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Old 01-22-2013, 07:34 PM   #41
jetwash69
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Originally Posted by Mephaphil
Outgrow?

I have a solid morality based on education, equality and respect that values the lives of people over the capital gain of shareholders.

What the **** do I need to outgrow?


If you've read Animal Farm and still don't get it, then I'm certainly not going to be able to break through. It's about the economic principal of scarcity and certain elements of human nature that are constant throughout all recorded human history. Certainly you've come across these ideas in your education, and yet you still believe utopia is achievable, just like you believed Kensai is really dead. Don't outgrow that one either.

How come every time people try to achieve utopia we end up with distopia instead?
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:34 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by Mephaphil
That's what I said.

What has him not being finnish, have to do with the fact that he is dead?
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:36 PM   #43
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Screw it. Imma bookmark this thread so I can one day revisit it in the year 2050. Let's ask future Joshua Garcia.

Hey old self!
Assuming it's still here, and you remember this, is the new UG cool and what-not? Also, can you still get a boner?
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:36 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by jetwash69
If you've read Animal Farm and still don't get it, then I'm certainly not going to be able to break through. It's about the economic principal of scarcity and certain elements of human nature that are constant throughout all recorded human history. Certainly you've come across these ideas in your education, and yet you still believe utopia is achievable, just like you believed Kensai is really dead. Don't outgrow that one either.

How come every time people try to achieve utopia we end up with distopia instead?

I don't see how the book actually deals with the principals of scarcity (has been a while since I read it). Certainly it only has redistribution elements in it?
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:37 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
No, I have MS. I will just gangbang the pitmonkeys for 10-20 more years then my body is done.

Oh ok, you'll get your service medals even with early retirement.

But if you're serious about the MS, sorry to hear that.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:38 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
I don't see how the book actually deals with the principals of scarcity (has been a while since I read it). Certainly it only has redistribution elements in it?


Nope. Lots more to it. Did you read it in English or a translation? Read it again--the English version.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:39 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by tukk04
Oh ok, you'll get your service medals even with early retirement.

But if you're serious about the MS, sorry to hear that.

Jesus christ, what is wrong with you people. I bet you all think he's a girl too..



Neo, whatever you're doing, you're a genius because it seems to fool everyone for some reason
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:39 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by tukk04
Oh ok, you'll get your service medals even with early retirement.

But if you're serious about the MS, sorry to hear that.

I meant SM. I am doing too much SM with you pit monkeys, it's destroying my body.

edit: this is actually a terrible mistake. I'm sorry if someone actually has a terrible disease.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:41 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by jetwash69
Nope. Lots more to it. Did you read it in English or a translation? Read it again--the English version.

English, but it was when I was 14 or so. I just saw a story about the formation of a totalitarian state after a revolution that was meant to end in an utopia, because of propaganda and abuse of power misformed it. Just like it did in Russia.

It's quite similar in my opinion to road to serfdom by Hayek.


edit: or do you mean by scarcity, the problem that the workers had too little while the chief pig had too much? I see that more as a distribution problem. Well you can actually call it a scarcity problem.

Last edited by Neo Evil11 : 01-22-2013 at 07:43 PM.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:49 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by sam b
Jesus christ, what is wrong with you people. I bet you all think he's a girl too..

Neo, whatever you're doing, you're a genius because it seems to fool everyone for some reason

Well if neo actually had MS is would suck horribly, it's a terrible disease and a family friend had it. It was upsetting to see them go through before they died from related consequences.

Apparently you didn't see the "but if you're serious..." part.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:49 PM   #51
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In the future, maybe the Pit'll just be a cult dedicated to worshipping roaraudio, our Saviour.

Amen!

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Old 01-22-2013, 07:49 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by jetwash69
just like you believed Kensai is really dead.


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Old 01-22-2013, 07:50 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
No, I have MS... ...10-20 more years then my body is done.

I hope that's just dark humor.

But if not, maybe this will give you some hope:

I know a woman who is in her 50s with MS and is still going strong. Let's just say she's at the top in her field (think high-level public-sector executive) and in outstanding physical shape (she's still an athlete, even though that's just an amature pastime for her). She's had many struggles with MS, but she's been beating it with flying colors so far. She works at least 70 hours a week and she's raising two children on top of that. I don't know how long she's had MS, though. I wish you could meet her; she's truly an inspiration.

I also have an old friend whose wife got MS around 21 years ago. Last time we were in touch (a couple of years ago) she was still beating it.

