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Old 04-19-2013, 10:58 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by SlackerBabbath
I've said it before and I'll say it again, vegetarians are responsible for the existence of meat replacement products that apparently taste like the real thing... but how do they know that they taste like the real thing?
Obviously because they get someone who eats meat to compare the two, ergo, vegetarianism is inadvertantly causing animals to be slaughtered.
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Old 04-19-2013, 10:58 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by metacarpi
True, but given the way our teeth have evolved to include incisors, it's pretty clear that meat has been a stpale part of the human diet for 1,000's of years.

So?

Judging by history, Smallpox is a natural part of being human. Do you propose we bring it back because it's natural?
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:00 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by MadClownDisease
No, due to the way we have evolved we require certain nutrients, evolution doesn't dictate we must eat meat. In fact you just said it yourself, we can get all these nutrients elsewhere.

Meat does taste great though (well not all meat obviously, but that goes for anything).

The point is that meat is where ALL of those amino acids are. Those who don't eat meat are often deficient in at least one essential amino acid chain because, while nuts contain some amino acids, they don't contain all of the ones we need to function properly. The rest goes for tofu, and whatever else. While rabbits are literally the only animal we eat that don't contain every protein you need.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:02 AM   #44
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You sure told all those vegetarians that we have here
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:08 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by VanTheKraut
The point is that meat is where ALL of those amino acids are. Those who don't eat meat are often deficient in at least one essential amino acid chain because, while nuts contain some amino acids, they don't contain all of the ones we need to function properly. The rest goes for tofu, and whatever else. While rabbits are literally the only animal we eat that don't contain every protein you need.

Yes, but that they don't all occur in one place apart from in animals doesn't mean someone can't have a balanced diet with all of them whilst not eating any animals. You just eat more than one type of food. It's really not an issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by metacarpi
True, but given the way our teeth have evolved to include incisors, it's pretty clear that meat has been a stpale part of the human diet for 1,000's of years.

We ate meat to survive, the fact it's meat is neither here nor there. We have canines as it helped us to survive and those teeth developed, but that doesn't mean we still need to eat meat nor that our teeth tell us what we should do.

EDIT: That was badly phrased, what I mean is that eating meat wasn't the aim of the game, surviving was. We got canines as it bettered our survival historically. That's no longer an issue for most people as meat isn't necessary to survive.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:12 AM   #46
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I'm a vegetarian. Not because I like animals, but because my tastebuds are ******ed. I have a small amount of foods that I eat, and I'm still alive and functioning.

Even the smell of meat alone makes me sick.

I would punch an animal to death if need be, I just don't care. Loose.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:16 AM   #47
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I am not a vegetarian because I love animals; I am a vegetarian because I hate plants.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:29 AM   #48
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it doesnt. youve got mayb e 10% of the worlds population at most not eat meat. that does not help the cause at all. its avoiding the problem. just keep that in mind. someone else will always eat your burger you didnt buy.

How does someone else eat the burger that I didn't? Are meateaters going to double their intake of meat?

edit: vegetarians get their aminoacids not just from vegetables but also from diary products and eggs.

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Old 04-19-2013, 11:33 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
How does someone else eat the burger that I didn't? Are meateaters going to double their intake of meat?

edit: vegetarians get their aminoacids not just from vegetables but also from diary products and eggs.

I will. I'm thinking about a bacon burger for lunch. Five Guys, anyone?
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:35 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by VanTheKraut
I will. I'm thinking about a bacon burger for lunch. Five Guys, anyone?

Have fun. I don't see how this is extra though, you most likely would have eaten that burger anyway.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:38 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
How does someone else eat the burger that I didn't? Are meateaters going to double their intake of meat?

edit: vegetarians get their aminoacids not just from vegetables but also from diary products and eggs.


