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Old 01-03-2013, 11:08 AM   #81
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Why would you flip anyone off? What an angsty 12-year-old dick move.
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Old 01-03-2013, 11:09 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by AtaBorMan
Just use some common sense, you don't have to do something just because you can.

Pretty much this. I don't avoid swearing at people generally in case they can arrest me, I avoid it because it's rude and mostly needless.

However, aye if they're being a dick you should be able to as much as anyone else. It's a personal issue, not a legal one.

I guess the problem is, being a representative of the law it is very easy to blur the two and use legal powers for personal matters. In their role as a policeman they shouldn't care that you swore at them, they should only care as a person. Unfortunately, you can't really just keep two sides of yourself separate like that.
It would be understandable if they did, but no, they shouldn't be able to do anything legally about it.
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Old 01-03-2013, 11:11 AM   #83
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As a police officer of 40+ years, I have some opinions... Most coppers have pretty thick skins. I've been called just about everything you can think of and likely some things you can't....
Mostly you learn to just fluff it off. You (or if you want to stay sane you do...) learn that for the most part, you are encountering people at their worst. They are emotionally overwrought, drunk, just been in a fight, whatever....
They are not pleased to see you....
As with juicy young guys flipping you the bird or whatever... I think it's funny. Young lads either showing off for their buddies or trying to prove to themselves how tough they are....
They'll grow up at some point.

Now that's me, though, and most of the more-mature coppers I know. But there is a mindset among certian police officers that they have to have "respect". By this they generally mean "fear".
They will take almost anything as a slight and react strongly to it. I personally think these guys have self-esteem problems, which is perhaps why they got into police work to begin with. Most progressive departments try not to hire such folks these days.
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Old 01-03-2013, 11:11 AM   #84
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It's funny that in America, a nation where people hate welfare recipients and such because they despise the "entitlement" culture, they feel their rights "entitle" them to firearms and being a dick.

Just sayin'.

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Originally Posted by Bikewer
As a police officer of 40+ years, I have some opinions... Most coppers have pretty thick skins. I've been called just about everything you can think of and likely some things you can't....
Mostly you learn to just fluff it off. You (or if you want to stay sane you do...) learn that for the most part, you are encountering people at their worst. They are emotionally overwrought, drunk, just been in a fight, whatever....
They are not pleased to see you....
As with juicy young guys flipping you the bird or whatever... I think it's funny. Young lads either showing off for their buddies or trying to prove to themselves how tough they are....
They'll grow up at some point.

Now that's me, though, and most of the more-mature coppers I know. But there is a mindset among certian police officers that they have to have "respect". By this they generally mean "fear".
They will take almost anything as a slight and react strongly to it. I personally think these guys have self-esteem problems, which is perhaps why they got into police work to begin with. Most progressive departments try not to hire such folks these days.



Fair point, and interesting to hear a copper's perspective.
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Old 01-03-2013, 11:21 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by magnus_maximus
It's funny that in America, a nation where people hate welfare recipients and such because they despise the "entitlement" culture, they feel their rights "entitle" them to firearms and being a dick.

We aren't simply given guns by the government.
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Old 01-03-2013, 11:59 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by Bikewer
As a police officer of 40+ years, I have some opinions... Most coppers have pretty thick skins. I've been called just about everything you can think of and likely some things you can't....
Mostly you learn to just fluff it off. You (or if you want to stay sane you do...) learn that for the most part, you are encountering people at their worst. They are emotionally overwrought, drunk, just been in a fight, whatever....
They are not pleased to see you....
As with juicy young guys flipping you the bird or whatever... I think it's funny. Young lads either showing off for their buddies or trying to prove to themselves how tough they are....
They'll grow up at some point.

Now that's me, though, and most of the more-mature coppers I know. But there is a mindset among certian police officers that they have to have "respect". By this they generally mean "fear".
They will take almost anything as a slight and react strongly to it. I personally think these guys have self-esteem problems, which is perhaps why they got into police work to begin with. Most progressive departments try not to hire such folks these days.

Yeah I don't really understand the idea that as well as getting the job done, people require some odd "respect".

Police are people like anyone else and deserve the same respect that you'd give anyone else. Similarly people deserve respect from the police that deal with them. Police shouldn't be put on a pedastal, they're there to help you. However as such... don't be a dick, respect that they're their to help people and let them do their jobs. Unfortunately though, I'm guessing a large number of criminals are people who don't respect other people, or else they wouldn't do the stuff they do.

