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Old 08-15-2013, 06:24 AM   #21
steven seagull
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Originally Posted by RoKHED
Actually, I have noticed that over the course of a few days, let alone a few HOURS...
I just did similar stuff to Steve Vai's workout, and tried playing the Pentatonic Scale over and over, progressing speed each time, and restarting if I mess up... Once again, thank you all for the advice, keep rocking, and God bless...

Just remember that speed on it's own counts for very little, there's not a lot to be gained from "being able to play the pentatonic scale quickly", it's not going to necesarily make you any better as a guitarist.

Practice is a means to an end, not the end itself. You didn't pick up a guitar so you could run up and down the pentatonic scale blindly, you picked it up because you wanted to play music - and that's how you judge progress. Are the hours your putting into your practice making you play better because that's all that matters...are you better at playing the songs you want to play because of it. How "good" you are at practicing doesn't matter, always bear that in mind. the worst thing you can do is get bogged down in chasing the metronome with the same exercise just because you want to be able to say you can play "something" fast.
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Old 08-15-2013, 02:10 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Zaphod_Beeblebr
Learning is also improving repertoire; learning new songs.

The important thing here is the distinction between practicing material and practicing technique; the way you approach both of those should be different. There is, as far as I know, no better distinction between those two in linguistic terms without having to fully explain myself every time.


I usually go with finger exercises...
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Old 08-15-2013, 02:59 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Velcro Man
I usually go with finger exercises...


For practice as opposed to learning? Then you're thinking in the wrong way. The difference is in how you practice; the two things require very definitely different things of you.

If that's not what you mean... then I am confused. Please restate your point.
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Old 08-16-2013, 04:29 AM   #24
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For practice as opposed to learning? Then you're thinking in the wrong way. The difference is in how you practice; the two things require very definitely different things of you.

If that's not what you mean... then I am confused. Please restate your point.


For the linguistic differences. If it's physical, they're exercises, if it's mental, it's learning :I
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:03 AM   #25
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Speed is a by-product of accuracy.Its been said many times before.You dont even have to worry about speed.Worry about the things you are not doing right.Are you fingers relaxed and not tensing up?Do you grab the pick so tight like you want to melt it? How about economy of motion? Do you do a lot of unecessary movements? finger independence? etc etc etc.

Solve every issue with a teacher or infront of a mirror and make sure your technique is relaxed,efficient and sound.After that speed is something that ll be aquired no matter what.Speed is all about efficient movement on guitar not fast movement....a really fast player doenst have "fast" or "faster" hands than you...not at all...but he has deadly efficient and relaxed hands doing only whats necessary .
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Old 08-16-2013, 10:03 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Velcro Man
For the linguistic differences. If it's physical, they're exercises, if it's mental, it's learning :I


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learn·ing
/ˈlərniNG/
Noun

The acquisition of knowledge or skills through experience, practice, or study, or by being taught.
Knowledge acquired in this way.


Seems pretty open and shut to me.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:16 AM   #27
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okay... The only thing is, I was wondering if there is anything I can LEARN that will boost my brain-to-hand connection... Plus, adjusting the action on my Raptor really helped my speed...
I think that my slow progress was a result of VERY HIGH action... I made the action much lower and focused on the exercises AND learned how to move a bit faster... IS THERE ANYTHING I CAN LEARN TO MAKE ME EVEN FASTER?
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:32 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by RoKHED
okay... The only thing is, I was wondering if there is anything I can LEARN that will boost my brain-to-hand connection... Plus, adjusting the action on my Raptor really helped my speed...
I think that my slow progress was a result of VERY HIGH action... I made the action much lower and focused on the exercises AND learned how to move a bit faster... IS THERE ANYTHING I CAN LEARN TO MAKE ME EVEN FASTER?


No. Practice, improve your technique. That's the only way.
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:31 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by RoKHED
Okay, here's the thing... I have been playing for 1 3/4 yrs,


Lol.

I haven't posted here for a long time, but everytime I come on here there's someone asking why they can't play like EVH after 2 years.

Here's the truth. You'll probably never be able to play as fast as EVH. I've been playing for 20 years and I still can't play as fast as he could when he was 23. Of course, I can do some things that EVH most likely couldn't at age 23. I can solo over jazz standards and I can sight read and I can play James Taylor on the acoustic.

You are a product of what you practice.

If you want to play that fast and accurate, you are probably looking at 4 hours of technically related practice a day for the next 3 or 4 years.

Or an hour a day or so for the next 10 years. Something like that.

Speed is such a funny thing on the guitar. To me, at least, you work on it and work on it, and you seem to get no results, and then maybe 3-4 years later, you just realize you can play a little faster. It's not like studying for a test. You study, you learn, you get an A. It's such a SLOW process. At least that is my experience. I used to practice a lot too ... back in the day. Hours. But not all too much of that was on purely technical stuff.

Others may have different experiences. And you may be one of those people who is willing to practice 10 hours a day for years, so I can't totally discount it.

Good luck!