Hang in there--it's a marathon.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:54 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetwash69
If you've read Animal Farm and still don't get it, then I'm certainly not going to be able to break through. It's about the economic principal of scarcity and certain elements of human nature that are constant throughout all recorded human history. Certainly you've come across these ideas in your education, and yet you still believe utopia is achievable, just like you believed Kensai is really dead. Don't outgrow that one either.

How come every time people try to achieve utopia we end up with distopia instead?


I'm not here to justify my beliefs to you, man. You can justify your greed in whatever way you want, just don't expect me to agree. I wouldn't use one novel as your entire basis for argument, it's a story with many interpretations.

I happen to believe that humanity has the ability to evolve socially, that we're a young race and as we've become more accepting of homosexuality and unaccepting of racism, we can also start to move towards respecting people over monetary gain. Given the state of our environment, with the constant pillaging of natural resources we'll either have to change or face extinction.

I don't know if greed is a real thing, it could just be a result of desperation, of circumstance, of a global poverty. Who knows, but what I do know, is that no 'utopia' has existed with help from those around them. Early Communist Russia, lots of plus points, boycotted by the world - became shitty. Same with Cuba, China etc. You force people into a corner, to be self sufficient and they'll do what they have to in order to survive and that's what our society is, a fight for survival. If we didn't have to fight then maybe that trait, which a lot of people agree is learned could be forgotten.

Tell me that those dying of starvation, living in poverty or homeless in the capital city of the richest nation in the world are cool with capitalism. millions living in poverty in America alone, is your way working for them?

Or those who's countries are devoured by war in the name of it.

Or who's country has no rights to their own natural resources leaving the people in complete famine because they have nothing.

Yea, right. Dystopia, over 3/4 of the world live in it already mate. I just believe in a society where people are treated a little fairer. If that's achieved through reforms, that's cool. Free healthcare is a good start.

I don't mind discussing this with you, but you don't need to insult me, I don't know Kensai. It's not that unreasonable of me to ask if something someone says is true.
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Last edited by Mephaphil : 01-22-2013 at 08:00 PM.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:54 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetwash69
I hope that's just dark humor.

But if not, maybe this will give you some hope:

I know a woman who is in her 50s with MS and is still going strong. Let's just say she's at the top in her field (think high-level public-sector executive) and in outstanding physical shape (she's still an athlete, even though that's just an amature pastime for her). She's had many struggles with MS, but she's been beating it with flying colors so far. She works at least 70 hours a week and she's raising two children on top of that. I don't know how long she's had MS, though. I wish you could meet her; she's truly an inspiration.

I also have an old friend whose wife got MS around 21 years ago. Last time we were in touch (a couple of years ago) she was still beating it.

Hang in there--it's a marathon.

Dude, I was talking about how the SM was destroying my body. ;_; stop treating me like I have a serious illness.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:57 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
English, but it was when I was 14 or so. I just saw a story about the formation of a totalitarian state after a revolution that was meant to end in an utopia, because of propaganda and abuse of power misformed it. Just like it did in Russia.

It's quite similar in my opinion to road to serfdom by Hayek.


edit: or do you mean by scarcity, the problem that the workers had too little while the chief pig had too much? I see that more as a distribution problem. Well you can actually call it a scarcity problem.


If you don't understand what I mean by the economic principal of scarcity, and if you've already taken a few college Econ classes, then I don't think I'll be able to explain it here. Really, everything in Econ hinges on this principal. If you don't understand that, then how can you make an informed evaluation of any politico-economic system?
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:58 PM   #57
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He means a culture of want want want in a world of limited resources.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:59 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
Dude, I was talking about how the SM was destroying my body. ;_; stop treating me like I have a serious illness.

Why? that's how we treat you normally.
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Old 01-22-2013, 07:59 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by jetwash69
If you don't understand what I mean by the economic principal of scarcity, and if you've already taken a few college Econ classes, then I don't think I'll be able to explain it here. Really, everything in Econ hinges on this principal. If you don't understand that, then how can you make an informed evaluation of any politico-economic system?

I'm almost donewith my master's degree in Economics.

It's a bit shit to say the book hinges on the principle of scarcity, whereas there are a million other terms you can name for this problem without making it same like it's the basic foundation of economics that's being discussed. The distribution of resources is indeed a main part of the law of scarcity'.

edit: It's their entire freedom that's being limited, not just their control over the goods.

Last edited by Neo Evil11 : 01-22-2013 at 08:01 PM.
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Old 01-22-2013, 08:02 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
What has him not being finnish, have to do with the fact that he is dead?


I read his posts, he posts in the NFL thread, I made a joke that no one outside of the US watches Football. Therefore - Not Swedish. I called shenanigans.
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