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Old 11-14-2012, 02:36 AM   #81
NakedInTheRain
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Old 11-14-2012, 03:22 AM   #82
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:04 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Arby911
Buy new if you want to, won't bother me a bit, but lets not pretend there's some ethical nobility attached, because that's utter horseshit.


Oh i agree- I don't think there's any nobility to buying new.

I'm saying I think the people who act like clones are immoral but buying used isn't are full of shit, too. that's all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathbard
Stopping somebody from buying something because they can't afford to buy it new actually is an ethical/moral issue.


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Old 11-14-2012, 12:06 PM   #84
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How about pets? Can you buy a used pet? Should we just put all the used pets down so we can all get new ones?
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:11 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by Blktiger0
<Huge wall of defensive text>


We looked at the thread title, looked at your arguments and lumped you in with the TS.

Lie down with dogs, get up with fleas...











Quote:
Originally Posted by tubetime86
How about pets? Can you buy a used pet? Should we just put all the used pets down so we can all get new ones?


Get a NEW pet, eat the old one...best of both worlds...
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:18 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arby911
Get a NEW pet, eat the old one...best of both worlds...

Now how do we apply that to amps...
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Unless its electronic drums.

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Old 11-14-2012, 06:35 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by tubetime86
How about pets? Can you buy a used pet? Should we just put all the used pets down so we can all get new ones?

this is actually a huge issue to me. and also adopting kids. if my future wife and i can't get pregnant the usual way, **** ivf. adopting.
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:36 PM   #88
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Used children... That conjures up thoughts other than adoption...
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:37 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by tubetime86
Now how do we apply that to amps...

we all need to learn to build amps and cannibalise the old ones for parts
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:37 PM   #90
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Used children... That conjures up thoughts other than adoption...

oh for ****'s sake you're horrible.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:06 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arby911
We looked at the thread title, looked at your arguments and lumped you in with the TS.

Lie down with dogs, get up with fleas...



So that means that when someone asks why MG's are horrible, and you post in their thread that oyu agree with them that MG's aren't horrible?

In fact, I got dragged into this thread without consent. Not that I expected TS to ask me to use a quote of me, it's open information, but I was involved before I even knew I was involved.

You know what they say about assuming...

As for the new/used pet debate, I wouldn't buy either. I'm not the type that pays for pets, unless it's a small adoption fee.

I think the real debate here is whether it's okay to buy food used. I'm also wondering why I can't buy used internet.
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Old 11-15-2012, 12:16 PM   #92
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Buying used has ZERO net impact on the economy.

Why? The math is very simple: Jimmy buys a used amp from Mary for $500. Jimmy is cheating an amp company out of $500 profit from buying used instead of new, HOWEVER Mary now has an extra $500 to spend on ie: a new TV (or new guitar), that she never would have had if she kept her amp in her basement collecting dust.

Fender and Marshall and Peavey aren't going to go out of business because you decide to buy used amps etc. EA, Ubisoft, Sony, Nintendo, Rockstar etc. aren't going to go out of business because you buy your games used. If you want to support a small company that's a different story. But don't feel bad for buying used because I can assure you that large companies do not give a crap about you except for the money in your pocket. On top of that, buying used is good for the environment by saving/recycling resources and keeping old equipment out of landfills.
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Old 11-15-2012, 04:04 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barricade_28
Buying used has ZERO net impact on the economy.

Why? The math is very simple: Jimmy buys a used amp from Mary for $500. Jimmy is cheating an amp company out of $500 profit from buying used instead of new, HOWEVER Mary now has an extra $500 to spend on ie: a new TV (or new guitar), that she never would have had if she kept her amp in her basement collecting dust.

On top of that, buying used is good for the environment by saving/recycling resources and keeping old equipment out of landfills.


Unless she goes and spends that on more used items, which is probably more common.

