12-03-2012, 02:15 AM
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#1 |
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land of white cannibals
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: deep south
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lower gain that is heavier
i have been listening to Shadows Fall's The Art of Balance album. its a very heavy album, but they really don't use enough. specifically the song "a fire in babylon"
so effectly how can you get the gain down and still sound as heavy as they do? IIRC on that album they were using JCM800's with t75's and V'30's in an X pattern. i also think they used emg's as well. any tricks to using less gain and sound heavier without studio magic? referance
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12-03-2012, 02:19 AM
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Grumpy Old Tech
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Australia
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Sounds like quite a lot of compression going on in there. Trouble is that it's hard to tell where it's coming from. The entire mix sounds as compressed as all shit.
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Gilchrist custom guitar Yamaha SBG500 Telecaster Ibanez Iceman Roland GP-8 Quadraverb Abbey Harmonic II Marshall JTM45 clone Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded) Marshall 18W clone Fender 5F1 Champ clone Marshall 1960A Cathbard Amplification |
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12-03-2012, 02:20 AM
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Doesn't speak guitar
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Traffic Town LA
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That is the only album I like from them. Great songs and riffs.
Sorry I can't help with your question. JCM800, maxon boost. Now they use Rivera knucklehad tre. EMG 85 in the bridge.
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Last edited by R45VT : 12-03-2012 at 02:30 AM. |
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12-03-2012, 02:23 AM
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land of white cannibals
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: deep south
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Quote:
i know its the best video i could find. i have been listening the album which of course sounds better, but there definitely is some compression somewhere in the chain. would you agree that it is pretty 'heavey' and that the gain isn't that high? just for some reassurance.
__________________
Sunshine in the house of flames
She loves it where she gets it But it's never felt the same Surgery, in the house of dissection When your candle burns out I'll resurrect you |
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12-03-2012, 02:25 AM
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Artist In The Ambulance
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
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I think a lot of the perceived heaviness in that track is from the bass. The guitars themselves sound relatively thin.
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12-03-2012, 02:26 AM
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Hookers and Blow
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: NJ
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multi tracking, compression, and multi tracked, and possibly distorted bass are all big reasons why that sounds so heavy
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12-03-2012, 02:28 AM
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Let's a go Mario!
Join Date: Feb 2009
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A good thick bass guitar with some light gain is a great start. Also, a touch responsive amp can have a lot to do with it. My DSL is kept with gain below 6 most of the time, but I can play metal on it just fine. I use lots of mids, a medium treble, and a thick bass. Makes it sound bigger than it is.
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12-03-2012, 02:30 AM
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2009
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IMO its always in the way/style you play your instrument. Slayer in the last ten years seems to me have rolled back the gain on the guitars compared to the 90's, yet they still sound just as aggressive as ever.
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12-03-2012, 02:31 AM
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Schematic Junkie
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: USA
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Overdubs and multiple mic positions.
Recorded metal tones that are done right are not overtly gainy. Considerably less gain is dialed in than you would suspect, and overdubs create the thickness of tone. Live is a different story. You'll typically notice that more gain is dialed in live to create as best a representation as possible of the recorded tone when the magic of overdubbing is not an option. Clarity and definition suffers in almost every instance.
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Associations: CEC Amplification ASG Amps Howdy, my name's Craig.  Member of the GB&C and GG&A "Who to Listen To" lists......listen at your own risk. 
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12-03-2012, 02:35 AM
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#10 |
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land of white cannibals
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: deep south
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anything other than studio magic besides the bass?
__________________
Sunshine in the house of flames
She loves it where she gets it But it's never felt the same Surgery, in the house of dissection When your candle burns out I'll resurrect you |
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12-03-2012, 02:37 AM
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Schematic Junkie
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: USA
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Quote:
A properly voiced amp. 
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Associations: CEC Amplification ASG Amps Howdy, my name's Craig. Member of the GB&C and GG&A "Who to Listen To" lists......listen at your own risk.
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12-03-2012, 02:37 AM
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Artist In The Ambulance
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Sounds like a high pass filter on the guitars which you could achieve somewhat with an MXR 10 band. helps give the bass it's own space and free up the mix
Last edited by AxSilentxLine : 12-03-2012 at 02:38 AM. |
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12-03-2012, 02:38 AM
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Grumpy Old Tech
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Australia
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What he needs is a Hybris, doesn't he Craig?
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Gilchrist custom guitar Yamaha SBG500 Telecaster Ibanez Iceman Roland GP-8 Quadraverb Abbey Harmonic II Marshall JTM45 clone Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded) Marshall 18W clone Fender 5F1 Champ clone Marshall 1960A Cathbard Amplification |
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12-03-2012, 02:42 AM
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Hookers and Blow
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: NJ
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Quote:
Almost every recording you hear has high pass filter on the guitar, metal or not. Like you said, it cuts out the bass's frequencies and gives a clearer mix.
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12-03-2012, 02:56 AM
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Artist In The Ambulance
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Quote:
Yeah, that's why I mentioned it |
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12-03-2012, 03:30 AM
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#16 |
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2010
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As with most metal bands, or in fact with almost any band at all, it is impossible to replicate their tone with just one guitar. Search the techniques "double tracking", or some cases even "quad tracking".
Compression will help get you there, but as mentioned earlier, a properly voiced amp with the right EQ settings and cabinet/speakers is essential. 100% of this has been mentioned in previous posts, but I'm just emphasizing the fact that you will find it near impossible to replicate this tone by yourself. |
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12-03-2012, 03:30 AM
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#17 |
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Didn't listen to the song but I'm going to go with good bass tone and playing style. A lot is in your playing style, when you start recording you'll notice that tone is verrrrry much in the fingers. I sound like poop through every amp while people like Ola Englund and probably the guys on the video sound good on every amp.
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Guitasr: Cort KX-Custom ESP LTD M-200FM Amp: Engl Powerball Misc: Phonic Helixboard 18 MKII Reaper Loads of cheap crap I should have never bought. |
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12-03-2012, 03:36 AM
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#18 |
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Grumpy Old Tech
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Australia
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You're confusing talent with tone. Eric Clapton sounds good every time but his tones over the years have changed dramatically. You can still tell it's Clapton but Beano sounds different to Wheels of Fire which sounds totally different to Slowhand.
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Gilchrist custom guitar Yamaha SBG500 Telecaster Ibanez Iceman Roland GP-8 Quadraverb Abbey Harmonic II Marshall JTM45 clone Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded) Marshall 18W clone Fender 5F1 Champ clone Marshall 1960A Cathbard Amplification |
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12-03-2012, 03:36 AM
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#19 |
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land of white cannibals
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: deep south
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i am not trying to emulate their tone, i am just looking for ideas to get heavy without as much gain in a live situation. even live they didn't have searing gain, i have seen them at least five times.
thanks for the words, i don't have studio magic 
__________________
Sunshine in the house of flames
She loves it where she gets it But it's never felt the same Surgery, in the house of dissection When your candle burns out I'll resurrect you |
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12-03-2012, 03:40 AM
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#20 |
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Grumpy Old Tech
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Australia
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What I've found works quite well is a touch of pitch shifting mixed into the background. Not a fuzz type octaver but a pitch shifter. I use my Quadraverb. It's so low in the mix that it's hard to hear but it thickens up the sound surprisingly well.
__________________
Gilchrist custom guitar Yamaha SBG500 Telecaster Ibanez Iceman Roland GP-8 Quadraverb Abbey Harmonic II Marshall JTM45 clone Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded) Marshall 18W clone Fender 5F1 Champ clone Marshall 1960A Cathbard Amplification |
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