 04-03-2013, 08:48 AM   #17
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So my best option would be to invest into a better interface (like Scarlett 2i4) and then just use the interface input and ouput in my setup which would eliminate the latency. I think the latency in my test is happening because of different hardware for input and ouput and even if I would already have better quality tools, I would still suffer from latency since the hardware would be different for input and output.

If I could use the same interface for both, then this would be a non-issue. At the moment, BR-80 doesn't allow me to do this since it will always route the guitar signal back to output, which ruins my plan to record dry signal and monitor the web signal. I assume I could get rid off that with better interface?
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Old 04-03-2013, 09:01 AM   #18
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With an interface you have a mixer knob that lets you decide how much dry/wet segnal do you want to hear, so you can monitor just the wet signal if you want to, or just the dry signal, or a blend of the two signals, etc.
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Old 04-06-2013, 12:57 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roaraudio
1 foot of electronic cable=1ms of delay.


Wat? Speed of light = 300 000 000 m / s = 300 000 m / ms.

So 300 000 m of cable = 1 ms of delay.

Depending on shielding, electricity can travel slower than speed of light. In a coaxial cable the electric wave travels at only 66% of the speed of light, so 200 000 m of cable = 1 ms.
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Old 04-13-2013, 11:20 AM   #20
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Your audio interface will have a headphone out.
Connect your headphone out to a speaker/monitor or a guitar amp.
This way, your going to get sound from your computer and sound from your amp at the same time. This is what I do
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