I honestly don't believe there's that much of an impact. If people couldn't sell their old equipment, they would just keep it in their basement, like you mentioned with "Mary" above. I sold my old MG, but if I couldn't have, I would have kept it even if I only used it as a beer table that looked like a Marshall amp.
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Old 11-15-2012, 04:16 PM   #94
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"I'm not part of this thread!"

*continues to defend assanine ideology*

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Unless its electronic drums.

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Old 11-15-2012, 05:54 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tubetime86
"I'm not part of this thread!"

*continues to defend assanine ideology*



I never claimed I wasn't part of this thread, I said I was part of it before I knew I was part of it. In addition, I said I wasn't a part of the people saying it's moral or ethical issue. I'm still happily a part of the debate, although it's gotten pretty much nowhere, not that it was ever really bound to do anything.

Like I said, my main thing about talking about how used gear doesn't give any money to the manufacterer is that it was something that never occured to me, because I never thought about it. Most of the time, people buy used simply because it's cheaper. They never stop to think what exactly it means to buy used.

For example, a relative of mine tried to claim to me that they were a big supporter of Chrysler, as that's the only company they have ever owned a vehicle from. I went on to tell him that he indeed was NOT a supporter of Chrysler, because all of his vehicles have been purchased used.

At the same time, it's always been my personal view that you shouldn't buy a New car unless you can afford to lose ~30% of it's value as soon as the tires hit the pavement outside of the car lot. If you're someone that has to shop on a budget, that's just a purely stupid decision in my book. Unless my income increases by a drastic amount, I'll never own a New car.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:31 PM   #96
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I don't think there should really be an ethical or moral connotation when it comes to new vs used, it should just be whatever your financial situation allows you.

Personally with my current financial situation guitars and amps that are less than $1000 I prefer to buy new if possible. I know that I can just save up for a few paychecks and be able to buy it. Guitars and amps $1000 and up I would look to buy used. I wanted a Hellraiser, I saved up and bought one. I currently want a Gibson Les Paul Custom, I'm saving up and keeping an eye on the used market because $4000 for a new guitar would be irresponsible of me.

The best argument for used to me personally is that it allows you to try a wider range of gear out easier. If your searching for a tone then buying used can let you try a piece of gear, and turn around and pitch it if it doesn't suit you. Buying New could greatly hinder this process.

If I made more money and spending $4000 on a guitar was more viable, id probably buy a new one. It all just depends on the person and the item.

Last edited by KrymsinViking : 11-15-2012 at 06:54 PM.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:42 PM   #97
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I don't see how anyone could possibly complain about someone else buying used gear. If they think they should always buy new, then let them put their money where their mouth is and by the new stuff for the one needing it or else at least make up the difference in price to them.

What is classic artwork but old used art, what is antique furniture but used furniture or classic cars going for millions a pop but a used car that in all likely hood has had several owners? Same thing goes for old guitars. How could it possibly be sane to treasure an old used beat up guitar yet at the same time sneer and turn up your nose at a used amp. It makes no sense simply because it's complete and utter nonsense. Better make that bullshit so that everyone will know what it smells like too.
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:37 PM   #98
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ok new perspective (at least in the guitar market). if it weren't for the used market, more specifically the vintage market then then there would be no market for new copies, repros etc. think about it a 59 LP goes for 200 grand or more. gibson says hey wait lets sell them a replica for a mere 5 grand and say look same thing but how much cheaper the new one is. so it can work both ways it isn't always against the manufacturer. there is a huge market for reto pedals and amps as well. all because people were willing to pay big money for the old ones on the secondary market.
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:41 PM   #99
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that's a really good point- you could argue that people like fender and gibson are arguably doing better because of the used market
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:21 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Blktiger0
Unless she goes and spends that on more used items, which is probably more common. .


If she spends that money on more used items, then the person she's buying that used stuff from now has $500 they never had before. See what I'm saying? Eventually somebody down the chain is going to spend that cash on some kind of new, consumable item and thus infuse cash into the economy.
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