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Old 02-23-2014, 07:10 AM   #81
Steelywarlock
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Originally Posted by Spambot_2
Are they even Seventy80's in the MG412 cab?
My old MG had custom designed speakers.

Anyway I didn't say it would have sounded good, just they wouldn't have been damaged.



Thanks. Didn't want to waste space and money on a bass cab.
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Old 02-23-2014, 07:33 AM   #82
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^ no offense, but that MG cab kinda WAS a waste of money.
The wood's cheap MDF, who knows if it's void free, and these speakers are plain bad.

Plus, a decent bass cab will sound better than any guitar cab when you're playing a bass.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:26 PM   #83
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What all tubes can be safely switched out and rebiased for a different model tube?
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:34 PM   #84
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For the most part, you can use any of the common preamp tubes (12AT7, 5751, 12AX7) interchangeably.

For power tubes, there are way too many variables to type them all out here. What amp are you talking about and what were you looking for? Many modern amps like your Mark V can use 6L6GCs or EL34s.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:42 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by Roc8995
For the most part, you can use any of the common preamp tubes (12AT7, 5751, 12AX7) interchangeably.

For power tubes, there are way too many variables to type them all out here. What amp are you talking about and what were you looking for? Many modern amps like your Mark V can use 6L6GCs or EL34s.


I mean power tubes. Since its most common I guess I'd say, if I had a Marshall plexi/Fender twin or something that had EL34s/6l6s, what could I replace those with?

Like I hear sometimes about people switching out EL34s for KT88s.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:55 PM   #86
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It depends on the individual amp. You can't just say that a 6L6 can be replaced by an EL34. In some amps it can, in others it cannot. For example, you could not replace the 6L6s in a Twin Reverb with EL34s, but you could use either of those power tubes in a Mark V. Even more confusingly, you may or may not be able to use 6L6s in a Plexi, depending on the power supply of the particular Plexi you had. Most Plexis probably could but there are some that could not use a 6L6. So again, I can't just tell you "X tube = Y tube" because it doesn't work that way. It's particular to the amp, not the tube. That's why I asked what amp you were asking about, because you cannot answer that question without specifying the operating parameters of the amp the tubes are going in.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:59 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by Roc8995
It depends on the individual amp. You can't just say that a 6L6 can be replaced by an EL34. In some amps it can, in others it cannot. For example, you could not replace the 6L6s in a Twin Reverb with EL34s, but you could use either of those power tubes in a Mark V. Even more confusingly, you may or may not be able to use 6L6s in a Plexi, depending on the power supply of the particular Plexi you had. Most Plexis probably could but there are some that could not use a 6L6. So again, I can't just tell you "X tube = Y tube" because it doesn't work that way. It's particular to the amp, not the tube. That's why I asked what amp you were asking about, because you cannot answer that question without specifying the operating parameters of the amp the tubes are going in.


That's more what I wanted to know, if it varies form amp to amp.

Anyway, next question, since you made me think of it.

Opinion on Mesa Boogie tubes?
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:07 PM   #88
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You mean the ones they sell? Or which ones to put in the amp?

The ones they sell are just rebranded JJs and Sovteks. There's no point in paying extra for Mesa to silkscreen their logo onto them. Tung-Sol (slightly brighter) or JJ (darker) are good for power tubes, some people like SED/Winged C but I don't know if the price difference is worth it on a Mesa power amp, they're running so cold anyway.

Preamp tubes are a lot more subjective but generally I think Sovteks are kind of crappy and EHX are usually too muffled for most preamps. Usually you can use Sino/Shuguang for all the preamp tubes except V1 and then use either a JJ or a Tung-Sol or a Mullard RI, depending on what you like. Getting a few different brands to try in V1 is cheap, and then you have backup tubes anyway.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:18 PM   #89
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You can normally stick 6L6's in an EL34 amp, but not t'other way around. They may not perform so well because of screen resistor differences but sometimes they will. As Colin said, it depends on the amp.
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Old 02-24-2014, 09:30 AM   #90
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Hi,

I need some help in buying a new multi-fx procesor - the Zoom G2.1Nu I've had before broke down beyond repair, so I need some help in buying a new one.
Some information to help you:
1. I mostly play heavy metal, although I also play a variety of genres. I am a live player.
2. The multi-fx processor I am looking for must cost under CAD$320.00, be able to drop-tune my guitar using some kind of a pitch shifter, be made of durable material, and must be from the Long & McQuade store. (I live in Canada)
3. Zoom Factory in Quebec no longer makes replacement parts for their products.
The processors I'm looking into right now include: Boss ME-80, Zoom G5 and Zoom G3X. Which one of these do you think works best, or is there another processor that works better than this?

Thank you very much for your help!
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Old 02-24-2014, 11:06 AM   #91
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Do you guys know if Laney make two different versions of the Cub 2x12 cabinet?

This one has Laney branded HH speakers, but this one is advertised with a pair of 50w Celestions.

Or are the speakers in the first one just a rebranded version of the Celestions in the second one?

Or am I being dumb & missing something?
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Old 02-24-2014, 01:25 PM   #92
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They're different speakers.
Laney used to use Rocket 50s, but they dumped them at some point in favor of their new HHs, so the newer cub's have HHs.
Dunnow about the sound quality though.

I have a curiosity myself now:
do anyone of you guys know what the tubes in blackstar HT-1's and HT-5's are for?
Apart from advertising, of course
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Old 02-24-2014, 01:25 PM   #93
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I think at some point recently Laney changed from Celestions to HH in their cheaper cabs, yeah. I think Laneys used to be loaded with HHs (don't quote me on that) and then bought the brand name or something like that recently.