I guess it can be quite frustrating doing a job that tries to help people and yet every day received the worst side of people's personalities. But I guess if someone can't handle someone just being a bit of a dick and ignore it, they shouldn't be doing that job.
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Old 01-03-2013, 12:31 PM   #87
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Last night an off-duty Kansas City Cop died in a car wreck because he wasn't wearing his seatbelt. Being that his day job is to write people expensive tickets for not wearing their seatbelts, it warranted a little chuckle from all in the room.
/barely relevant

But no, I've never understood some peoples' lack of self control. I firmly believe that there are a decent crop of police who've forgotten that they are servants to the public and not the other way around. But when I get pulled over it's "Yes officer/No sir." and nothing more.
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Old 01-03-2013, 12:35 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by VanTheKraut
Last night an off-duty Kansas City Cop died in a car wreck because he wasn't wearing his seatbelt. Being that his day job is to write people expensive tickets for not wearing their seatbelts, it warranted a little chuckle from all in the room.

Sort of shows why they tell people to do it though.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:16 PM   #89
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I literally saw a video of a guy going up to a cop on the street and flipping him off directly to his face. Needless to say, he automatically pulled his billy and smacked the guy right across the face. The best part is the guy's bud taking the vid from his car immediatly freaked and drove off with an "oh shit!".
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:18 PM   #90
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OK, so my memory was a bit inaccurate, but .....


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Old 01-03-2013, 01:36 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by noisewall11
OK, so my memory was a bit inaccurate, but .....



Yeah see that's exactly the type of reaction a policeman should be arrested for.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:39 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by MadClownDisease
Yeah see that's exactly the type of reaction a policeman should be arrested for.

The person that flipped the cop off was being a tad aggressive, but the cop beat him repeatedly even after the guy was running away.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:51 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by MadClownDisease
Yeah see that's exactly the type of reaction a policeman should be arrested for.


What reaction would you expect from someone who has a man walk up to him from in a car, which had been waiting, and was aggressive right in his face?
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Old 01-03-2013, 02:18 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by Todd Hart
What reaction would you expect from someone who has a man walk up to him from in a car, which had been waiting, and was aggressive right in his face?

I think "what the ****?" would be the appropriate reaction.

He didn't hit him as a knee-jerk reaction, he waited a couple of moments shocked, and then started needlessly beating him, even pursuing him to beat him more.

I'd expect from a policeman who has to deal with this kind of behaviour a lot a calmer reaction that from a member of the public, and I think this would clearly be very aggressive assault from any other person.

EDIT: Watch again, it wasn't a defensive reaction to aggression (though it was pretty aggressive when lunged out with the fingers), it was a "I'm not ****ing taking this, have a baton to the head you twat" reaction.
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Old 01-03-2013, 03:05 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by MadClownDisease
EDIT: Watch again, it wasn't a defensive reaction to aggression (though it was pretty aggressive when lunged out with the fingers), it was a "I'm not ****ing taking this, have a baton to the head you twat" reaction.



That was my point earlier. You may take this to court and win, but it not going to save you the beating, the jail time (A lot of people here seem to forget that arrested =/= guilty.)


So as stated before, it's legal but not advisable. (As always, In the U.S. the law varies from state to state)


And if that guy was in Georgia, he could be found guilty of the following:

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2010 Georgia Code
TITLE 16 - CRIMES AND OFFENSES
CHAPTER 11 - OFFENSES AGAINST PUBLIC ORDER AND SAFETY
ARTICLE 2 - OFFENSES AGAINST PUBLIC ORDER
16-11-39 - Disorderly conduct


(a) A person commits the offense of disorderly conduct when such person commits any of the following:

(1) Acts in a violent or tumultuous manner toward another person whereby such person is placed in reasonable fear of the safety of such person's life, limb, or health;

(2) Acts in a violent or tumultuous manner toward another person whereby the property of such person is placed in danger of being damaged or destroyed;

(3) Without provocation, uses to or of another person in such other person's presence, opprobrious or abusive words which by their very utterance tend to incite to an immediate breach of the peace, that is to say, words which as a matter of common knowledge and under ordinary circumstances will, when used to or of another person in such other person's presence, naturally tend to provoke violent resentment, that is, words commonly called "fighting words"; or

(4) Without provocation, uses obscene and vulgar or profane language in the presence of or by telephone to a person under the age of 14 years which threatens an immediate breach of the peace.

