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Old 12-19-2009, 09:00 PM   #21
fixationdarknes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonshield17
Is this an example of complex string jumps?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------|
---------------------------------------------------------------------------|
--------------------------------------4------------------------------------|
--7-------------------5------7------------5-------------------------------|
----0-0-0-0-0-0-0----------------------------------------------7-------5-------3---|
-------------------------3-3----3-3----3-----3-3-3-3-3-3-3-----3-3-----3-3---3-|


Lol trusting the moonlight.
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So while you fap, you're thinking "oh this is a really good song, I'll need to get the album?"
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Old 12-19-2009, 09:10 PM   #22
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Erm, not really.

I'd consider something like this

Code:
-----------------------------------------------| -----------------------------------------------| -------------------------------10---------9----| -----11-14-11----12-15-12----9----9----10---10-| --12----------12----------10--------10---------| -----------------------------------------------| --------------------------------------14-17~--| --------------------------------12-15---------| --------------------14-------13---------------| --------15-12----------13-14------------------| --10-15-------15-12---------------------------| ----------------------------------------------|


More challenging.
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Old 12-19-2009, 09:16 PM   #23
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Freepower, I always see you post that somewhere! I'm sure it's in the huge exercises folder from the exercises thread, but what's the name of the piece again? Thanks in advance.
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Originally Posted by Trowzaa
It's 1am, I picked the first child I saw
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Old 12-19-2009, 09:18 PM   #24
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That's a bit of Paginnini's 5th caprice (I think).
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Old 12-19-2009, 09:30 PM   #25
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Well spotted, it is indeed. I don't think I've posted that bit before either btw.

Code:
---------------------------------------------| -----13----------12----------10--------8-----| --------12----------10----------9--------7---| --14-------14-12-------12-10------10-9-----9-| ---------------------------------------------| ---------------------------------------------| ----------------------------------| ----6-------6-------6--------8----| ------5-------5-------4--------9--| --7-----7-6-----6-5-----5-10------| ----------------------------------| ----------------------------------|


Try THAT with just a pick.
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Old 12-19-2009, 09:48 PM   #26
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Honestly, that entire song has got to be one of the best and most challenging alt picking workouts on the planet. I just started playing it again recently after having left it alone for a couple of years.

Though given that the TS is having some trouble with licks on two strings, this might be a bit too much too soon for him, IMO. I think what the TS is practicing, getting some more songs in there notwithstanding, could be productive. The problem in my mind is pushing the speed on them. There's no reason to push the speed on exercises that much, it's not like they are part of a song that you want to get up to tempo. Just play them at whatever speed that will let you get the technique benefits.
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Old 12-19-2009, 09:54 PM   #27
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Oh, absolutely, that song's WAY beyond him. For him the point is that the attitude towards speed needs to change and that the exercises he's doing aren't actually helpful.

Since then we've gone a bit off topic.

But yeah, exercises imho just don't suit the temperament of about 80% of guitarists. At the minute I'm writing some etudes which should cover small technical ideas but still be musical and fun - and importantly, be challenging and interesting at a normal tempo.
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Old 12-19-2009, 09:55 PM   #28
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Ah, I knew it sounded familiar Cheers! I could have sworn you posted it somewhere else, but ah wells

And to that second phrase I like! I'm finding that to transition, I'm just bringing my ring finger down to cater for the root and rolling it down for the highest note, and my middle and index fingers take care of their respective frets, but for the change between the G#6 and G dominant 7 I'm staying in position, then jumping to the 10th fret with my index. I've been trying it with alternate, economy and hybrid picking for maximum value! It's definitely a fun one.
If any of that made sense, do you think that's a logical approach?
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Quote:
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It's 1am, I picked the first child I saw

Last edited by juckfush : 12-19-2009 at 09:58 PM.
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:05 PM   #29
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I'd go with ring for the tenth fret at the end if I've understood you correctly - are you refingering those last two notes?
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:08 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freepower
I'd go with ring for the tenth fret at the end if I've understood you correctly - are you refingering those last two notes?

Ah, my bad, I'm using the ring for the 10th fret I'm staying strictly positional for all the arpeggios.
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Quote:
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It's 1am, I picked the first child I saw
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:12 PM   #31
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Whats your favourite way to pick it so far?

I go - D m D U which I find blazes through this section.

