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Old 01-24-2011, 12:49 PM   #41
SamstaUK
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I started learning PARTS of this song after about 1 year of playing, I've been playing for 3 years now and I can definitely play the parts cleaner and in better timing than when I first started. I still haven't learned the full song, I still can't play it perfectly, and it is definitely not "easy".

As for Creeping Death, I find it easier only down picking compared to alternate picking. MoP seems the other way around :S
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Old 01-24-2011, 01:43 PM   #42
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I want to see all the guys calling this song easy playing the rhythm part extremely tight and clean. right beat, right tempo,etc.
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Old 01-24-2011, 08:14 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by xStargazer
I want to see all the guys calling this song easy playing the rhythm part extremely tight and clean. right beat, right tempo,etc.


Exactly, especially after only playing "about a year". The guys in Metallica were playing guitar for almost 10 years(if not more) and even they admit its close to the fastest they can play downstrokes.
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Old 01-24-2011, 08:32 PM   #44
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Playing almost constant 8th downstrokes at 212 bpm for about 8 minutes isn't easy.

If you group all songs into easy, intermediate and advanced (as some people, not me personally though, like to do) it'd be intermediate including the fast solo.

I can find a lot of easier metal songs to play, and while it certaintly isn't the hardest of songs or a very hard metal song it isn't an easy song to play. I haven't seen anyone who's been playing under two years play it cleanly with downstrokes and the fast solo.
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Old 01-24-2011, 10:36 PM   #45
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Woohoo!!

After playing it only downstrokes for awhile (and chromatics) I can now play it downstroked ALMOST to speed.

Of course I had to warmup alot first....


I also find it helps to angle the picking hand...

Last edited by Sy_B : 01-24-2011 at 10:38 PM.
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Old 01-24-2011, 11:29 PM   #46
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I don't see the point of down picking? It seems that there's no reason as to why it should sound different to alternate picking. If it sounds different because you pick harder couldn't you just adjust the way you alternate pick and achieve the same sound?
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Old 01-24-2011, 11:48 PM   #47
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Well I guess there's a difference in the sound...a greater scraping attack or something. I just want to get better at it to be more well-rounded as a player, and it's working
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Old 01-25-2011, 12:04 AM   #48
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No but i mean couldn't you achieve that sound by adjusting your alternate picking? I don't see the point of learning an entirely new (and harder) way of playing things when simply you're not playing upstrokes hard enough. I haven't tested this as I don't do down picking but it seems like a waste of time.

Is the only advantage of this that it makes people hit the string harder? If so, why can't alternate picking sound the same if done correctly?

I don't want to waste time learning a technique if it's actually useless and is a substitute for not alternate picking properly.
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Old 01-25-2011, 12:18 AM   #49
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No no, I can alternate pick properly (well at least I'll find out when I put it up for critique later) I just want to learn this along with it. Plus, if you can improve your downstrokes, your alternate picking base speed also improves I think.

I think each way depends on their rhythm. You can only get so fast with your downpicking before your hand dies I think, and that's where alt picking comes in....the faster stuff.

Also gallops usually start with downpicking as a base and throw alt picking in there. If you played a gallop with only alternate picking you'd have to switch your ENTIRE speed just to keep up, and you may lose the rhythm, since it's good to always keep your hand moving, and at one speed.

Also, try playing a fast palmmuted rhythm. For me alternate picking up the strings doesn't work when it comes to that.

Last edited by Sy_B : 01-25-2011 at 12:20 AM.
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Old 01-25-2011, 01:36 AM   #50
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New question though about MoP and Metallica in general.

While live, and Hetfield is singing, and also playing...what does Hammett play?


I'd figure it's hard enough to play the song, but to sing it at the same time??? I'm wondering if Hammett mostly takes over when Hetfield sings, and Hetfield just has to worry about backing chords....

Or maybe I have it wrong, anyone?
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Old 01-25-2011, 01:41 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sy_B
New question though about MoP and Metallica in general.

While live, and Hetfield is singing, and also playing...what does Hammett play?


I'd figure it's hard enough to play the song, but to sing it at the same time??? I'm wondering if Hammett mostly takes over when Hetfield sings, and Hetfield just has to worry about backing chords....

