Go Back   UG Community @ Ultimate-Guitar.Com > Music > Musician Talk
User Name  
Password
Search:

Reply
Old 10-05-2012, 01:05 AM   #1
Unreal T
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
songwriting order

When you are songwriting does your finished song usually end up in the order of the riffs, melodies, chords etc you came up with. Like do you stumble upon a riff that might work well as an into, then stumble upon something else that will work right after that for a pre verse or verse?

It feels natural to me to do things in order. Like for instance I cannot come up with a chorus and then if I wanted an intro and bridge, have to build around it. Because if you think about it you are telling a story and usually stories are told from beginning to end right?

I know that you can obviously add parts with lead guitar after most of a song is structured but I am just speaking in generally.

Last edited by Unreal T : 10-05-2012 at 01:07 AM.
Unreal T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 02:58 AM   #2
Deth5ever
I am Jack's witty title
 
Deth5ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
For me it changes every song, sometimes ill right in order then others ill dig out old riffs to fill up a spot or whatever. Its different for everyone, there is no right or wrong way to compose
Deth5ever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 03:15 AM   #3
plitedextrosity
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
All on how it feels for me really, I enjoy collaborating w others, no matter the instrument...to say one would get a riff or rhythm, and the other would join in, but then would take the lead for he next segment while the other then does the following....but when I compose alone, I'm usually finding that my end product, though still loosely based on the initial impression is different....
plitedextrosity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 06:42 AM   #4
Sleepy__Head
A cornucopia of trivia
 
Sleepy__Head's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Butt****, SY
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unreal T
When you are songwriting does your finished song usually end up in the order of the riffs, melodies, chords etc you came up with.


Mostly not, except sometimes.

I do have the odd occasion where start point leads to end point in a linear fashion but on the whole even though stories are told from beginning to end but they're not necessarily written that way. Most professional writers (novellists, journalists, lyricists) re-write - and possibly re-organise - what they've written when their first draft is complete. Same's true of professional songwriters.

If I'm writing riffs, for example, I'll write them all out individually, cut out the bits of paper they're written on, lay them out on the floor then try them in different orders.
If I'm writing lyrics I'll take bits out of my hook book, maybe bits that didn't make it into other songs, bits out of things like Brewers Dictionary of Phrase and Fable - whatever I can find - and shift them around until they look right. This could take a couple of goes or as many as twenty - it all depends on how inspired I am, how long I get each evening to work on stuff, and how certain I am on the structure.

In fact the song structure is probably the thing that's most set in stone when I write, but even there I'll try and keep a degree of flexibility until I'm absolutely certain I'm happy with what's written. Sometimes I'll just lift the structure from someone else's song & copy it (2-bar pre-chorus, 8-bar chorus, 4-bar turnaround, &c.); sometimes I'll write a riff and try and grow the structure around that riff until I have a number of riffs I'm happy with and can start shaping into something a bit more finished.

Even things like the arrangement can cause me to radically re-think what I've written. This is partly because when I write I usually try and write on the acoustic (even if it's a metal song) because I tend to think that if what you've got can stand up with just voice and acoustic guitar then it's good to go. Thing is, when it comes to arranging acoustic & vox for two distorted guitars, bass, drums, vox, backing vox & maybe some keys/synths then it can often sound a bit overly 'chordy' and require further riffage which can spark further ideas that make me want to re-write certain sections, or even just get rid of them and replace them with something else. Even mixing can make me realise that something's not right and that I have further re-writing to do.

Writing is mainly re-writing even if performance is always linear.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hail
oh shut up with that /mu/ bullshit. fidget house shouldn't even be a genre, why in the world would it deserve its own subgenres you twat
Sleepy__Head is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 07:53 AM   #5
J-Dawg158
UG's Resident Dhampyr
 
J-Dawg158's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
I very rarely write things in order. Most of the time what will come to me is either a hook or cool sounding riff that ends up being the chorus & I just build up around that. Doesn't really matter where you start crafting at as long as you get a good quality product in the end. Besides, how many stories/movies start out at the end and then re-tell how things got to that point?

I usually compose my guitar solos, but even then I will sometimes bounce around & find a good opening lick & closing lick & jam in the middle. Also like everyone else has said it varies from song to song. I just build off of whatever part I think of first whether its intro or outro or what have you.
__________________
I'm an
Engeneer
Enginear
Enginere

I'm Good at Math
J-Dawg158 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 12:13 PM   #6
HotspurJr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unreal T
When you are songwriting does your finished song usually end up in the order of the riffs, melodies, chords etc you came up with. Like do you stumble upon a riff that might work well as an into, then stumble upon something else that will work right after that for a pre verse or verse?


A lot of my songs start with some sort of "seed" which is a guitar part, a chord change, a rhythm, a bit of bassline, or something like that. Sometimes it's a hook or a fragment of melody.

From that seed, I have found that my songwriting is most effective if I look for the melody next, and, in terms of looking for the melody, I look for the hook.

For me, and YMMV, spending too much time developing the chords and rhythm before I have the melody tends to get in the way of developing the melody.

One I have the hook, I use is to build out the melody. Using the lyrics are taking shape during this time, and then I use the melody to build out the chords.

THe lyrics are still being tweaked while I work out the structure, which is usually pretty easy. And then over the next couple of days I'll probably tweak a few lyrics before I'm done.
HotspurJr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 05:28 PM   #7
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
 
axemanchris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
I start with lyrics and melodies. Riffs and chord changes and stuff basically suggest themselves from there.

CT
__________________
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by firehawk
Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
axemanchris is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:36 PM.

Forum Archives / About / Terms of Use / Advertise / Contact / Ultimate-Guitar.Com © 2014
Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.0.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.