King Of Suede

These are the words my friend used to describe what some musicians use to play "out" or play things that sound out.

He also referenced Eddie Harris's "Freedom Jazz Dance" and that this tune's melody was basically an exercise in that theory.
I know the whole song is just a Bb7 chord, but I don't have the music to look at the melody.

Could someone quick outline what my friend was trying to say?
I'm guessing it has something to do with super-imposing chords over a chord using the chord tones (is chord even a word any more?) in some sort of non-diatonic fashion... But not sure exactly how to go about it.

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AlanHB

I dunno - accidentals? There's only 5 in each key.

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And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.

GoldenGuitar

A quick check from my realbook says, for bar 1-8, the chords that can be played are Bb7(alt),Bb13#9#11, Bb7sus or Bb7sus(b9).
It says the alternate changes that can be played over bars 9-12 are
Absus/Bb Asus/B, Bbsus/C, Bsus/C#, ect. But the slashes in the chart are ambiguously done, I can't tell whether it's a horizontal slash indicating two chords over each other or a diagonal one indicating a bass note. Those chords alone indicate he is just moving down chromatically, and this is probably also reflected in the melody. But I recommend that you DON'T trust a realbook, they're often not reliable or inaccurate. So go transcribe the melody for it yourself!

King Of Suede

Nah, the melodies in the Real Book are normally pretty solid. Some are as they are on the recordings, some are made plain so you can expand on them.

The changes are by no means a doctrine to follow. But meh the 4 chords you listed for Bb plus just a plain Bb7 WOULD be 5 chords... And I see where thats coming from I guess.
I dunno, I'll talk to my teacher about it this week. Thanks for your help though.

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mattrusso

FYI, GoldenGuitar is totally right about the Real Book being wrong a lot. It's definitely a great tool to have, but versions have a lot of errors. Always check it against a recording. I think (at least in the book I have) the melody of Freedom Jazz Dance is correct, though.

As for the actual thread topic, I've never heard of this, but it seems like your friend may have meant 5 as in the V chord of a key, not 5 different chords. I think what he's really talking about it just dominant chords in general.

If I had to guess, this "theory" is just playing different tensions on dominant chords. Freedom Jazz Dance is, in fact, a great example of this. The whole song is over a Bb7 chord, but the tensions keep changing. It goes through every possible tension (9, b9, #9, #11, 13, b13) and some parts where a sus4 is implied. This is specific to dominant chords because they have the widest variety of possible tensions.

In a practical way, this means you can superimpose different dominant scales over dominant chords to get a more "outside" sound. Here's a list of some:

(An "S" means you shouldn't hang on a note for too long - it should usually just be a passing/approach note. In this case, because of the nature of these scales, it'll usually be the 4th degree. If you want a sus4 sound, avoid the 3rd instead.)

Mixolydian ("default" dominant scale): 1 T9 3 S4 5 T13 b7

Lydian b7: 1 T9 3 T#11 5 T13 b7

Mixo. b9/#9 (not used very much - usually chords with these tensions use Symmetric Dominant): 1 Tb9 T#9 3 S4 5 T13 b7

Mixo. b9/#9, b13 ("Phrygian Dominant"): 1 Tb9 T#9 3 S4 5 Tb13 b7

Altered (notice there's no 4th degree!): 1 Tb9 T#9 3 b5 Tb13 b7

Symmetric Dominant (aka 1/2-W Diminished): 1 Tb9 T#9 3 T#11 5 T13 b7

Whole Tone (all whole steps, hence the name): 1 T9 3 T#11 Tb13 b7

Note that enharmonic spellings of tensions and chord tones are often used, and are sometimes misleading. For example, a chord that is intended to use Lydian b7 will sometimes be written as a 7b5 instead of 7#11. 7b5 implies that there is no natural 5 in the scale, but the 7#11 symbol tells us that we can play both the #11 and the natural 5. If you suspect that this is going on, the melody is a good place to look for hints.

You can also use these scales to create chord voicings.

Now, I'm sure that in time, someone who claims that "scales and modes don't exist" is going to come along and shit on everything I just said, (this always happens when I post in this forum) but I personally use this stuff all the time, and I like to share it. Some of the greatest musicians of all time (George Russell, Miles, Coltrane, Bill Evans, Art Farmer, and so many others) and the vast majority of modern contemporary (non-classical) music theorists just happen to agree with me. Sure, your playing will be boring if all you do is go up and down scales, but they're just a jumping off point. Enjoy!

GoldenGuitar

I'm not going to chew you out or anything, in fact I actually agree with what you're saying. There's nothing wrong with giving TS a framework of something he can play over those changes, but it is up to him to make it musical.
The problem with modes and scales are that too many beginners think that scales are magical, and if they know them, they can get certain sounds (well not exactly untrue, stuff like whole tone ect.) or be musical. Which of course isn't true.