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Old 01-06-2013, 10:58 AM   #1
madmadmax321
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Buying a guitar and amp (beginner)

Hi guys im looking at starting to learn how to play the electric guitar and was just looking for some opinions on what guitar and amp to get (im on a budget of 150-200)

i have looked at some reviews and found these

Squier Affinity Strat Sunburst RN LH on ebay for 100 but wont let me post the link

Orange Crush CR12L 70 on guitarguitar. com

do you think these are good for the price?
Are there any amps that are slightly cheaper but still good for a beginner?
Please make any suggestions that you have

thanks for reading

Last edited by madmadmax321 : 01-06-2013 at 11:06 AM.
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:19 AM   #2
halfj06
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What kind of music are you into?
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:24 AM   #3
woad_yurt
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Max:

Around here, big, powerful solid state combos go for very little money. I've bought 2x12 100 watters for $100 or less a few times. Although I completely prefer my tube Fenders, there was nothing really bad about the aforementioned amps. With the right pedal, they didn't sound all that bad.

I think they go so cheaply because most using something of that size and power will go tube once they can swing it. I don't know how it is over there but I suspect it may be the same. So, instead of looking at that little Orange, why not check out some big used solid state 2x12s?

I had a universally dismissed and disregarded Rogue 120 watt 2x12 combo and it sounded better than any little amp I ever heard. Substantial speakers play a big part in one's sound and little amps can't have 'em. Plus, I could play with a drummer or gig with that one if I wanted to. It cost $75.00. I also bought something made by Drive for $100. That one was cool, too, built like a tank with on-board gains and stuff, but I traded it for a guitar down the line.

Now, I have never played through any Orange but, for what those Crush models are going for here, I could get something really substantial in solid state. And, an 8" speaker will always be lacking. If you wanted to take one on business trips or if you lived in a submarine, I could understand having such a tiny amp, but, otherwise, I have never seen the point in them.

There is one thing SS has over tubes; they'll give you their best sound all through the volume range while tube jobs have a more or less limited sweet spot.

Any old solid state 2x12 combos around you for cheap?

Last edited by woad_yurt : 01-06-2013 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:43 AM   #4
madmadmax321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by halfj06
What kind of music are you into?


Anything really apart from death metal
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:44 AM   #5
madmadmax321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woad_yurt
Max:

Around here, big, powerful solid state combos go for very little money. I've bought 2x12 100 watters for $100 or less a few times. Although I completely prefer my tube Fenders, there was nothing really bad about the aforementioned amps. With the right pedal, they didn't sound all that bad.

I think they go so cheaply because most using something of that size and power will go tube once they can swing it. I don't know how it is over there but I suspect it may be the same. So, instead of looking at that little Orange, why not check out some big used solid state 2x12s?

I had a universally dismissed and disregarded Rogue 120 watt 2x12 combo and it sounded better than any little amp I ever heard. Substantial speakers play a big part in one's sound and little amps can't have 'em. Plus, I could play with a drummer or gig with that one if I wanted to. It cost $75.00. I also bought something made by Drive for $100. That one was cool, too, built like a tank with on-board gains and stuff, but I traded it for a guitar down the line.

Now, I have never played through any Orange but, for what those Crush models are going for here, I could get something really substantial in solid state. And, an 8" speaker will always be lacking. If you wanted to take one on business trips or if you lived in a submarine, I could understand having such a tiny amp, but, otherwise, I have never seen the point in them.

There is one thing SS has over tubes; they'll give you their best sound all through the volume range while tube jobs have a more or less limited sweet spot.

Any old solid state 2x12 combos around you for cheap?


Wow thanks for the information very helpful i'll have a look at them thanks for taking your time to help me
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:47 AM   #6
halfj06
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I think those big cheap amps pick up volume too quickly for somone who's in an apt or.house and not that confident in their playing.. and I hate the crackling and fizzing sounds on them.. and when you turn the volume from 1 to 2 it goes from a whisper to a roar

e id suggest (I donno what things cost there) the fender mustang for an amp.. and probably a Yamaha pacifica guitar

Last edited by halfj06 : 01-06-2013 at 11:51 AM.
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:49 AM   #7
woad_yurt
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No sweat. I just know that I have way more fun with a real amp amp than I do with something that sounds so thin. The bigger ones give you depth, fullness and the whole bass range, something that a little 8" speaker can not. PM me and let me know what you end up with, ok?

