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Old 04-07-2005, 07:50 PM   #81
power freak
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Quote:
Originally posted by russiaininvader
If i were to compare two guitar speakers that had almost the same specs, but made from 2 different companies, could they still sound totally different?

Also, its possible to mix two different 12" speakers in a 2X12 cab to give a unique sound? thanks

lastly, for what was talked about trying to get the speaker rating close to what your amp is, how close do you have to be, is 60 close enough to 50, also, should i be trying to match the speakers RMS to my amp, or the max handling? thanks again

It depends on what specs are different really. Also the stiffness of the speaker and other mechanical factors play a part in the tone.

Yes however be warned that if you get speakers that don't fit together tonally you will get "fighting" and it will sound WORSE than two of the same speaker. Normally you want one bright speaker and one bassy speaker to equal eachother out. (Like a tweeter and woofer combo if you will.) However there is no way ot tell if the speakers will work together.

I don't believe that you need the power rating close to what you expect. I mean look at EV speakers extremely popular and are rated 200W each, people have these in 2 4x12 cabs and they still sound tighter than ever. Unless we are talking active speakers?
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Old 04-07-2005, 07:52 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally posted by russiaininvader
If i were to compare two guitar speakers that had almost the same specs, but made from 2 different companies, could they still sound totally different?
Also, its possible to mix two different 12" speakers in a 2X12 cab to give a unique sound? thanks
lastly, for what was talked about trying to get the speaker rating close to what your amp is, how close do you have to be, is 60 close enough to 50, also, should i be trying to match the speakers RMS to my amp, or the max handling? thanks again

Companys often issue the same spec to different speaker manufacturers so that if one company fails to deliver then they are not left without speakers, in the UK Carlsbro Powertone speakers were supplied by both Fane & Mckenzie, both performed identical.
You can widen the audio response from you guitar or Keyboard by putting a linen centre domed 12" and a second 12" with a parasitic cone in the middle, speakers with twin cones (parasitic) can reproduce frequencies in excess of 14khz it is advisable to have speakers of the same resonance though, ie both with linen surrounds.
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Old 04-08-2005, 02:41 PM   #83
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How hard is it to replace tolex? i know its going to be hard, real hard, but i can either change the scarred balck tolex out, or spray paint over it. any suggestions?
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Old 04-08-2005, 07:03 PM   #84
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Would it be best for a 2X12 to use an old 15" speaker in the back for it to breath, or is a big whole in the back best, OR does having a smaller hole/slot effect the sound on a guitar cab?

When using monster cable inside the cab, doesnt that just make the input jack the weak part, or the wire going to the head, or the wires inside? lol

Power freak you sure that the wattage doesnt have to be close between the speaker and cab, because i coulda sworn bubonic said it did
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Old 04-11-2005, 10:49 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally posted by russiaininvader
If i were to compare two guitar speakers that had almost the same specs, but made from 2 different companies, could they still sound totally different?

Also, its possible to mix two different 12" speakers in a 2X12 cab to give a unique sound? thanks

lastly, for what was talked about trying to get the speaker rating close to what your amp is, how close do you have to be, is 60 close enough to 50, also, should i be trying to match the speakers RMS to my amp, or the max handling? thanks again
Mixing is okay, but going with different manufacturers gets a little less predictable.

I would keep each speaker system consistent, meaning if you have a wire going from your output to a cabinet (or to a single plug in the cabinet), all of the drivers that are connected to that output are of the same exact specs and manufacturer.

Here's an example from my experience that may help:

Initially, I wired two 10" Peavey Scorpion speakers (a 4-ohm Parallel pair) as follows:

O=
||
O

What happened was, the speaker that had the two lead wires connected (a theoretically kosher design), actually carried less impedance than the other speaker, and consequently started to deteriorate. Thankfully, I noticed and fixed the problem, and the pair is now wired as follows:

O--
||
O--

Even two identical speakers, probably riding down the conveyor belt together at the same factory, and shipped in the same truck, carried different impedance because of a mere 5 inches of wire.

The one with the lower impedance got torn up.



So my advice is to keep the impedance as consistant as possible, especially on a single circuit.

If you have two different kinds of speakers, for a unique sound as you say (not a bad idea), I would suggest wiring it like this:

Speakers types A and B

---A----A---

---B----B---

(keep in mind that this diagram is highly generalized, it is still open to parallel, series or hybrid circuitry.)

Keep that impedance consistant on the circuit or you will pay for it!
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Old 04-11-2005, 11:05 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally posted by russiaininvader
Would it be best for a 2X12 to use an old 15" speaker in the back for it to breath, or is a big whole in the back best, OR does having a smaller hole/slot effect the sound on a guitar cab?

When using monster cable inside the cab, doesnt that just make the input jack the weak part, or the wire going to the head, or the wires inside? lol

Power freak you sure that the wattage doesnt have to be close between the speaker and cab, because i coulda sworn bubonic said it did
Wattage is not as important as impedance.

You can put 30W speakers on a 300W amp safely.

The problem is that going too far off the mark will blow something:

Big amp + small speakers (used irresponsibly) means the speakers will deteriorate...

Surrounds will break away, the cone will show wear, eventually the driver just falls apart (or blows up on you very quickly.)

