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Old 09-11-2012, 06:10 AM   #1
adstr123
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Changing my Setup to Fit New Musical Taste

TL;DR AT THE END I never was very good at being concise...

So, it's been a while since I was round here, mostly because I got bored of guitar... And I want to pick it up again. However, my music taste has changed and I'd like to change my setup to play some new stuff.

Currently I have a Marshall DSL401 and an Epiphone Explorer. I also have a Zack Qylde OD to push the tubes a bit harder in my Marshall. This is great for classic rock but I'm more into harder stuff, hard rock & metal mostly.

I want to switch to a high gain setup. I don't believe I will be able to get this out of my Marshall, so I will sell it and get a new amp. As for the guitar, I am considering just throwing some thicker strings on it and putting a couple of BKP Nailbombs in it for higher gain and better tone, or buying an entirely new guitar.

I'm not sure what I should do or what I should get... I have looked at the Peavey 6505+ 112 combo and the Ashdown Fallen Angel combo. I WANT AN ALL TUBE AMP. This is essential. Once you go valve, you never go back haha.

Amp budget: 300
Guitar budget: 220 for Nailbombs & upgrade, or 300ish for new guitar.
Willing to go used?: Certainly
Area: Oxford, England
Used for: Home practice and some light casual gigging

TL;dr
Change current setup to play metal
Looking to sell amp; which new one should I get?
Looking to either switch up pups in Explorer, or buy a new guitar entirely
Advice

Thanks!
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Old 09-11-2012, 01:24 PM   #2
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You should be fine with the explorer for now. What kind of metal are we talking about? Heavy riffage and rhythm stuff, or shreddy leads all over the place? If the former, the explorer doesn't need to go anywhere yet, if the latter, you may want to consider something new but still not necessarily. Also, don't buy new pickups until after you get the new amp and play with it a bit with your current pickups. You'll probably still want new ones, but it's best to change one thing at a time.

If you don't really need cleans, then look at the 6505, not the 6505+. It has less headroom, and (I could be wrong) I think it's cheaper.

Have you tried using your current setup to get the sound you're looking for? What exactly doesn't work for you? I can't see why and OD with the Marshall wouldn't get you most of the way there, unless it's just the general tonality/characteristics you don't like. When is the last time you changed tubes in the Marshall?
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Old 09-11-2012, 03:21 PM   #3
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Exactly what types of metal do you want to play?

Are you currently using your OD correctly? (Volume max, Gain 0, into the high gain channel on the DSL401?)
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:08 AM   #4
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Hey guys, sorry for late response.

I like heavy riffage mostly over shredding to be honest. Trying the Explorer with a new amp before switching pickups is a good idea too, never thought about getting amp/pickups at different times. Perhaps the Explorer will be ok, I'll try it.

I have tried using my current setup to get the sound I want, and yes, that is how I have been using the OD. The problem is not really the level of gain I am getting, it's mostly the tone. The Marshall DSL401 sounds quite muddy to me there's a lot of bass. The stock speaker is also not that great and the sound is very "flabby" - not tight and defined, things seem to blend into eachother. Also, at high volumes when you start getting power valve distortion, the distortion sounds quite fuzzy/hissy, but this isn't a problem at lower volumes.

The tubes were changed about 12 -18 months ago now (can't exactly remember), which would mean they are due for another switch now/recently. However for the past 8 - 10 months I have not really picked it up more than once a month for an hours playing at a time. The problems I described were there before anyway. As I say, mostly the tone is just not for me.
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Old 09-12-2012, 12:28 PM   #5
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You should try a Celestion V30 speaker, maybe you could borrow a cab with that kind of speaker and see how that helps?
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Old 09-12-2012, 04:59 PM   #6
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if ur problem is muddiness turn down the gain. you'd be surprised how some bands arent actually has high gain as they seem to be. i've been able to get some pretty killer tones out of messing around with a jvm 410h at guitar center here and there. granted there may be a bit of a difference, i'm will to bet that a TS and some new tubes should do the trick. maybe a speaker swap as well for a little tighter of a response.

now if you do in fact decide you need a new amp, then the 6505+ is obviously going to be the "go-to" metal amp. do some searching around and try some stuff out. keep ur eyes open for jcm 800's, 6505/6505+, mesa dual rec's, etc.

just keep in mind that you dont always need as much gain as you think you do. when i started to realize that i was MUCH happier with my tone. much clearer and tighter and had a l alot less fizz
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Old 09-12-2012, 05:03 PM   #7
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nailbombs are very expensive if you don't have a massive amp budget

i'd avoid the fallen angel- it has a pretty poor reputation regarding its design and reliability etc.

the peavey would work

thomann has good deals on the jet city stuff, they seem to be getting them back into stock soon.

swapping the speaker in the marshall first (or better yet, borrowing a decent cab, as perverockstar69 suggested) might be worth a try, though. just in case it'd help.
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Old 09-12-2012, 05:11 PM   #8
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Old 09-12-2012, 06:04 PM   #9
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Please help us help you.

"Heavy riffage" doesn't mean anything. Judas Priest and Trivium could both be considered heavy riffage, but you're sure as hell not going to get both of those sounds out of one amp.
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Old 09-18-2012, 07:25 AM   #10
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Again, apologies for the late reply, I'm skipping around out of town here there and everywhere right now.