Or maybe I have it wrong, anyone?

They just play the song as it's recorded. There's no "taking over" or anything like that, or they would have written the song differently in the first place. If during the song you only hear one riff such as the "spider riff" you posted, they're both playing it.
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Old 01-25-2011, 01:54 AM   #52
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Oh wow....

That's actually pretty intense....one thing to play it, but another to sing it and play. Until now I thought people only played and sung when the notes were a simple rhythm...like just chords over and over again.

How the hell do you do that???


So if there's really no limit to that kind of thing, can people do it during taxing solos too?
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Old 01-25-2011, 01:57 AM   #53
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It's all about practice.



This is Muhammed SuiÁmez from Necrophagist, an phenomenally skilled death metal guitarist who also does the vocals of the band. Quite frankly, Necrophagist makes Metallica look like kid's play. Not that Metallica is extremely easy, it's just that Necrophagist are monsters. It's seriously all about practice.
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Old 01-25-2011, 03:42 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by Sy_B
Oh wow....

That's actually pretty intense....one thing to play it, but another to sing it and play. Until now I thought people only played and sung when the notes were a simple rhythm...like just chords over and over again.

How the hell do you do that???


So if there's really no limit to that kind of thing, can people do it during taxing solos too?


Yes they can. People can sing over anything if they train to. And once they're good at it they can do it easier and easier every time.

And about what you said about down picking, I realise you make a different sound when you down pick and when you don't but what I want to know is WHY it could possibly sound different if you alternate pick it a certain way. Have you tried adjusting your upstroke to sound more like a downstroke?
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Old 01-25-2011, 06:45 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by neddomac
Yes they can. People can sing over anything if they train to. And once they're good at it they can do it easier and easier every time.

And about what you said about down picking, I realise you make a different sound when you down pick and when you don't but what I want to know is WHY it could possibly sound different if you alternate pick it a certain way. Have you tried adjusting your upstroke to sound more like a downstroke?


You could indeed adjust your upstrokes to make them sound like downstrokes but another upshot of downpicking is that certain rhythmic ideas become easier like galloping and putting gallops into rhythms where you feel like it, putting chords on certain beats so you don't have to jump over strings to pick them and, of course, if you can downpick for a whole song like Master Of Puppets you gain phenomenal amounts of picking hand stamina which is pretty key for any modern sounding metal band.

Yes, you could do it another way but there are advantages to downpicking well.
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Old 01-25-2011, 10:13 AM   #56
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I downpick most of the song but haven't quite got the stamina to do the 012013014 intro riff downpicked. I do it down down up (all E string notes down, all A up). Getting there though.
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Old 01-25-2011, 03:03 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by Zaphod_Beeblebr
You could indeed adjust your upstrokes to make them sound like downstrokes but another upshot of downpicking is that certain rhythmic ideas become easier like galloping and putting gallops into rhythms where you feel like it, putting chords on certain beats so you don't have to jump over strings to pick them and, of course, if you can downpick for a whole song like Master Of Puppets you gain phenomenal amounts of picking hand stamina which is pretty key for any modern sounding metal band.

Yes, you could do it another way but there are advantages to downpicking well.


Okay thanks. Maybe i'll try learning MOP this way, i've been playing for like over 6 months so I think i'm ready to start trying it. I just wanted to know what uses it has.

Plus I wanted to start getting into learning faster metal stuff already but didn't know where to start.

Do you know if you downpick the whole song except the solo?
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Old 01-25-2011, 03:06 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by neddomac
Okay thanks. Maybe i'll try learning MOP this way, i've been playing for like over 6 months so I think i'm ready to start trying it. I just wanted to know what uses it has.

Plus I wanted to start getting into learning faster metal stuff already but didn't know where to start.

Do you know if you downpick the whole song except the solo?

If it's an eighth note or slower, it's downpicked.
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Old 01-25-2011, 03:21 PM   #59
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Thanks man I just downloaded the GP tab.
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Old 01-25-2011, 04:02 PM   #60
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I recommend downpicking everything you play (as far as is possible) until you've got MOP down.

Then again, when you can play MOP all downpicked, you'll find you want to play more stuff all downpicked.
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