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Old 12-16-2008, 12:49 PM   #21
michal23
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I think we've all noticed that when we record ourselves, we always hate what we sound like, no matter how normal it may sound to others.

But when we listen to ourselves as we talk, we sound normal to ourselves - but we think we sound different than we do.

When we ask other people how we sound, they tell us we sound normal; but I don't particularly like to rely on the opinions of others...

So my question is, how can we judge our voice without any such biases and without getting anyone else to judge us?
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Old 12-16-2008, 01:42 PM   #22
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Anyone wanna give feedback on my singing, "all i want is you" u2 cover in my profile

To the poster above me, I know exactly what you're talking about. I have been trying to learn to sing for a couple of months now and I'm still not close to being happy with my singing voice/tone although i think ive learned how to semi-properly sing now with my diaphragm and that so i doubt the tone will improve/change drastically from now on, I guess its mostly a confidence issue and just becoming used to it
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Old 12-16-2008, 06:10 PM   #23
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So i recently recorded a short song and decided for the first time ever i would put vocals on it.

It didn't come out as planned and i'm really not happy with my voice at all but can't for the life of me figure what i'm doing wrong and what i need to do to correct it

any pointers?

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Old 12-16-2008, 07:03 PM   #24
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How do i get rid of those few notes that dont make any sound between my low voice and my hight voice(falsetto i think)?
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:06 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by demonofthenight
Don't. Honestly this will be the best advice anyone can give you about your voice. Stop throat screaming and scream using z4's method (the link I gave you). That idiot from bullet for my valentine or avenged 7 fold or something destroyed his voice and needed surgery just to start singing again.

I'm not really that good at it, but I think all you do is apply pressure in your diaphram (I know Chris want's to E-slap me at the moment) and lower your voice to a whisper. It should come out raspy and gritty. Painless and relatively safe and you can still maintain a singing melody (which is the most important part of singing).

Seriously, don't scream with your throat. Best case scenario you have a permanently raspy voice or you get a few throat warts which go away, worst case scenario is that you become a mute.


I dunno about that. To my knowledge, I throat scream. I inhale correctly, I use my diaphragm, but I scream with my throat. It never hurts, though. And a lot of the screamers in bands (bands like Misery Signals, Veil of Maya) definitely throat scream. There is no way you can get such a full, aggressive sound otherwise.

My question is, if something doesn't hurt your throat or effect your singing at all, could it still be doing irreparable damage?
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:44 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Valderama
When im sorta singing to a song while playing ... i appear to be hitting the right notes and have it sounding right,but when i eventually sing into a mic at practice or whatever, its usually slightly off, even after i warm up.
Can the volume of my singing effect my pitch?


There are a few things at work here. Maybe all of them, or maybe just one.

1. When you sing loudly, you use more air. This might cause you to sing sharp if you're not careful. When you sing quietly, you use less air. This could cause you to sing flat.
2. You may think you sound fine singing along with the recording, but using a mic can be like putting your voice under the microscope. Now that people can *really* hear it, we can hear the inaccuracies that went unnoticed before.
3. similar to #2, when you sing into a mic, you sound a lot louder. This can cause you to become much more self-conscious, which will adversely affect your pitch.... usually towards going flat, as being inhibited means less air...
4. Hearing yourself singing into a mic can be disorienting at first. You create your voice in the center of your head, where the mic is, but you hear your voice coming out 15 feet away to your left, or whatever.... it really messes you up at first. This compounds the issues in #3.

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Old 12-16-2008, 07:48 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michal23
I think we've all noticed that when we record ourselves, we always hate what we sound like, no matter how normal it may sound to others.

But when we listen to ourselves as we talk, we sound normal to ourselves - but we think we sound different than we do.

When we ask other people how we sound, they tell us we sound normal; but I don't particularly like to rely on the opinions of others...

So my question is, how can we judge our voice without any such biases and without getting anyone else to judge us?


The more you record yourself singing, the more you can reconcile the difference between that voice you hear and the voice others hear. You hear yourself, but you have a really good idea what others are hearing too. It's kinda like knowing what your guitar and amp sound like, but playing with the volume off on the guitar. Even though all you hear is 'plink, plink, plink,' you can aurally 'visualize' well what the end result will really sound like.

From there, you can hear what you need to hear - pitch, resonance, etc. - and make adjustments accordingly as you sing. If those things are good in your own head as you hear them, they'll sound fine out front.