Small amp + big speakers means the speakers MAY demand too much juice from the amp, and you may blow the amp, if the DC (direct current) signal from the distorted amp doesn't fry the delicate wires in the speakers first...or both.

It's recommended to use exactly matched if not smaller speakers because you're better off frying speakers than amps, if you fry anything (speakers are cheaper), and speakers will let you know when they are in pain. They sound like shit. Amps don't warn you, they just stop working and you smell something hot.

Monster Cable: is a fad product. A good product, I can't argue with that, but a product whose virtues are exaggerated by the manufacturer and the retail industry (and why not, it's expensive cable.)

Good stuff if you can afford it, but considering you're connecting gold-plated, cryogrenically treated Star Trek wire to a big-assed glob of lead (solder), it's pretty pointless, if you think about it.

Solder is a poor conductor.

(Poor condutor) - Great conductor - (Poor conductor)

Unless you get gold solder (does this even exist?) and wire every component in your amp with gold, monster cable is a wasted effort.

..but it's cheap enough (relatively) that it's up to you. I wouldn't worry with it. Go to Home Depot and buy some 8-gauge electrical wire for putting a chandelier in your fourier. The difference in performance is going to be negligible.

And if 8-guage monster cable at $8 a foot (or whatever) is 3% better than 8-gauge electrical wire at $.20 a foot, go with 6-gauge electrical wire at $.50 a foot.

Want more performance, better conductivity? Go up a gauge.

Porting: I can't stress enough that porting is only important for certain applications, namely bass or keyboard cabs, high-end monitors or full-range PA speakers, etc. Things that are going to have a lot of bass energy happening.

Their purpose is to allow the cab to breathe. If all you're doing is building a guitar cab, think about the way Fender's classic combos are built:

Amp on top, wired in a rectangular box with 2 X 12" speakers with a big-ass hole in back.

Fender combos sound sweet!! They have no port.

Granted, porting may allow you to have a more accurate, modern or "full spectrum" sound. There are advantages, and certainly the Fender cabs have some holes in the frequency response (hell, they were built fairly cheaply.)

Still, if it aint broke, as they say....

If you do port, refer to John Swift's info on that. He knows his stuff.

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Old 04-11-2005, 07:16 PM   #87
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How hard is it to replace tolex? i know its going to be hard, real hard, but i can either change the scarred balck tolex out, or spray paint over it. any suggestions?

i posted that further up on the page, no one answered it
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Old 04-11-2005, 07:21 PM   #88
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Originally posted by WishIHadAGibson
How hard is it to replace tolex? i know its going to be hard, real hard, but i can either change the scarred balck tolex out, or spray paint over it. any suggestions?i posted that further up on the page, no one answered it
The first job is to get the old stuff off and get back to a good surface.
A good water based wood adhesive is suitable and can be applied with a paint brush, roll out any air pockets or scrape them out with a straight edge.
If you have not done it before it is just trial and error
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Old 04-14-2005, 08:48 AM   #89
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ok thanks you guys, so would a 60watt speaker be ok for a 50 watt amp if the impedance matched? thanks
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Old 04-16-2005, 07:49 AM   #90
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Does anyone have a picture of a fully finished cabinet they've made?
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Old 04-16-2005, 05:38 PM   #91
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well ifyou can stand to wait for a few months i should have my project up and running
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Old 04-16-2005, 05:41 PM   #92
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Does anyone have a picture of a fully finished cabinet they've made?
I'd post mine if somebody told me how to do it!

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Old 04-16-2005, 06:00 PM   #93
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Th only way I know to post a pic is to get an image hosting server (www.photobucket.com is a good one) and put [IMG] before and [/IMG] after the link
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Old 04-16-2005, 06:05 PM   #94
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please can some one tell me if a 60watt speaker is close enough to a 50 watt amp if the impedences matched?!?!?
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Old 04-16-2005, 06:53 PM   #95
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please can some one tell me if a 60watt speaker is close enough to a 50 watt amp if the impedences matched?!?!?
Yes it is if it is the specific type of loudspeaker for what you intend to use it for (if it is for bass then it must be a bass speaker)
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Old 04-16-2005, 08:50 PM   #96
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thank you very much
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Old 04-17-2005, 08:24 PM   #97
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i have a fender deville 4-10 amp and i have been thinking of making a 2-12 extension cab what would be the correct wattage and ohms for the speakers i need?
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Old 04-17-2005, 09:11 PM   #98
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i have a fender deville 4-10 amp and i have been thinking of making a 2-12 extension cab what would be the correct wattage and ohms for the speakers i need?
If your amp has an extension speaker output it will tell you the required impedence of the extension speaker cab.
At a guess I would say that your 4x10s are 8 ohms each and are wired in series parallel giving an 8 ohm load, wiring another pair of 8 ohm speakers in series and connecting them via the extension socket will give a total impedence of around 5.3 ohms your amp should be quite happy with that.
I would go for the lowest wattage speakers that you can find, these will require less enrgy to drive them therefore producing more sound (DBs) level.
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Old 04-17-2005, 09:16 PM   #99
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so how does 2 12" celestion greenbacks sound?
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Old 04-17-2005, 09:22 PM   #100
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so how does 2 12" celestion greenbacks sound?
do you know the wattage and size of voice coil?
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