Craigslist!

For giggles, go to a guitar shop one day and try out some of those mini things. You'll see/hear what I mean.
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Old 01-06-2013, 12:21 PM   #8
madmadmax321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woad_yurt
No sweat. I just know that I have way more fun with a real amp amp than I do with something that sounds so thin. The bigger ones give you depth, fullness and the whole bass range, something that a little 8" speaker can not. PM me and let me know what you end up with, ok?

Craigslist!

For giggles, go to a guitar shop one day and try out some of those mini things. You'll see/hear what I mean.


Just a bit off topic do you suggest anyway of learning how to play the electric guitar?

i dont have much money (only what I work for and save being a student sucks sometimes) but tutor? DVD? Internet resources? and someone suggested the xbox game rocksmith because you use a real guitar but im not to sure?

thanks again
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Old 01-06-2013, 12:53 PM   #9
Mephaphil
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Ok. I don't agree with this solid state stuff. Especially the cheap ones. At a higher price range you'll get some good ones but the cheap ones usually aren't worth your time. They sound like crap, what's the point in spending 70 on a shocking amp, and another 50 on a decent pedal only for it still sound wank?

You need a tube amp or a good modelling amp. A cheap one will sound much better than any solid state you can get for that price.

The Squire for 100... I guess if that's your budget and that's all you have then okay, get it, but they really aren't amazing guitars. You really should look for a Squier Classic Vibe or a Epiphone Les Paul. I think they are great guitars to start with, and guitars that people keep for a long time without buying another one.

Something like this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/460b91e34b

It might go for under 200, I do see some for around 200 and you can probably haggle.

The amp, I'd go for a Vox Valetronix. This one is going cheap. I had a go on a larger version and it sounded cool. I'm sure this one is very similar and they have a good rep as modelling amps go.

[http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121044111691

Or

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/416f9ff5d0 that's another good modelling amp for starters.

That's around 250 without haggling. I think you'll be able to get something good for 300. I think that 200 is a little on the low side, is there any way you can get another 100? For 200 I really think that the guitar will be poor, for an extra 50 - 100 you can get a massive improvement on the affinity, and remember, the amp is very important as a good guitar will crap through a crap amp, but a poor guitar can sound okay through a good amp. The Valetronix or the Mustang is a good start, probably the best amps in that price range. I think there's a Peavey valve amp in that price range, but I can't remember it, gah,

The guitar and amp is I recommended is great for starters.

As for teaching, you need a teacher. If you can't get a teacher start off learning a few songs.

What do you listen to? I'll recommend you something easy to get started on.

Go to www.justinguitar.com and follow the lesson plan. It's free, and it's a very distant second best to have a a teacher but it's much better than RockSmith, which leans towards teaching you the game rather than guitar.

You must understand. Just playing is fine, but if you want to improve quickly you need to know what you're doing, and hats with a little theory. It's hard at first but you'll soon get it with a bit of dedication and you'll start to see how music works and improve with it.

So, what bands do you like?
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Last edited by Mephaphil : 01-06-2013 at 01:00 PM.
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Old 01-06-2013, 01:08 PM   #10
Mephaphil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woad_yurt
I could understand having such a tiny amp, but, otherwise, I have never seen the point in them.

There is one thing SS has over tubes; they'll give you their best sound all through the volume range while tube jobs have a more or less limited sweet spot.

Any old solid state 2x12 combos around you for cheap?


Fender Silver face Champ. Great little amp. You can drive small amps at low volumes and they sound awesome, a cheap and big solid state is just... Meh. It's got volume, but no tone. Fizzing and popping, just nothing there. Maybe you got lucky but the majority of us don't, which is why we recommend modelling over solid state, and valve over modelling with hybrid in the middle of the latter.
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Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote:
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Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


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Old 01-06-2013, 01:45 PM   #11
madmadmax321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mephaphil
Ok. I don't agree with this solid state stuff. Especially the cheap ones. At a higher price range you'll get some good ones but the cheap ones usually aren't worth your time. They sound like crap, what's the point in spending 70 on a shocking amp, and another 50 on a decent pedal only for it still sound wank?