CT
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Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

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Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:50 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by ADireStraight
Anyone wanna give feedback on my singing, "all i want is you" u2 cover in my profile

... i think ive learned how to semi-properly sing now with my diaphragm and that so i doubt the tone will improve/change drastically from now on, I guess its mostly a confidence issue and just becoming used to it


The last bit sorta caught me first... Your tone is dependent upon breath support with the diaphragm, yes. But, perhaps even more importantly, your tone is dependent upon how it resonates. If your voice is resonating in your sinus cavities and in your chest, you will get a tone (round, rich, vibrant) worlds better than if it is resonating in the back of your throat (pinched, nasal, etc.).

For your recording... you have a voice that sounds naturally very rich. That's a good thing. You're a bass. Go with it, and accentuate those rich bass frequencies.

That said... you are singing right out of your throat. I can hear it. Chances are, you can feel it. The solution to that is here: http://thebelcantotechnique.now-her...id=33&Itemid=35 Read the lift of the throat and the mask of the face.

It sounds like you have some breath support, but you tend to lose most of it by the time you get to a longer line. The trick is to learn how to control the diaphragm so that you aren't expelling all your air so quickly, yet maintaining the breath support required for the power and projection you want. Most of us need a teacher to show us that.

CT
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Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by firehawk
Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.

Last edited by axemanchris : 12-16-2008 at 07:58 PM.
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:53 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martyr's Prayer
My question is, if something doesn't hurt your throat or effect your singing at all, could it still be doing irreparable damage?


You might not notice the effects short term. What happens if you did those things for a solid hour or two, as if you were doing it at a gig? And then imagine what would happen if you did that four nights a week.

CT
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Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by firehawk
Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:55 PM   #30
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Can someone give some examples of what tenors sound like in normal singing? I've heard tenors singing opera, but it's kind of hard to compare.

I used to think I was a baritone, but I realized recently that I've been using vocal fry to get a lot of the lower notes I was singing and that I seem to be pretty impaired in the lower range of singing. I've done some reading up on the ranges of different tenors and different baritones, and it seems to me that if I'm a baritone at all, the only baritone I could possibly be is baryton-martin.
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Old 12-16-2008, 08:01 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madbasslover
[color=purple]Can someone give some examples of what tenors sound like in normal singing?


Paul McCartney.
Bruce Dickenson
Bon Jovi - (most of the '80's hair metal bands, actually)
Chris Cornell
Goo Goo Dolls
Boston/Journey
Don Henley (Eagles)
Billy Squier

... SO many....

CT
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Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Quote:
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Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
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Old 12-16-2008, 08:12 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tobysaurus
any pointers?



You seem to have good breath support, and the timbre of your voice works well for this song.

The biggest problem I hear is that your voice lacks resonance. The best solution to this is lessons. You're pushing your voice, which becomes really apparent when you try to hit high notes and they break up in pretty unflattering ways. By pushing your voice, it goes past your vocal cords and straight out your mouth. It speeds right by your sinus cavities, which are your natural and best-utilized resonance chambers, before it has a chance to pick up those overtones. The end difference is a one-dimensional tone, closer to a yell or a shout than to a robust singing voice. Also, this leads one with a tendency to go sharp.

Try opening your throat up more and keeping it there, too.

A few of these factors, all typical of an untrained singer, are all working against you, which is what is resulting in your pitch going off here and there too.

CT
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Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Quote:
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Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
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Old 12-16-2008, 10:17 PM   #33
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I recently started taking vocal lessons, and after my last lesson on Saturday I felt a very drastic improvement. But now I've been singing so much that my voice has become hoarse and the improvement reversed; how can I make my voice feel good again, or do I just have to wait it out?
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Old 12-16-2008, 10:37 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axemanchris
You might not notice the effects short term. What happens if you did those things for a solid hour or two, as if you were doing it at a gig? And then imagine what would happen if you did that four nights a week.

