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Old 06-29-2015, 02:59 PM   #1
progbass
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Metal Forum Primers

Hello lads

It seems we could tidy up a bit and get some more traffic going in a positive direction. I present to you the idea of metal forum genre primers. The idea is to create a collection of compilation albums that serve as gateways to particular genres of extreme and underground metal in a condensed method for neophytes to get a taste of what each subset has to offer. While the rec thread proves to be an excellent resource for exploring genres, this offers a stepping stone to getting one's feet wet before diving in.

The goal is to construct a handful of albums of like minded compositions in a particular genre that promote active listening, listening to full albums, and having a variety of flavors that paint a favorable picture of the broad strokes that can be achieved (opposed to variety for the sake of it).

What I need from you (yes, you) is what genres we should cover, the length each compilation should be, and of course, what songs encapsulate the essence of their respective genre.

So, what say you?
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Old 06-29-2015, 06:23 PM   #2
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The genres should probably be most of what is on the recommendation list. The obvious list would be at least Heavy Metal, Power Metal, Death Metal, Folk Metal, Black Metal, Thrash Metal, Progressive Metal, and Loin Cloth Manly Man Metal.

The time will have to depend on how many bands/songs are on them. Probably have at least an hour and a half or two hours per compilation since it's a fair bit of time but only the equivalent of 3 or so normal metal albums.
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Old 06-29-2015, 06:30 PM   #3
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This sounds right up my alley. If anyone is interested, we could even make youtube compilation vids for each album. (I've never made a youtube vid however). But we could make it a series. Maybe get a hit or two.

I say as far as genres go, I say we stick to the ones in the rec thread for the most part. Anyone who wants to make more specialized albums are free to do so, subject to the approval of the hall of course.
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Old 06-29-2015, 08:52 PM   #4
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I do like the YouTube idea and thought about putting that into the opening post.

I agree wholeheartedly with pulling from albums listed in the rec thread (further cementing it's usefulness).

What I seem to take issue with is the proposed length. Keep in mind the target audience is neophytes who aren't accustomed to sitting in one place doing nothing but listening for 1-1.5 hours. It most certainly is possible with discipline, but I am working under the assumption that the target audience does not have that discipline and was aiming for 45-60 min.

This would mean possibly splitting death metal into 2 parts (European and American) as they are fairly separate entities aesthetically. Same could be done for Speed metal and Crossover thrash, Heavy Metal and NWOBHM maybe (I'm not well versed in that area).

More input needed. Keep the ideas flowing, and of course, even if I say no to something, if enough ratify it as a good idea, we go with that. Unless of course something is just objectively better at achieving the prime directive. Then we just use that.
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Old 06-29-2015, 09:29 PM   #5
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I was going to suggest limiting them to 60 mins. power metal should also be split into European and USPM.
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Old 06-30-2015, 06:49 AM   #6
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I'm a big fan of Melodic Black Metal, so it would be nice to see something on that. It should cover beyond basics (Dissection and Sacramentum). Artefact is a good example and I think Der Weg Einer Freiheit would also fit into the Melodic Black Metal category. I think the compilations should be no more than 30 minutes and each track/piece should be very unique and identifiable.
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Old 06-30-2015, 07:58 AM   #7
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Fair enough about the time. I was trying to think how much we would really be able to get on it from a lot of bands, but about an hour would probably work well enough since most metal bands dont have ludicrous song lengths.

Splitting the scenes would be a good idea as long as it doesnt get carried away(e.g. florida death metal new york death metal canadian death metal swedish death metal) and would separate comps for first and second wave black metal be necessary?
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Old 06-30-2015, 08:30 AM   #8
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First wave of extreme metal in all reality I think can be lumped together. Celtic Frost, Bathory and the like all sort of pioneered it and each lent credence to the sound. We can most certainly drum up a half hour to 45 minutes of material.

Hayden, why do you suggest 30 min as opposed to say 45?

I do think there is enough separation to warrant a black metal split in regards to melodic (Sacramentum, Dissection, Necromass, etc) from standard (Profanatica, Burzum, Mayhem, Darkthrone).


And again, I'll have to take your word on the power metal split.

And yes, in reference to the splits, I agree that we shouldn't be to autistic with it, as Death, Morbid Angel, Massacra, Suffocation and Autopsy all really belong on the same album.
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Old 06-30-2015, 02:11 PM   #9
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I'd like to help out with these.

One suggestion I have is that we stick to the undisputed classics to avoid clogging things up with everyone's pet favourites. Judging by the rec thread, this may be a sticking point in heavy metal and thrash metal in particular, because bands like Black Sabbath, Judas Priest and Slayer have been relegated to starting points despite being better than some of the bands in best of.