If the issue is cruelty to animals how can you justify eating dairy and egg products? Egg laying chickens are the ones kept in the shittest conditions because the fitness of the hen is that important to egg-laying, and dairy cows suffer a great number of degenerative diseases, both genetic and physical, thanks to the fact that they have udders that are five times the size they should be. Seems to me that if you decry animal cruelty and the eat eggs you're just as much at fault as someone who eats meat. It's not the killing that's the cruel part.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:39 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by Todd Hart
If the issue is cruelty to animals how can you justify eating dairy and egg products? Egg laying chickens are the ones kept in the shittest conditions because the fitness of the hen is that important to egg-laying, and dairy cows suffer a great number of degenerative diseases, both genetic and physical, thanks to the fact that they have udders that are five times the size they should be. Seems to me that if you decry animal cruelty and the eat eggs you're just as much at fault as someone who eats meat. It's not the killing that's the cruel part.

You do know that you actually can get eggs from chickens that can walk around freely right? Same goes for the milk.

I assume you don't know because you only look at the cheap ones. Never in my life have my parents or I bought eggs that were from the battery.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:46 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by Neo Evil11
You do know that you actually can get eggs from chickens that can walk around freely right? Same goes for the milk.

I assume you don't know because you only look at the cheap ones. Never in my life have my parents or I bought eggs that were from the battery.


Yes, but the vast majority aren't because it is far less economically viable.

And whenever you've bought anything with pastry it'll most likely have used battery farmed eggs. Same goes for pretty much all egg products that you've bought, and milk products. To pretend that you haven't contributed to the demand is naive.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:47 AM   #54
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Which, if your issue is animal welfare, is not a problem

I just find it personally amusing that the whole "We need to protect animals!" movement is essentially moving for less of these animals to exist overall. Instead of killing, they're preventing birth.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:51 AM   #55
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Yes, but the vast majority aren't because it is far less economically viable.

Not my problem, I buy what I want and I can't stop other people buying from what they want.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:52 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by VanTheKraut
The point is that meat is where ALL of those amino acids are. Those who don't eat meat are often deficient in at least one essential amino acid chain because, while nuts contain some amino acids, they don't contain all of the ones we need to function properly. The rest goes for tofu, and whatever else. While rabbits are literally the only animal we eat that don't contain every protein you need.

Yes, this is completely true. As you can clearly see, every vegetarian ever has died because they haven't been eating all the amino acids they need


But seriously I'm so fucking healthy.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:04 PM   #57
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lol a lot of people treat vegetarianism as an eating disorder

I've decided to be pescatarian now because of 1) bird flu 2) I'm starting to dislike the taste of non-fried chicken 3) more excuses to try new sushi places
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:06 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by guitarxo
lol a lot of people treat vegetarianism as an eating disorder

I've decided to be pescatarian now because of 1) bird flu 2) I'm starting to dislike the taste of non-fried chicken 3) more excuses to try new sushi places


You can't get bird flu from cooked poultry, or pork, or beef.

And eating fish is far more ecologically damaging.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:08 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by CoreysMonster
I just find it personally amusing that the whole "We need to protect animals!" movement is essentially moving for less of these animals to exist overall. Instead of killing, they're preventing birth.

Oh aye it all depends on your motivations really I guess!

In terms of basic moral motivation, I think moral value lies in mental states, so there being no mental state at all isn't really a problem for me. No cow is neither better nor worse than there being cow in terms of its mental states. Similarly killing animals isn't really what bothers me, it's about suffering. Dairy can be just as bad if not worse than meat in terms of suffering caused.

(of course there are issues with how to compare existence with non-existence, but it's the best position I have at the moment! I'll actually be writing an essay on the topic in the next few weeks I think.)
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:15 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by Todd Hart
You can't get bird flu from cooked poultry, or pork, or beef.

And eating fish is far more ecologically damaging.

Right, but only if its properly cooked. I don't really like pork or beef though.

I don't care if I'm damaging the environment by eating fish I can't really eat anything else
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