CT

thought i'd drop in just to look around and lo' and behold my "how to scream" clip has been totally wh0red out which is awesome! glad to see its still helping people.

to second this, yes, if you can "throat growl" for an hour or 2 straight and you don't feel excessive strain, pain or you don't go hoarse afterwards its probably safe to say initially that you're doing it right. but again, i remember being younger it didn't hurt but once i started getting older i started noticing it. so always be paying attention to what you're doing to yourself when "screaming"
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Old 12-17-2008, 03:05 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by z4twenny
thought i'd drop in just to look around and lo' and behold my "how to scream" clip has been totally wh0red out which is awesome! glad to see its still helping people.

to second this, yes, if you can "throat growl" for an hour or 2 straight and you don't feel excessive strain, pain or you don't go hoarse afterwards its probably safe to say initially that you're doing it right. but again, i remember being younger it didn't hurt but once i started getting older i started noticing it. so always be paying attention to what you're doing to yourself when "screaming"


Ahh , hopefully you'll check the thread again, but I was wondering if your technique could be applied to gain a edge to my voice? Such as a Bon Scott (or Steven Tyler, or Josh Todd, etc).
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Old 12-17-2008, 06:02 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axemanchris
The last bit sorta caught me first... Your tone is dependent upon breath support with the diaphragm, yes. But, perhaps even more importantly, your tone is dependent upon how it resonates. If your voice is resonating in your sinus cavities and in your chest, you will get a tone (round, rich, vibrant) worlds better than if it is resonating in the back of your throat (pinched, nasal, etc.).

For your recording... you have a voice that sounds naturally very rich. That's a good thing. You're a bass. Go with it, and accentuate those rich bass frequencies.

That said... you are singing right out of your throat. I can hear it. Chances are, you can feel it. The solution to that is here: http://thebelcantotechnique.now-her...id=33&Itemid=35 Read the lift of the throat and the mask of the face.

It sounds like you have some breath support, but you tend to lose most of it by the time you get to a longer line. The trick is to learn how to control the diaphragm so that you aren't expelling all your air so quickly, yet maintaining the breath support required for the power and projection you want. Most of us need a teacher to show us that.

CT


Thanks a ton, again. I found it surprising that you said I was singing right out of my throat. I compared with some older recordings of mine and I sound MUCH less "breathey" now than I used to, so I assumed that meant I was singing from my throat much less.

I will look into those bel canto technique tips.
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Old 12-17-2008, 09:42 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axemanchris
You seem to have good breath support, and the timbre of your voice works well for this song.

The biggest problem I hear is that your voice lacks resonance. The best solution to this is lessons. You're pushing your voice, which becomes really apparent when you try to hit high notes and they break up in pretty unflattering ways. By pushing your voice, it goes past your vocal cords and straight out your mouth. It speeds right by your sinus cavities, which are your natural and best-utilized resonance chambers, before it has a chance to pick up those overtones. The end difference is a one-dimensional tone, closer to a yell or a shout than to a robust singing voice. Also, this leads one with a tendency to go sharp.

Try opening your throat up more and keeping it there, too.

A few of these factors, all typical of an untrained singer, are all working against you, which is what is resulting in your pitch going off here and there too.

CT

aha!
makes sense to me

thank you
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Old 12-17-2008, 10:45 AM   #38
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Something that usually happens to me and maybe to other people here as well is when I hang out with friends/family and they ask me to play and sing something in the moment, I notice that my voice is rough because I really need to warm up first.

When I play guitar it's fine, because I don't really play demanding stuff and I don't need to warm up my hands, but I'm not comfortable at all singing when this type of situations happens.

I know it'll sound silly but is there a way that I can prepare my voice or warm up a bit without doing all the weird vocal exercises that everybody will notice and make fun of?
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Old 12-17-2008, 11:54 AM   #39
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Ahh , hopefully you'll check the thread again, but I was wondering if your technique could be applied to gain a edge to my voice? Such as a Bon Scott (or Steven Tyler, or Josh Todd, etc).

yes it can, but the idea to that is to not loosen the vocal chords as much as you would while growling/screaming and to emphasize the singing with the diaphragm, this will give you a bit of an edge. Bon Scott actually sings alot looser than steven tyler generally. but again, this is something that practice should help you nail down how you want it to sound.
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Old 12-17-2008, 06:08 PM   #40
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I just recently got into singing. Just a couple of days ago actually, and I'm still looking into some easy songs to start with. I'm going for alternative rock, post-grunge kinda thing. I tried Staind, it wasn't bad but I had to move it down half a step.

Can anyone suggest easy songs to start with? Preferably ones with which I can also play with (easy chords etc since I am still finding it tough to sing and play at the same time)
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