I also agree that the compilations should be short and therefore easy to digest, and their focus could be limited to narrower styles in some cases.
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Old 06-30-2015, 03:23 PM   #10
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Are we ignoring the deathcore section or not?
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Old 06-30-2015, 03:33 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supertom1
Are we ignoring the deathcore section or not?


I'm not an expert on this style, I've tried it but just could only find a few bands I cared for so take this with a grain of salt, but I don't think there's enough "quality" content to warrant a compilation and most people get into that music pretty easily when they start listening to metal anyway so it's not really necessary. I don't really know if it a melodeath primer would be necessary either.
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Old 06-30-2015, 04:15 PM   #12
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Death core is not unlike the American metalcore scene that spawned it, which is at heart an evolution of the nu metal bands and Pantera. As such, the primers are directed at such for said listeners who wish to cut their teeth on the nuances of the metal scene as opposed to brushing the tip of the iceberg.

Same could be said for melodeff, which is far removed from Melodic Death Metal (comparing In Flames and Dark Tranquility to early Septicflesh and Tritsio)
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Old 07-01-2015, 03:12 AM   #13
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I would say 30 to 45 minutes sounds logical for a novice listener....1 hour might be a bit too much especially for some of the less melodic styles. Of course if we are playing ambient folk stuff like Agalloch that particular primer could well be an hour to maximise it's effect and also considering the longer songs on offer.
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Old 07-01-2015, 04:12 AM   #14
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@progbass: Well 30 mins is (usually) the upper limit for an EP, which is generally considered a "teaser" for many artists. 45 or 60 mins is fine but most people can decide whether they think there is more worth delving into after 30 minutes. I think if we're smart about how we divide the scenes/eras then we should be able to fit a nice variety of each sub-genre in appropriately.
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Old 07-01-2015, 11:37 AM   #15
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I can agree to that, the explanation is logical. It seems enough people seem on board as well. So let's start phase ii - actively defining the headers of each comp. So far -

American Heavy Metal
New Wave of British Heavy Metal
Speed
Crossover Thrash
DOOM
First Wave of Extreme Metal
American Death Metal
European Death Metal / Melodic Death Metal
2nd Wave of Black Metal
Grind Metal

Thoughts, additions, subtractions, etc?
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Old 07-01-2015, 01:05 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by progbass
I can agree to that, the explanation is logical. It seems enough people seem on board as well. So let's start phase ii - actively defining the headers of each comp. So far -

American Heavy Metal
New Wave of British Heavy Metal
Speed
Crossover Thrash
DOOM
First Wave of Extreme Metal
American Death Metal
European Death Metal / Melodic Death Metal
2nd Wave of Black Metal
Grind Metal

Thoughts, additions, subtractions, etc?

Question? Are you defining the Thrash era of 1982ish to 1990 as part of "First Wave of Extreme Metal"? If not, I'm wondering about the omission...
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Old 07-01-2015, 01:06 PM   #17
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This would be fun but I don't think it would accomplish anything beyond being just that, fun.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crazysam23_Atax
Question? Are you defining the Thrash era of 1982ish to 1990 as part of "First Wave of Extreme Metal"? If not, I'm wondering about the omission...


ANUS subscribers like to call that stuff Speed Metal.
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Old 07-01-2015, 02:18 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Morphogenesis26
I'm not an expert on this style, I've tried it but just could only find a few bands I cared for so take this with a grain of salt, but I don't think there's enough "quality" content to warrant a compilation and most people get into that music pretty easily when they start listening to metal anyway so it's not really necessary. I don't really know if it a melodeath primer would be necessary either.


Totally, yeah. While there are qualit bands within the deathcore genre, such as The Red Chord, The Faceless (funnily enough I'm listening to Akeldama right now lol ), Animosity and maybe JFaC (although they only really took it to the next level after going straight-out DM), the genre, to me anyways, seems to have an air of 'ameturism' about it. Maybe we could do a compilation of good deathcore bands, I dunno.
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Last edited by supertom1 : 07-01-2015 at 02:20 PM.
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Old 07-01-2015, 03:02 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by progbass
Thoughts, additions, subtractions, etc?

American Power Metal
European Power Metal

I can provide examples of the differences in aesthetic if needed.
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Old 07-01-2015, 03:41 PM   #20
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Could you explain it to me? I haven't really ventured that way and your primer and explanation could open that door for me. I've certainly seen the name drops around but haven't really gotten around to it.

Edit -

Speed would be your Exodus, Kreator, Destruction, etc

First wave - Celtic Frost/Hellhammer, Bathory, Slayer's Hell Awaits, etc

And @vg - yes it is fun, it'll promote discussion amongst regs, and it can be used as a resource depending on how much people circulate it both within and outside UG. I know I've used the Rec thread as a basis for other things and projects outside of just directing people of this forum. And if it encourages the listening and promotion of Hessian culture, then by all means I approve.
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