In fact - http://profile.ultimate-guitar.com/...ills/play342359 - this is from more than a year ago, be gentle.
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:22 PM   #32
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^Not bad at all. Better than I could get it for sure - though I always used straight alt picking on it (mostly for the challenge, and also my hybrid picking isn't great - it's sufficient for noodly stuff, but not anything really challenging).
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:24 PM   #33
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If you're serious about it I'd definitely go hybrid for it, hybrid makes it easy and I much prefer the sound off it.

I had a go at the monster arpeggio/scale intro recently, actually didn't find it too hard apart from my own stupid lack of fingerings for the harmonic minor scale. Might actually nail this piece in the next decade.
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:30 PM   #34
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At first I really liked using strict alternate picking, but it felt a tad awkward and clumsy. But to be honest, since I tried your method I can't seem to go back! I was busy trying to cram my middle and ring fingers into my hybrid picking approach, so that it was a D r m U affair - very cramped!
I do find that hybrid picking offers such a great tone though, much smoother and natural than strict picking, which is why I finally decided to do something about it and start practicing it a couple weeks back (that, and I love Guthrie Govan's and Greg Howe's tone).

And the clip's great, don't worry! I love the slight popping sound you gave to the higher notes of the arpeggios - very slick, and it gives some variety to the tonal qualities of the piece. I think I'll give it a shot!
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It's 1am, I picked the first child I saw
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:36 PM   #35
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Yeah, I loves that pop. This is one of those licks you always think will work out better with two fingers but one seems to do the job better.

The thing about hybrid picking, sweeping, eco, all that stuff is sometimes even if you're rubbish at them (like I am at all of the above) there's still licks that are ten times easier with them. It doesn't take much work to develop some facility with them either, specially hybrid picking in my experience.
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:38 PM   #36
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I'll have a play with hybrid picking that bit and see how it works out. I haven't got to relearning that part yet - I've just been working on the first 16 bars for the last few days. I think I'm going to take it slow this time, just give it 20 mins a day steadily. The last time around I was in too much hurry to get it down, and wound up forcing it. It will be interesting to see what effect 2 more years practice on everything else will have had on it. Though I can tell already from the intro, it's coming quite a bit easier this go around.
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:59 PM   #37
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Oh, definitely. I've found that with certain passages, I'll take the most logical approach to start off (like instantly opting to economy pick a standard A minor arpeggio shape for example), but if it's particularly difficult, I'll try out any and every possible strategy to nail it.

I'm really fond of the idea though, when possible, of using certain techniques for tonality rather than ease of playing, like using hybrid picking or legato for a smoother/more natural tone, and picking for accents and so on. I've gotten really obsessed with the concept of tone recently, so I guess I've grown a greater dependency on developing all my techniques, at least to an intermediate level, so I can act on that sort of idea.
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Quote:
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It's 1am, I picked the first child I saw
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Old 12-20-2009, 03:18 AM   #38
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sorry for the n00b question. but what's the difference between hybrid picking and economy picking? or better yet, what exactly is hybrid picking?
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Old 12-20-2009, 03:45 AM   #39
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Hybrid picking involves using both your pick and remaining fingers of your picking hand to pick notes. It's sort of a hybrid between fingerstyle and picking, in other words. The tonal advantage is that you still have your pick in hand for a more ''mechanical'' tone, and your fingers are free for creating a more natural, smoother ''human'' tone. Plus, large interval jumps that you see in string skipping, for example, can be be performed with both the pick (for the lower register) and fingers (for the higher register).

Economy picking is similar to sweeping, in that if you're ascend up the strings - say, one note per string - you'd perform a continuous down stroke on each successive string. Likewise, if you were descending a one note per string pattern, you'd use one continuous up stroke. It follows the principle of economy of motion, in that if you minimize movements, due to keeping one single picking motion to perform notes on adjacent strings.
Of course, you can economy pick a two note per string lick like this:

G------5-7-----5-7
D-5-7----- 5-7

using an U D D U U D D U picking pattern, which would effectively minimize your picking motions. It's difficult to grasp, and there are limitations (in that licks have to be arranged for strict economy picking, such as an odd number of notes per string), but in certain situations, it may be preferable to use this approach.
I've never been able to explain economy picking well, so hopefully that's covered it, or somebody else comes in with a simpler, more accurate explanation
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It's 1am, I picked the first child I saw
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Old 12-20-2009, 04:10 AM   #40
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oh no, that was fine, I already knew what economy picking was :p Just wasn't so sure about the hybrid picking...which sounds tough imo, but perhaps that's because I've never tried finger picking anyway. Thanks for explaining

Last edited by Moonshield17 : 12-20-2009 at 04:12 AM.
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