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Old 02-17-2013, 04:47 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by rockingamer2
America is very different than Ancient Rome.

Elaborate?
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Old 02-17-2013, 04:50 PM   #62
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Way to ruin weed for me by associating it with Sweden, dickhead.
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Old 02-17-2013, 04:51 PM   #63
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I always just imagined Sweden as a shit Britain.
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Old 02-17-2013, 04:51 PM   #64
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Elaborate?


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Old 02-17-2013, 04:52 PM   #65
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Old 02-17-2013, 05:08 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by magnus_maximus
Elaborate?

The US and Ancient Rome do have similarities, much of it coming from the fact that they are both "top dog" in a way, but they exist in completely different contexts. Saying that the America will fall "under it's own greatness" (what ever the hell that means) like Rome did is a gross oversimplification of history.

The whole "history repeats itself" idea irks me as well. Sure, things sort of go in cycles, but there are new things happening all the time. When in world history has one of two great "empires" suddenly dissolve itself rather peacefully? When in world history did we have the means to communicate almost instantly around the globe?
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:14 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by rockingamer2
The US and Ancient Rome do have similarities, much of it coming from the fact that they are both "top dog" in a way, but they exist in completely different contexts. Saying that the America will fall "under it's own greatness" (what ever the hell that means) like Rome did is a gross oversimplification of history.

The whole "history repeats itself" idea irks me as well. Sure, things sort of go in cycles, but there are new things happening all the time. When in world history has one of two great "empires" suddenly dissolve itself rather peacefully? When in world history did we have the means to communicate almost instantly around the globe?

East/West Rome
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:25 PM   #68
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The USA and Rome are different, because the USA is not build on the militairy overthrow of an entire continent. What region do you think wants to seperate themselves from the USA? Alaska?
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:26 PM   #69
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Uhh long wall of text for a simple answer. YES. OF COURSE. When? I have no idea, but nothing lasts forever.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:26 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
The USA and Rome are different, because the USA is not build on the militairy overthrow of an entire continent. What region do you think wants to seperate themselves from the USA? Alaska?


It.. kind of is.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:28 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by magnus_maximus
It.. kind of is.

Oh yeah I'm sorry, I didn't see it was you whom I was talking to.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:28 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
The USA and Rome are different, because the USA is not build on the militairy overthrow of an entire continent. What region do you think wants to seperate themselves from the USA? Alaska?


Well it is, it's just that the Native Americans are only a small minority in America now.

Edit:
Yea, what the other guy said.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:29 PM   #73
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Well it is, it's just that the Native Americans are only a small minority in America now.

Edit:
Yea, what the other guy said.

Ok, but that's quite different from the Roman Empire who were a minority in their own empire.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:30 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
Ok, but that's quite different from the Roman Empire who were a minority in their own empire.


So the subjugation of the Native Americans doesn't count as the overthrow of a continent because they were massacred almost to extinction?
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:33 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by magnus_maximus
So the subjugation of the Native Americans doesn't count as the overthrow of a continent because they were massacred almost to extinction?

By the Europoors.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:34 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnus_maximus
So the subjugation of the Native Americans doesn't count as the overthrow of a continent because they were massacred almost to extinction?

It's my phrasing of the thing. I meant that Rome's power was entirely dependent on their ability to use their military might to keep the overthrown factions under their reign. As the Romans didn't have the numbers any more to hold that kind of area + some other problems, their empire collapsed and all races broke free.

The USA does not need to be scared on the indians, and therefore has less chance of collapsing under its own policies. If it does collapse it will be because of a different reason.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:42 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by magnus_maximus
East/West Rome

But it wasn't exactly by choice and there were plenty of external pressures. And I don't think they were as ready to kill each other as the US and USSR were.

--

Rome didn't "overthrow" a continent. They conquered lands around the Mediterranean Sea, a fact that was a very important factor of their success. Sea travel was faster than land travel, and as the started to expand farther and farther away from water, it became harder to keep the peace and establish Roman authority in those regions.

Further, the US doesn't need to keep expanding to prosper to survive like Rome did.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:42 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockingamer2
But it wasn't exactly by choice and there were plenty of external pressures. And I don't think they were as ready to kill each other as the US and USSR were.

--

Rome didn't "overthrow" a continent. They conquered lands around the Mediterranean Sea, a fact that was a very important factor of their success. Sea travel was faster than land travel, and as the started to expand farther and farther away from water, it became harder to keep the peace and establish Roman authority in those regions.

Further, the US doesn't need to keep expanding to prosper to survive like Rome did.

The conquered till the North of the Netherlands, parts of Britain and Germany.
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:42 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by rockingamer2
But it wasn't exactly by choice and there were plenty of external pressures. And I don't think they were as ready to kill each other as the US and USSR were.

--

Rome didn't "overthrow" a continent. They conquered lands around the Mediterranean Sea, a fact that was a very important factor of their success. Sea travel was faster than land travel, and as the started to expand farther and farther away from water, it became harder to keep the peace and establish Roman authority in those regions.

Further, the US doesn't need to keep expanding to prosper to survive like Rome did.

Then why are you the world's police if not to maintain overseas assets?
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:55 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
The conquered till the North of the Netherlands, parts of Britain and Germany.

And that's around the time they stopped expanding so much into the rest of Europe. It was also harder to do since the people living in much of un-Romanized Europe were nomadic. Most of the people Rome conquered were already living a pretty sedentary lifestyle, so being conquered by Rome wasn't a big upset to them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnus_maximus
Then why are you the world's police if not to maintain overseas assets?

The way Rome needed to expand was partly because of their military. They needed the army in order to conquer land. They also needed land because they gave each retiree land and money on conquered land, an incentive for enlistment. This cycle starts to break down when expansion slows.
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Last edited by rockingamer2 : 02-17-2013 at 06:56 PM.
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