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Old 03-25-2013, 08:33 PM   #1
NVDT
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Ibanez Talman vs. "Regular" Acoustic

Hello everyone.

I started taking lessons a while ago in a fingerpicking course using my electric guitar (I recently started learning the guitar and it's the only guitar I own, altough I love it ),
and now I started looking into buying an acoustic one, but having learned on an electric I like the thinner strings and feel of it.
One that caught my eye, being some kind of hybrid, are the Ibanez Talman series, mainly the TCY10E, TCM50E, TCY8 ( and just my luck, those ones aren't reviewed on this site it seems, or search function is lying to me. The 20's are )
and to try those in the shop, I would have to go the extra (metaphorical) mile, so I prefer to ask here, also because I don't know a lot about guitars, being only a beginner, and I wouldn't want to pay too much for something that only sounds right in my untrained ears.

Now how do these "hybrids" really compare to regular acoustics ( especially unplugged ) ? Is the sound still nice for the price ( all around 200 euros ) compared to an acoustic of that price range, do they really handle like an electric (thinner strings, thinnerbody), how do these three models fare up against eachother, which one would you recommend as an (mainly unplugged ) acoustic, and more importantly : are they worth buying ?

I looked up specs, maybe someone that knows a lot more about guitar than I do can deduct some crucial facts I should need to know based on these specs:

Ibanez TCY10E Black
show


Ibanez TCM50E
show


IBANEZ TCY8
show


I know this is a big post, but solving a couple of these questions would really help me , thanks in advance.
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Old 03-25-2013, 08:47 PM   #2
patticake
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this isn't actually a hybrid - it's an acoustic guitar in an electric guitar's shape. this particular guitar sounds pretty poor, and the narrow nut isn't particularly suitable for fingerstyle.
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Old 03-25-2013, 09:42 PM   #3
stepchildusmc
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if your looking for an electric feel, try out a fender t-bucket, sonoran or an Ovation guitar. as patti points out, the narrower nut on all of them wii detract from fingerstyle playing.
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:06 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NVDT
One that caught my eye, being some kind of hybrid, are the Ibanez Talman series,....[ ]....
OK, the Ibanez "Talmans", are not a "hybrid" guitar. In fact, and IMHO, they are not either a good acoustic, or a decent electric.

If you Google Ibanez "Montage", they would be an example of a true hybrid. These are discontinued in the US, some some may still be for sale in Europe.

Any full size electric-acoustic with a piezoelectric, (under saddle) transducer, will give you a much more realistic acoustic experience, whether plugged or unplugged.

The Talman's body size is rather small, and most of them are all laminate. None of which contributes to them having a good voice acoustically.

Shop some more, and show us what else you can find...

Here's YouTube's "famous lefty" Jon Way, demoing a Crafter Hybrid. (Which by extension, is a Taylor T5 knockoff).

Last edited by Captaincranky : 03-26-2013 at 01:13 AM.
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Old 03-26-2013, 07:59 AM   #5
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Those are some very interesting things to know, thank you, I'll look into those names and see what I can find
also when you say "The narrower nut on all of them will detract from fingerstyle playing." do you mean t he narrower nut on all the Talmans or the narrower nut on the "electric feeling guitars" ?

Last edited by NVDT : 03-26-2013 at 08:17 AM.
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Old 03-26-2013, 08:50 AM   #6
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the narrower nut on any guitar with a narrower nut. most of us finger pickers prefer a minimum of 1 3/4" - some of us prefer even wider - 1 13/16" or even 1 7/8". i have very small hands, but discovered after years of playing slender neck guitars that my fingerstyle improved in fluidity and speed when playing guitars with wider nuts and string spacing.
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:34 AM   #7
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I looked into the guitars stepchildusmc recommended and (because the T-bucket is not available anymore in my store, even though they are cheaper, and I wouldn't want to order something I haven't had in my hands) the Fender Sonoran SCE looks good and has good reviews on this site, but it's more expensive and has a smaller nut than the T, being at 1 5/8.

Now I've been looking for more "traditional" acoustics and semi-acoustics ( because if having a wider nut improves fingerstyle even after having it figured out, better learn fingerstyle with the right equipment right away instead of having to adjust later on ).

