ikey_

have you ever recorded your sound? perhaps what you hear live, sounds different in reality to a listener.

and with recording, that is worlds apart in general like mentioned with compression and multi-tracking.

proper voicing, playing, and gear can make a load of difference.

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trashedlostfdup

i have gone through two laptops in the last six months. the second one wasn't used for a long time and i finally got my interface and I/O's figured out (i really am not computer savvy) i recorded maybe two things, then i got blues screens, then i brought it over to my dad and the hard drive was dead. i will get a new computer in the next six months for sure, and do it all over again.

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darkwolf291

This.
The bass is probably the most important part of a heavy sound.

Think about it.
When playing by ourselves, we all have a habit of turning up the bass knob no?

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bdof

I hate playing with my bass above even 10 o'clock. Loses a lot of definition at higher volumes.
I can't have my bass higher than 9 o'clock when plaing through my Vader 2x15 There's just so much lowend in that cab it's insane

Ian_the_fox

Pretty much anything by Lamb of God or Slipknot. Not that I particularly like Slipknot but it's crazy how little of gain they use.


I personally like playing with less distortion and relying on aggressive right hand technique. In my opinion it's the more proper way to do things and it sounds better, makes you appear as much more of a player as you don't have to rely on a shit ton of drive to cover up your mistakes.

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tubetime86

Gain is overrated.

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dementiacaptain

I typically play with a big sound rather than a distorted sound. I give a slight boost to the lower mids and a cut the highs with a huge boost to the high mids to get a lot of clarity. I think that gain can be used to help fatten this sound, but typically I can get the desired results as long I run a boost to piss the tubes off a little bit, even if the amount of saturation isn't huge.

It is more about punch and clarity than anything, distortion can be used to help fatten up otherwise anemic leads, but the real trick is finding the perfect balance of low and high mids to knock a hole in the mix without overpowering it.

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MaaZeus

Why not have high gain AND heavy picking? Best of both worlds!



Seriously though, why are some of you attacking high gain so much? Its not necessarily to cover up mistakes. (which is a stupid reason. Bad playing is still audible no matter how much gain you have. I know my playing is ass no matter where I put my gain knob! ) It could be nothing more than to get certain sound and its definetly not necessarily just br00talz chugga. IE stuff like what Darkspace you need ridiculous amount of distortion to get that layered, fuzzy ambient sound.


*edit* Ooops. Meant to put this latter part in the Maxing Out Gain thead. Oh well...

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Van Noord

Not all amps can keep the clarity and attack with their gain set really high or maxed.
I run some of my amps with medium gain and then pick aggressively. But with my ENGL or VHT I can turn the gain up as high as I want and they never get bogged down, cloudy or messy sounding. I can't do the same thing and get the same results doing that with my 6505 or Rectifier. They just turn to mush past 6-7 on the on the gain dial.
So it does depend on the amp being used.

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Offworld92

+1

Just one of the annoying bandwagons on this forum. Eh.

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tubetime86

I wouldn't say that. This thread is a perfect of example of the problem; bands use studio tricks to sound heavy without actually using much gain, so inexperienced players dime the gain trying to get that sound... Then don't understand why it isn't right. It's not that people here are against gain, it's that to a new guitar player trying to emulate those tones it sounds like you need more gain than you do. I think the guys here just try to help newbies understand that point.

Also, as a side note, gain absolutely can be and is used to cover up bad playing. I'm not saying that's the only reason to use a ton of gain, but you can't deny that that does happen.

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Offworld92

I don't really get that. Is it a subconscious thing? I dial in the gain until I get a sound I like. I have never thought "I sound bad... I should turn up the gain". Even as a beginner.

Studio tones where double tracking is used is impossible to replicate live... Using more gain at least helps get closer using a single amp. Is that wrong/bad?

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tubetime86

That's fine, but my point was that that does happen. I've been there, and I've witnessed others do it as well.

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monwobobbo

studio magic seems to be misunderstood. when recording a distorted signal there is satuaration and this is kinda unavoidable. i used a POD and and a digital 8-track to record the stuff in my profile. even with that there is still a more distorted sound than what i started with. this leads to my having to be careful with my eq and level of distortion when recording. you use less than it appears that's just the nature of the beast. it's not really a trick. now you can fix things in the mix and add or subtract as well this is studio magic. use less distortion than you think is one of the first things you should learn when recording. as for duplicating things live that is much tougher. listen to live recordings of your fave players and i'm sure you'll notice in most cases that they can't duplicate the records tone exactly either.

Offworld92

I strongly disagree. At least, in a band setting. The drums are far, far more important in determining a songs heaviness. I'll even go so far as to say that the drums are the most important factor in determining a song's heaviness.




If you've seen it, then it's true. I haven't seen that, or maybe I just didn't realize that that's what people were trying to do.

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darkwolf291

I meant the bass frequencies, not so much the bass guitar.

Double Kick is a standard in metal, and they, along with toms, cover a huge part of the low end, while the snare and crash cover treble.

To me, the heaviness of a song depends not on just the amount of low end in the mix, but it's clarity and definition. A large, clear low end makes a song sound much, much heavier, regardless of it's gain levels.

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Offworld92

Just remembered to download your album.

The double bass is obviously very important, but strategic (or gratuitous haha) placement of ride and hi hat are also extremely contibutional. I don't think that's a word but **** it.

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darkwolf291

There will be a second one in a few months.
OT:
Don't forget the way the drums are played.

For instance, if the drums are played in double time, it makes the whole song sound faster and a bit heavier than it really is.

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