You need a tube amp or a good modelling amp. A cheap one will sound much better than any solid state you can get for that price.

The Squire for 100... I guess if that's your budget and that's all you have then okay, get it, but they really aren't amazing guitars. You really should look for a Squier Classic Vibe or a Epiphone Les Paul. I think they are great guitars to start with, and guitars that people keep for a long time without buying another one.

Something like this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/460b91e34b

It might go for under 200, I do see some for around 200 and you can probably haggle.

The amp, I'd go for a Vox Valetronix. This one is going cheap. I had a go on a larger version and it sounded cool. I'm sure this one is very similar and they have a good rep as modelling amps go.

[http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121044111691

Or

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/416f9ff5d0 that's another good modelling amp for starters.

That's around 250 without haggling. I think you'll be able to get something good for 300. I think that 200 is a little on the low side, is there any way you can get another 100? For 200 I really think that the guitar will be poor, for an extra 50 - 100 you can get a massive improvement on the affinity, and remember, the amp is very important as a good guitar will crap through a crap amp, but a poor guitar can sound okay through a good amp. The Valetronix or the Mustang is a good start, probably the best amps in that price range. I think there's a Peavey valve amp in that price range, but I can't remember it, gah,

The guitar and amp is I recommended is great for starters.

As for teaching, you need a teacher. If you can't get a teacher start off learning a few songs.

What do you listen to? I'll recommend you something easy to get started on.

Go to www.justinguitar.com and follow the lesson plan. It's free, and it's a very distant second best to have a a teacher but it's much better than RockSmith, which leans towards teaching you the game rather than guitar.

You must understand. Just playing is fine, but if you want to improve quickly you need to know what you're doing, and hats with a little theory. It's hard at first but you'll soon get it with a bit of dedication and you'll start to see how music works and improve with it.

So, what bands do you like?


Thanks! I'll guess i will save for a bit longer then.

I listen to alot of bands really

Ac/Dc
nickleback (the song animals i would like to learn eventually)
linkin park
muse
Oasis (one of my favorite bands)
nirvana
coldplay
rolling stones (paint it black is my favorite)
A little bit of iron maiden
A bit thin lizzie
some black sabbath
kings of leon
script
and more but there the ones i can think of off the top of my head band wise
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:00 PM   #12
Mephaphil
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Ok. There loads of easy songs you can learn from them bands.

Highway to Hell. 3 chords.
Satisfaction: 3 note riff.
Oasis: Wonder wall is pretty easy.

You need to be able to do something. You need to be able to read Tab, it's really easy. Each line tells you what string to put your finger on and the number is the fret. If the numbers are staggered you play one note after each other, of they are lined up its normally a chord or a double stop.

Anyway. Www.justinguitar.com will tell you how to do that.

You can go on Youtube and look at videos of how to play basic chords. I would say learn the basic open major and minor chords. Start with the major like A, C, D, E, F and G. If there's no m7 or whatever it's a major. We don't put Major after it, it's just G. There are major 7 chords but you'll move onto them later.

A, C, D, E and G are the very common major chords so maybe learn them with Am, Dm, D7, E, Em7, Em as they are quite common chords. Learn a minor along with the major, so A and Am,then D and Dm etc.

I've listed the chords I remember being prominent when I started learning. If anyone can think of any other important ones that should be good.


So:
A, Am. Am7 (Am = A Minor, Am7 = A Minor 7)
B7 Bm7
C, C7, Cmaj7
D, Dm, D7
E, Em, Em7, E7
F
G, G6, G7

Don't look back in anger is a song that incorporates a lot of chords you'll learn.

Definitely look at www.justinguitar.com.

It will be very hard at first, learning chords, changing from chord to chord, it'll probably hurt your fingers but as long as you're patient you'll get there. Songs will be difficult but it's just practice.

I hope this helps.
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Quote:
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Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


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Originally Posted by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.