This was the Washburn EA10 ( cheaper -I'm a student and can't afford everything :p -,with a 1.69" nut so a tad bigger than the above ones).
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Old 03-26-2013, 05:04 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by NVDT
....[ ]....This was the Washburn EA10 ( cheaper -I'm a student and can't afford everything :p -,with a 1.69" nut so a tad bigger than the above ones).
You do realize that the decimal equivalent of, "1 5/8 inches", is 1.0625 inches.

So that's a whopping 5.5 THOUSANDTHS difference.
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Old 03-26-2013, 05:08 PM   #9
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wait isn't it 1 5/8 = 1.625 inches ? 8/8 is 1 inch, so 5/8 is 5*(1/8) which is about 5* 0.125, because 8 times the 0.125 would make the 1 inch again ?
Or even : 1+5/8 inches, = 8/8 + 5/8 inches = 13/8 inches = 13*0.125 inches= 1.625 inches

Or does the phrase 1 5/8 inch not mean what I think it means (I count in metric)?

Anyway, it's (the washburn) a tadbit bigger, but about the same bigger than the Fender than it's smaller than the "preferred minimum" for fingerpicking.

Last edited by NVDT : 03-26-2013 at 05:13 PM.
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Old 03-26-2013, 05:44 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by NVDT
wait isn't it 1 5/8 = 1.625 inches ? 8/8 is 1 inch, so 5/8 is 5*(1/8) which is about 5* 0.125, because 8 times the 0.125 would make the 1 inch again ?
Or even : 1+5/8 inches, = 8/8 + 5/8 inches = 13/8 inches = 13*0.125 inches= 1.625 inches

Or does the phrase 1 5/8 inch not mean what I think it means (I count in metric)?

Anyway, it's (the washburn) a tadbit bigger, but about the same bigger than the Fender than it's smaller than the "preferred minimum" for fingerpicking.


No, I just accidentally stuffed in an extra zero. 1/16" is .0625, and I had that stuck in my head, thinking that Ibanez acoustics are usually 1 11/16".

That would be, as you say, "1.625". the difference between that and 1.69 equals .065 (65 thousandths), or about .013" per string gap.

Believe it or not Agile, (Rondo Music), sells a wide neck version of their Les Paul copies @ 1 3/4". So, if you want to channel your inner Lindsey Buckingham or Mark Knopfler, that would be another place to start.

The only steel sting acoustic that springs immediately to mind @ 1 3/4" neck width is the Seagull Original S-6, and it's out of your budget.

In any event, 1 3/4" inch necks are getting harder and harder to find.

So, shop more, and/or save more money, because that's the paradigm this neck width issue is generating.

Or, you could consider this. The Yamaha FG700 has a 1 11/16" nut width and costs 200 USD. So, in lieu of the Talman and Washburn shit, buy one of those, everybody else has, and they're very happy with them.

I expect that if you don't know how to finger pick a guitar, and begin to try learning to do so, going in with the idea that you can't possibly do it on a 1 11/16" neck, will make it 3 times as hard as it should be.

Last edited by Captaincranky : 03-26-2013 at 05:59 PM.
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Old 03-26-2013, 06:24 PM   #11
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the seagull original s6 is out of your budget - unless you buy used, that is. the yamaha fg700 is definitely one of the best bang for the buck guitars around, as it's well made with a solid top, and sounds pretty good, too. there are recording kings here (not sure about where you are) that sell for just under $300 and the parlors and 000s have the wider nut. they sound good, too.

i'm actually seeing more 1 3/4" nuts than i used to, but not at the lowest prices for some reason. an example is that taylor offers 1 3/4" nuts on almost all their guitars except their made-in-mexico series - the babies, 100 and 200 series. go figure! yamaha offers 1 3/4" nuts on some of the L series, but not the less expensive FG series. blueridge offers 1 3/4" nuts on their A guitars, which have adi tops and cost more, but only offer a wider nut on their parlor in their regular series, and it's one of their more expensive non-bling guitars.
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Old 03-26-2013, 07:00 PM   #12
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Ok thanks everyone for your help, and i'll definately look into the FG 700 if it's really that amazing.
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Old 03-26-2013, 07:12 PM   #13
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i like the fg700s. it's a decent starter guitar. it has excellent dollar for sound content( i recently bought 6 of them to donate to a local youth center... never got to play any of 'em). i actually sat down today and played one for about a half hour at a music shop i like to haunt. it's a great sounding guitar. nobody will ever mistake it for a Taylor but, not bad.
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Old 03-26-2013, 08:23 PM   #14
patticake
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no one will mistake it for a taylor, and i prefer the seagull original s6. that being said, in its price range it sounds better and is more resonant than the competition.