Last edited by jogogonne : 08-22-2013 at 12:37 AM.
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Old 08-22-2013, 05:38 AM   #30
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Zaphods pretty much outlined it, but my video here might help out a bit -



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Old 08-22-2013, 05:45 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by RoKHED
okay... The only thing is, I was wondering if there is anything I can LEARN that will boost my brain-to-hand connection... Plus, adjusting the action on my Raptor really helped my speed...
I think that my slow progress was a result of VERY HIGH action... I made the action much lower and focused on the exercises AND learned how to move a bit faster... IS THERE ANYTHING I CAN LEARN TO MAKE ME EVEN FASTER?

You have to realise that this isn't going to happen overnight, it's going to take years.
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Old 08-22-2013, 10:16 AM   #32
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No doubt about that... I took a dumb approach on this topic... I meant to ask if there are any ways as to I can gradually build speed. You know; can I learn songs that will add techniques to my "bag of tricks?"
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:42 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by RoKHED
No doubt about that... I took a dumb approach on this topic... I meant to ask if there are any ways as to I can gradually build speed. You know; can I learn songs that will add techniques to my "bag of tricks?"


Again, no; the real secret (as if it were a secret anyway) to playing fast is to do the basics really, really well. You already know about practicing properly and gradually building speed, there's nothing else to say.
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:57 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by RoKHED
No doubt about that... I took a dumb approach on this topic... I meant to ask if there are any ways as to I can gradually build speed. You know; can I learn songs that will add techniques to my "bag of tricks?"


Here is how I think of it. Don't worry about "speed" because it will come in time with correct practice, diligence, and focus. The more you worry about speed, the more you worry and the less motivating & fun that will be!

The guitar requires very fine hand motor movements. You gradually develop these over many, many hours of practice. When you keep repeating them, the brain learns them and forms pathways and they become more effortless. So many things to think about, but your ear will help you adjust your technique.

I really like EVH and SRV and all that technically demanding stuff, too. I can't play it fast enough because I am still learning. What I do is learn some of that stuff, even if can't play it fast, but I also focus more on stuff that demands ultimate control like BB King and Gilmour solos. There is musically interesting stuff that isn't necessarily fast, you just have to be patient. You will stick with it and a couple years down the road you will amaze yourself how far you have gotten.

The biggest technique for fast runs is getting a solid grounding in strict alternate picking. Troy Stetina's book is helpful for this.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:01 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by sweetdude3000
The biggest technique for fast runs is getting a solid grounding in strict alternate picking. Troy Stetina's book is helpful for this.


There are a great many people who would disagree with that. Myself included. Alternate picking is a tonal and stylistic choice, not a necessity.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:15 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Zaphod_Beeblebr
There are a great many people who would disagree with that. Myself included. Alternate picking is a tonal and stylistic choice, not a necessity.


There are times when you want all downstrokes, economy or alternate - some are more economical and appropriate given the context. It's best to work on those separately than just do whatever, otherwise you never really get them down. In my experience, I wasn't doing alternate correctly when trying to play fast. It was a sloppy mix of economy and alternate. But when I focused on only one technique at a time, using a consistent pattern, it started to click.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:24 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by sweetdude3000
There are times when you want all downstrokes, economy or alternate - some are more economical and appropriate given the context. It's best to work on those separately than just do whatever, otherwise you never really get them down. In my experience, I wasn't doing alternate correctly when trying to play fast. It was a sloppy mix of economy and alternate. But when I focused on only one technique at a time, using a consistent pattern, it started to click.


I didn't say that you should just "do whatever" when practicing, I just disagreed that alternate picking was the only way to go for speed, which is what you said. Obviously you're not going to be good at any of them if you don't zone in and focus.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:46 PM   #38
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There are times when you want all downstrokes, economy or alternate - some are more economical and appropriate given the context. It's best to work on those separately than just do whatever, otherwise you never really get them down. In my experience, I wasn't doing alternate correctly when trying to play fast. It was a sloppy mix of economy and alternate. But when I focused on only one technique at a time, using a consistent pattern, it started to click.

What about going full legato
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Old 08-23-2013, 09:41 AM   #39
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woah-woah WOAH! LEGATO? That's WAY outta my league! I have only been playing for 1 year & 8 months! When you are all talking about these different techniques- I am getting a little confused... So what you're all trying to say- is I should focus more on accuracy and what I am trying to play, and (somehow) the speed will come by itself whilst I am focusing on mastering other techniques?
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Old 08-23-2013, 09:52 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by RoKHED
woah-woah WOAH! LEGATO? That's WAY outta my league! I have only been playing for 1 year & 8 months!




You do know that legato, for the most part, is just hammer-ons and pull-offs, right? I mean, there's a bit more to it than that but as far as guitar is concerned that's more or less it.

Quote:
RoKHED]So what you're all trying to say- is I should focus more on accuracy and what I am trying to play, and (somehow) the speed will come by itself whilst I am focusing on mastering other techniques?


You should focus on playing well: making it interesting, being relaxed, making small movements. If you do that and don't think about speed, then it will come on its own. If you just play with no regard to technique at all then chances are it won't come at all.
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