Last edited by Mephaphil : 01-06-2013 at 02:13 PM.
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:05 PM   #13
woad_yurt
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Hey folks, all of the ones I mentioned were $100 or less. I'd leave 'em as clean-sounding as possible and used a "pedal." I also didn't notice any of them going from a whisper to a roar in 1/64" of a dial turn. I've found that any solid state amp, if used on the clean channel with a cheap tube preamp gets one in the neighborhood of a halfway decent sound. I'd rather have a solid state 100 watter with a preamp in front of it than I would anything with a miniscule speaker. Palm muting bites it when there's no depth to be had.

My Crate Powerblock is ok with a $40 Behringer MIC 200 preamp, definitely giggable. Yes, I prefer my old Fenders but they cost many times more.

I'd rather have something like in the link below than something with an 8" speaker. At least I could feel the thing when I turn it up some.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Ran...=item25795d2f61

Last edited by woad_yurt : 01-06-2013 at 09:53 PM.
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Old 01-07-2013, 02:17 AM   #14
davehail1092
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well, a cheap beginner guitar that everybody overlooks is a Rogue Rocketeer. Rouge guitars are cheap, and supriseingly good. you can get them for around or even under $100.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...electric-guitar

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...electric-guitar

Or a Squire Bullet. Another great beginner guitar. Its what i started with, and still like to play. mine is about 29 years old now, and had a lot of moding done to it, but i still love the sound of it to this day.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...ar-with-tremolo

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...ar-with-tremolo

For an amp, I'd go used. find an old gorilla, or mako, or a used fender frontman. but DONT get a line 6 spyder!
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Old 01-07-2013, 06:10 AM   #15
cha33 armstrong
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Bugera BC15 the cheapest valve amp you can find its 85 (including warranty)
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:23 PM   #16
madmadmax321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davehail1092
well, a cheap beginner guitar that everybody overlooks is a Rogue Rocketeer. Rouge guitars are cheap, and supriseingly good. you can get them for around or even under $100.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...electric-guitar

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...electric-guitar

Or a Squire Bullet. Another great beginner guitar. Its what i started with, and still like to play. mine is about 29 years old now, and had a lot of moding done to it, but i still love the sound of it to this day.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...ar-with-tremolo

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...ar-with-tremolo

For an amp, I'd go used. find an old gorilla, or mako, or a used fender frontman. but DONT get a line 6 spyder!


Hi thanks for replying arent the guitars you listed right handed though? if so do they do left handed versions?
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:32 PM   #17
Mephaphil
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Oh shit you're left handed? You are restricted then. Get a Classic Vibe. I've never played a good Bullet or Affinity, I have played okay CVs though. Bullets may have been better 20 years ago but I wouldn't recommend them now.

No worries about the free lesson there either... It only took me 30 minutes to write out
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Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.



Last edited by Mephaphil : 01-07-2013 at 12:36 PM.
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:58 PM   #18
madmadmax321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mephaphil
Oh shit you're left handed? You are restricted then. Get a Classic Vibe. I've never played a good Bullet or Affinity, I have played okay CVs though. Bullets may have been better 20 years ago but I wouldn't recommend them now.

No worries about the free lesson there either... It only took me 30 minutes to write out


yeah it sucks and did i not say thanks? sorry i meant too, thanks! loss of sleep from A-level exams makes me lose my attention a bit :P

what do you think of this one? (probably maximum i can spend)

http://www.pmtonline.co.uk/ibanez-g...oth-inlays.html

can't seem to find many classic vibes below 250
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Old 01-07-2013, 10:16 PM   #19
samuraigoomba
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You know, I have that orange crush amp you mentioned in the OP and it's really not a bad little amp. It's very lightweight and I payed about $60 for a refurbished one. The tone is pretty warm and it sounds great with gain. It has both gain and overdrive to work with, and it's pretty easy to get a nice ACDC sound. It doesn't have 24 different amp/effect models like a modeling amp does, but the upside is that none of the tones are garbage, either.

The crush might not sound as good as a tube amp, but I definitely don't feel like it's junk.
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Old 01-12-2013, 10:48 PM   #20
davehail1092
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lefty huh? well, not as much selection there. lol The Ibanez would probably be a great guitar for you, i loved the one i had. mine was great for metal.

heres a few amps to think about.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/ampl...uitar-combo-amp

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/ampl...uitar-combo-amp

and i cant stress enough, thet before you buy, play the guitar, and make sure you like the sound.
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