btw, that was very good of you to donate them to your youth center

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Originally Posted by stepchildusmc
i like the fg700s. it's a decent starter guitar. it has excellent dollar for sound content( i recently bought 6 of them to donate to a local youth center... never got to play any of 'em). i actually sat down today and played one for about a half hour at a music shop i like to haunt. it's a great sounding guitar. nobody will ever mistake it for a Taylor but, not bad.
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Old 03-27-2013, 12:03 AM   #15
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One (1) Euro, as of today, equals $1.29 in US currency.

PS; I checked, double checked, then checked again, the math in this post....
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Old 03-27-2013, 09:41 AM   #16
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pure selfishness patti... i need someone in my area with the same musical interests. everyone in this area plays country music ! i'm just growing a band !
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Old 03-27-2013, 03:27 PM   #17
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I think you would enjoy a solid top dreadnought or jumbo acoustic guitar. They are bigger than what you are used to, but they will be significantly louder than a smaller acoustic, i.e. the talman. You can get a great acoustic guitar with a solid top for under $200 these days. Check out some guitars from Yamaha, Kona, and Johnson. For the money they are Great!
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Old 03-27-2013, 04:26 PM   #18
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Check out some guitars from Yamaha, Kona, and Johnson. For the money they are Great!
I dont know why so many people have a problem with Yamaha, seems they get a bad wrap for some reason...I personally enjoy most Yamaha's especially when compared to alot of Ibanez's accoustic, which often are laminate vs. wood and can be more focused on visual appeal instead of sound quality...which is OK if that is what you are looking for. At any rate, the truth of the matter is when trying to find a suitable acoustic, especially when you are used to playing electric, there is no substitute for "hands on" trial, meaning if it feels good in your hands and you like the way it sounds then there is your winner. People have different preferences when it comes to how an acoustic should sound, some prefer the deep, warm sound, while others prefer the sort of squeaky brassy sound...one thing I will tell you is you MUST MUST MUST MUST plug in when trying out, some acoustics, especially those that are less expensive do not translate well when plugged up. Hope this was helpful.
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Old 03-27-2013, 04:35 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by GypsyJen
I dont know why so many people have a problem with Yamaha, seems they get a bad wrap for some reason..
Where exactly is it in this forum that you hear Yamaha acoustics, "getting a bad rap"?

If you want to stick with that assertion, I'm going to offer a counter proposal. Which would be, either you can't read, or you're delusional.


Quote:
Originally Posted by GypsyJen
I personally enjoy most Yamaha's especially when compared to a lot of Ibanez's accoustic, which often are laminate vs. wood and can be more focused on visual appeal instead of sound quality...which is OK if that is what you are looking for. At any rate, the truth of the matter is when trying to find a suitable acoustic, especially when you are used to playing electric, there is no substitute for "hands on" trial, meaning if it feels good in your hands and you like the way it sounds then there is your winner. People have different preferences when it comes to how an acoustic should sound, some prefer the deep, warm sound, while others prefer the sort of squeaky brassy sound...one thing I will tell you is you MUST MUST MUST MUST plug in when trying out, some acoustics, especially those that are less expensive do not translate well when plugged up. Hope this was helpful.
Ibanez acoustics tend to sound quite decent plugged in. (Whatever they're made from). Even my much maligned, crappy,"Exotic Wood" model, has a kick ass chorus that simply sparkles......aannnnd, it's a jumbo....

Last edited by Captaincranky : 03-27-2013 at 04:36 PM.
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Old 03-27-2013, 04:47 PM   #20
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lots of people hear yamaha and immediately have a negative reaction. i've replied to them on this board and agf, as well as in many stores or with friends who are buying a guitar. i've never figured out why.
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