(b) Any person who commits the offense of disorderly conduct shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

(c) This Code section shall not be deemed or construed to affect or limit the powers of counties or municipal corporations to adopt ordinances or resolutions prohibiting disorderly conduct within their respective limits.

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Old 01-03-2013, 03:10 PM   #96
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I don't know what the law says about it, in either the UK or USA, but here is what I think.

You should be "allowed" to flip off a police officer just as much as you should be "allowed" to flip off someone who isn't a police officer. However, just because you are "allowed" to do it doesn't mean you aren't a dick for doing it.
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Old 01-03-2013, 03:16 PM   #97
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I'm of the belief that anywhere from 50-75% of U.S. Police Officers are deserving of the middle finger.
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Old 01-03-2013, 03:48 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by jugglingfreak
That was my point earlier. You may take this to court and win, but it not going to save you the beating, the jail time (A lot of people here seem to forget that arrested =/= guilty.)


So as stated before, it's legal but not advisable. (As always, In the U.S. the law varies from state to state)


And if that guy was in Georgia, he could be found guilty of the following:

Oh aye, it's by no means a constructive thing to do, and I think that guy was a dick for just running up to someone and shouting and swearing at them, but I still think that policeman used excessive and unnecessary force even were it illegal.

(I know you're not agreeing with the guy in that video btw, just saying people who think that is the correct response to someone being needlessly rude should NOT be a police officer)
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Old 01-03-2013, 03:50 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by MadClownDisease
I think "what the ****?" would be the appropriate reaction.

He didn't hit him as a knee-jerk reaction, he waited a couple of moments shocked, and then started needlessly beating him, even pursuing him to beat him more.

I'd expect from a policeman who has to deal with this kind of behaviour a lot a calmer reaction that from a member of the public, and I think this would clearly be very aggressive assault from any other person.

EDIT: Watch again, it wasn't a defensive reaction to aggression (though it was pretty aggressive when lunged out with the fingers), it was a "I'm not ****ing taking this, have a baton to the head you twat" reaction.


He's a police officer, so he knows he's a target anyway, and a guy just got out of a parked car, beelined for him and started jumping in his face and being aggressive. I don't think the policeman's reaction was perfect, but it's clearly understandable: he panicked, being only human, and given that he's armed with a nightstick he used that to defend himself.

If a policeman, or even another civilian, walked up to someone and started being as aggressive as the man in the video was what would you expect as a reaction? Policeman are no more and no less than civilians, and they will panic in the same way. However, police know that they are a target of violence, and this officer had no idea that all that was going to happen was pathetic juvenile swearing, and so he reacted in a way to ensure his safety.

And, frankly, I see no problem with twatting some pathetic asshole over the head for being aggressive and intimidating.
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Old 01-03-2013, 04:10 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Todd Hart
He's a police officer, so he knows he's a target anyway, and a guy just got out of a parked car, beelined for him and started jumping in his face and being aggressive. I don't think the policeman's reaction was perfect, but it's clearly understandable: he panicked, being only human, and given that he's armed with a nightstick he used that to defend himself.

If a policeman, or even another civilian, walked up to someone and started being as aggressive as the man in the video was what would you expect as a reaction? Policeman are no more and no less than civilians, and they will panic in the same way. However, police know that they are a target of violence, and this officer had no idea that all that was going to happen was pathetic juvenile swearing, and so he reacted in a way to ensure his safety.

And, frankly, I see no problem with twatting some pathetic asshole over the head for being aggressive and intimidating.

That's the thing though, it doesn't look like he panicked, he just got annoyed. He stops and steps back pretty calmly before he decides to start twatting the guy.
It looks like he realised there was no immediate danger, realised it was just someone being a dickhead and went for him.

I'd expect normal people to react too, but even for normal people who aren't meant to uphold the law and deal with this a lot (ie who aren't expected to keep their cool and would be excuseable for assaulting someone), this is still quite a reaction. He was provoked, but certainly not to that reaction. If I was him... well if I was him I'd probably just have been a bit shocked and taken aback and then tried to walk around, but I'm pretty passive... but I'd expect normal people to shout or swear back "what the ****" etc etc but to start beating someone with a weapon is a pretty extreme reaction.

Regardless of how much of a twat this guy was being, this is a man who should be trained to keep calm and uphold the law, not get aggressive when insulted and attack someone with an item meant for use when people are being violent. He could see this guy wasn't a threat and rather than stay calm or shout or even attempt to arrest him, he starts attacking him. It's not on.
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