Ok, here's some bands I like, with links to particular sections of songs I like. I'm sorry for not being specific enough, I remember how annoying this used to be so I should have known better haha. On the heavier end:

Machine Head - (I like the clarity of the notes in the intro, and then the tone carries right through and works well for the heavier riff directly after).
While She Sleeps - (Pretty simple guitar but the tone is nice and full, if you know what I mean)
Gojira - (Riffs & single notes are nice and defined, my Marshall would run all the intro into eachother and it would sound together)

And on the lighter side, hangover from my old musical taste I suppose:

GnR - (Because you know... How can you not like Slash's tone?)
Philip Sayce - (That was the only video I could find with the song. He has more of a fuzzy tone than a metal one though so I imagine I'd have to get that through a fuzz pedal rather than from the amp itself in this case.)
Buckethead - (This is is actually pretty high gain from the amp, but he keeps adjusting the volume knobs so I put it here for overall tone. This level of gain sounds so awesome, sounds like the guitar will break into fits of uncontrollable feedback at any moment, and he keeps reeling it in. I love this guy.)

I hope that helps a little more.
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Old 09-18-2012, 01:00 PM   #11
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it's gonna be hard to get all that with your budget

which is more important, the lower gain tones or higher gain?
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Old 09-19-2012, 01:47 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_Mc
it's gonna be hard to get all that with your budget

which is more important, the lower gain tones or higher gain?


I understand. The tone is fairly varied. Probably higher gain.

I have seen Peavey 6505+ 112s (I do like the tone on them quite a lot) go on eBay for 300 - 350, which I suppose I could get if I'm lucky, but I had a quick check now and there aren't any used ones up for sale.

What do you recommend I do, instead? Budget can't really stretch that much right now.
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Old 09-19-2012, 02:31 PM   #13
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Boosted 6505 would be the way to go. Get the 112 combo and a joyo vintage overdrive. Don't put BKPs into a 'lower' end guitar.
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Old 09-19-2012, 02:59 PM   #14
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^ yeah 6505+ 112 is probably worth considering- i've only tried the american-made (dearer) heads, though.

jet city might be worth considering, too- thomann has some good prices on them, the 50 watt 1x12 combo is probably the one you want (it's the combo version of the 50 watt head, though i should stress i've only tried the head, I'm taking jet city's word on that ). They're not just as out-and-out brootal as the 6505 (though i wouldn't call them vintage, either, they have tons of gain, just they're more "hair metal" type of high gain whereas the 6505 is more "death metal").
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Old 09-19-2012, 05:11 PM   #15
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I was about to recommend a 5150 III, but then I looked back up at your budget.

For that amount of tonal diversity and the budget you have to work with, I say just get a Vypyr Tube.

As long as you're not using the amp primarily for gigging, the 6505+ 112 combo isn't going to give you anything significantly better in the tone department.

Actually, if anything, the Vypyr will perform a lot better in a home situation than a 6505.
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Old 09-20-2012, 11:49 AM   #16
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Jet City amps sound pretty decent and the reviews are good, and I'll check out the Vypyr Tube. But perhaps I should just wait and make do with what I have. There is no point in changing things up if I'm not going to get the whole setup I want, and I am thinking of just saving up until I can afford something better.

Plus I gave the 5150 III tone a listen... Dear god. I want one. Kinda made me realise I should perhaps just wait. There is one used on eBay right now starting at 350 (reserve not met) so perhaps it is not too far out of my grasp if I am patient.

Thanks for all the advice guys
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Old 09-20-2012, 11:52 AM   #17
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yeah that would be worth considering too (upping the budget).

Just bear in mind that at the price of the 5150 III you have a lot of killer options (I haven't tried the 5150 III).
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Old 09-20-2012, 11:59 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adstr123
Plus I gave the 5150 III tone a listen... Dear god. I want one. Kinda made me realise I should perhaps just wait. There is one used on eBay right now starting at 350 (reserve not met) so perhaps it is not too far out of my grasp if I am patient.

Thanks for all the advice guys


You would be stupidly lucky if it was anywhere near your budget. You'll also have to factor in a cab to go along with the head.
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Old 09-20-2012, 12:37 PM   #19
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You would be stupidly lucky if it was anywhere near your budget. You'll also have to factor in a cab to go along with the head.


I know, I was just mentioning. The 6505+ is still an option too.

Also, whilst we're here, how the hell is Dave_MC not some sort of higher authority yet? I remember you from 2 years ago, and just found a PM to me giving me advice when I was first purchasing my Explorer, and you're still dishing out quality advice? I don't remember other names from this thread but you were all equally marvellous haha, just thought I'd mention that. Are the forums quieter these days? Seems to be the same names cropping up... Perhaps there is no need for more mods.
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Old 09-20-2012, 01:21 PM   #20
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oh i was a mod ages back but i kinda got fired/quit/bit of both (depending on who you ask )

I appreciate the thought, though

there's a cheaper 50 watt version of the 5150 III on thomann around the 700 mark. Seems to be a bit lighter on features, but the basic gist seems to be the same. Whether it's actually the same as the bigger one, though, I dunno. As I said, I haven't tried them.
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