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Old 01-08-2013, 11:23 AM   #1
HoneyboyHart
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From the club owner's perspective...

If you ever want to be a working band it's good to understand the club owner's perspective. It took me years to learn what this club owner explains here...

Open Letter From A Club Owner
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:32 AM   #2
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Thanks for sharing that, but:

Quote:
Hint: Keep your drummer quiet.


Yeah, you f*cking try...
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:36 AM   #3
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I hear that Tiger Woods owns lots of clubs. I wonder how he would feel about that?
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:36 AM   #4
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guy sounds like a d bag.
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:47 AM   #5
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Mmm have you tried this cognac?
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:57 AM   #6
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Can see where he's coming from
Went down Newquay once on stag do, saw the same band play Walkabout three times over the weekend.
Each night, same setlist (well close enough)
They only played covers, and, yeah pretty much everyone was buying drinks....


Although the message in that article only applies to certain styles of bands if you think about it, I don't think the owner of that establishment regularly books bands which tour
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:01 PM   #7
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Trying to work out how a band could get me to buy a drink ever.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:01 PM   #8
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As a business owner, I can relate to so much this guy is saying. I run a music school, and everyday I get musicians asking for work with exactly the same attitude as the guy in the article explains. Just because our business is music, we are still in business, we are the ones who pay the bills/rent/tax etc. A professional musician should have the same professional attitude as any other business.

You may not need to wear the suit like in some jobs, but you still need reliability, ability to please customers, and the only reason I may hire you is because you make me more money. I don't care how fast you can play a guitar solo. There's the harsh truth.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:08 PM   #9
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Meh it makes sense. They don't want you to play in their business if it's not good for business... They don't owe bands anything, if they let you play it's because it's good for them. If it's not, they won't want you to play.


The guy writing it sounds like a bit of a dick, but not really because of what he's actually saying.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:15 PM   #10
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When club owners start giving bands/musicians their fair share of pay, then I will start feeling sorry for them.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:21 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tukk04
When club owners start giving bands/musicians their fair share of pay, then I will start feeling sorry for them.



Nailed it.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:33 PM   #12
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Great, he can run a bar that plays crappy music for people who don't care. More power to him for making that money.

Just sounds like your usual shitty bar. God, the business aspect of music is so ****ing lame. Nothing wrong with it, it's just so boring. Like people.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:38 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tukk04
When club owners start giving bands/musicians their fair share of pay, then I will start feeling sorry for them.

/thread

EDIT: a very good point is raised in the comments:

Quote:
Newsflash: full time pros donít work for beer.

Last edited by CoreysMonster : 01-08-2013 at 12:42 PM.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:43 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tukk04
When club owners start giving bands/musicians their fair share of pay, then I will start feeling sorry for them.

I think this guy is saying that a lot of bands do not earn any fair share of the pay. You don't earn money for simply playing, you earn it for being good for business.

I think his point is a lot of bands want to play for their own reasons, but don't recognise that the venue is only going to let them play for their own reasons too. Playing at a venue is a business partnership like any other, they only want it if it's good for business.

Bands and venues should work together to make sure that neither one get shafted, but I think really he's saying bands need to recognise the venues aren't raking it in off poor hardworking artists, they're trying to get by and even if a band is very talented that doesn't mean they deserve better pay that a shit covers band.

The band has to respect that their not entitled to playing at the venue, it's for business. But of course you're right, the venue also has to respect that the band aren't playing there as a favour to them either and need to give the band the credit they deserve too, monetary or otherwise.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:47 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoreysMonster
EDIT: a very good point is raised in the comments:

Most guys that are ok with being payed in booze are just looking to jam. Bands that are trying to get somewhere (literally and figuratively) normally aren't alright with it because that money needs to go towards gas to get to the next show.

The guy is right in saying that dressing appropriately makes you look professional, but my previous comment still stands.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:53 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadClownDisease
I think this guy is saying that a lot of bands do not earn any fair share of the pay. You don't earn money for simply playing, you earn it for being good for business.

I think his point is a lot of bands want to play for their own reasons, but don't recognise that the venue is only going to let them play for their own reasons too. Playing at a venue is a business partnership like any other, they only want it if it's good for business.

Bands and venues should work together to make sure that neither one get shafted, but I think really he's saying bands need to recognise the venues aren't raking it in off poor hardworking artists, they're trying to get by and even if a band is very talented that doesn't mean they deserve better pay that a shit covers band.

The band has to respect that their not entitled to playing at the venue, it's for business. But of course you're right, the venue also has to respect that the band aren't playing there as a favour to them either and need to give the band the credit they deserve too, monetary or otherwise.

I'll admit, I have a bit of a chip on my shoulder from playing decent sized club gigs and drawing people in and still getting stiffed.

But if a band is trying, they deserve to be payed. If a club owner doesn't look enough into a band before booking them that's his fault, and if a band is playing gigs that are more serious or over their head than what they are capable of, they'd be best off finding some open mic's or local showcases to play.

Just like any service job, you can't refuse to pay after the work is done unless the worker/s severely fucked up. You agreed to pay for the service, and if they messed up you have to take it out with them.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:54 PM   #17
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Always agree on the playing price before the show. Always.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:58 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustRooster
Always agree on the playing price before the show. Always.

Well, if you sign a simple document saying, "We (the band) will be paid (some amount of currency)", then you're covered. But if the club ends up losing money on you, then don't expect them to hire you back again.
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Old 01-08-2013, 01:02 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tukk04
I'll admit, I have a bit of a chip on my shoulder from playing decent sized club gigs and drawing people in and still getting stiffed.

But if a band is trying, they deserve to be payed. If a club owner doesn't look enough into a band before booking them that's his fault, and if a band is playing gigs that are more serious or over their head than what they are capable of, they'd be best off finding some open mic's or local showcases to play.

Just like any service job, you can't refuse to pay after the work is done unless the worker/s severely fucked up. You agreed to pay for the service, and if they messed up you have to take it out with them.

Oh aye of course, that's what I mean by it's a business partnership like any other.

I think the problem is there's both an ignorance about the business side of it from many amateur bands, but of course if the venue is going to treat it in a manner of a business deal, they need to treat it in the same way in terms of pay.


Bands need to recognise that although playing music may be about the performance and their music for them, they're there to make money for the bar; but obviously at the same time the bar needs to recognise in that case you need to treat the band like any other service and get reasonable terms of pay sorted.
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Old 01-08-2013, 01:03 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by crazysam23_Atax
Well, if you sign a simple document saying, "We (the band) will be paid (some amount of currency)", then you're covered. But if the club ends up losing money on you, then don't expect them to hire you back again.



That's fine, I'll just play somewhere else. As long as they know that my band plays for a certain amount a show, and that regardless of the crowd I get that certain amount.

My band plays for $200 a show. If the bar makes $50, we still get $200. If the bar makes $5,000, we still get $200. Just works out best.
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