I haven't tried either but I kinda suspect either speaker would need to be swapped eventually, ideally.

^ yeah the 12ax7 is in the preamp and the 12bh7 is the power amp. alongside a shedload of ss shenanigans as well, of course.
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Old 02-24-2014, 01:43 PM   #94
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Old 02-24-2014, 01:50 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parhelia_0000
Hi,

I need some help in buying a new multi-fx procesor - the Zoom G2.1Nu I've had before broke down beyond repair, so I need some help in buying a new one.
Some information to help you:
1. I mostly play heavy metal, although I also play a variety of genres. I am a live player.
2. The multi-fx processor I am looking for must cost under CAD$320.00, be able to drop-tune my guitar using some kind of a pitch shifter, be made of durable material, and must be from the Long & McQuade store. (I live in Canada)
3. Zoom Factory in Quebec no longer makes replacement parts for their products.
The processors I'm looking into right now include: Boss ME-80, Zoom G5 and Zoom G3X. Which one of these do you think works best, or is there another processor that works better than this?

Thank you very much for your help!


Unfortunately I know nothing about Zoom, but I can say from what little I've read about them that they're probably way better than Boss ME anything, in terms of amp models at least.
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Old 02-24-2014, 02:02 PM   #96
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No problem

I mean, I know that rocket 50s pretty much have the rep of being the absolute worst 12" celestion there is (at least in the retail lineup and ignoring "designed by celestion" guff in cheapo amps). And HH speakers hardly have the best rep either.
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Old 02-24-2014, 02:18 PM   #97
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No problem

I mean, I know that rocket 50s pretty much have the rep of being the absolute worst 12" celestion there is (at least in the retail lineup and ignoring "designed by celestion" guff in cheapo amps). And HH speakers hardly have the best rep either.

Not actively shopping at the moment anyway, but I'm tempted to get the Harley Benton 212 Vintage that gets recommended a lot sometime later this year. Saw that Laney cab & thought it could be a good buy, I'm not a speaker expert so figured Celestions are Celestions and from a brand image perspective Laney > Harley Benton. Will stick with the original plan if/when I get around to shopping.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Offworld92
Unfortunately I know nothing about Zoom, but I can say from what little I've read about them that they're probably way better than Boss ME anything, in terms of amp models at least.

Definitely agree with this. Had the ME50 & most of the drives were unusable, but my Zoom G3 is a great little pedal. (Won't comment specifically on Boss's amp models, that was a new addition on later units).

Worth noting that the G1 & G2 are budget pedals and pretty poor, the G3/5/7 are on a par with Line 6 pedals. Zoom generally have a reputation of making cheap crap, but they seem to be trying to move into the slightly more premium market. The G1 & G2 are a hangover from their budget ranges, the G3 and above are significantly better.
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Old 02-24-2014, 02:19 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by Offworld92
Unfortunately I know nothing about Zoom, but I can say from what little I've read about them that they're probably way better than Boss ME anything, in terms of amp models at least.


I don't know about Zoom either. I do know that the Boss has horrible amp simulations (I've owned it). I saw that the store you mentioned carries Line6. You should call to inform how much they charge for the Line 6 Pod HD 400, or if they carry the 300. Those have very decent amps and effects.
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Old 02-24-2014, 02:38 PM   #99
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^ yeah the 12ax7 is in the preamp and the 12bh7 is the power amp. alongside a shedload of ss shenanigans as well, of course.
But how in the damn world do you make 5w of power with a double triode, relatively low gain preamp tube?
I mean 5w!
My amp has to use an EL84 to get to 5w!
I mean the blackstar has 9 out of 10 an A/B power amp, though 5w seems a lot to me.

Also, do you know more specifically what kinda stuff the 12ax7 and the lotsa transistors do?
I'm kinda trying to discover that in detail but I can't interpret schematics for shit
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryBillington
Not actively shopping at the moment anyway, but I'm tempted to get the Harley Benton 212 Vintage that gets recommended a lot sometime later this year. Saw that Laney cab & thought it could be a good buy, I'm not a speaker expert so figured Celestions are Celestions and from a brand image perspective Laney > Harley Benton. Will stick with the original plan if/when I get around to shopping.
The G212 vintage is a nice score if you can cope with the v30's brightness.
I mean they are pretty damn bright speakers.

If you like darker stuff you may wanna look into some Jet City cab maybe.
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Old 02-24-2014, 03:23 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Spambot_2
But how in the damn world do you make 5w of power with a double triode, relatively low gain preamp tube?
I mean 5w!
My amp has to use an EL84 to get to 5w!
I mean the blackstar has 9 out of 10 an A/B power amp, though 5w seems a lot to me.

Also, do you know more specifically what kinda stuff the 12ax7 and the lotsa transistors do?
I'm kinda trying to discover that in detail but I can't interpret schematics for shit
The G212 vintage is a nice score if you can cope with the v30's brightness.
I mean they are pretty damn bright speakers.

If you like darker stuff you may wanna look into some Jet City cab maybe.

A 12BH7 being a twin triode you can run one in A/B for 5 watts no problem. An EL84 has only one pentode so using one you are limited to class A which is less efficient. You are confusing "gain" (distortion) with actual power output. A 12AX7 will get you more distortion but a 12BH7 will get you a lot more output wattage. The 12BH7 is the last stage before the output transformer, so Blackstar isn't using any trickery there to increase the output. It's an honest 5W by industry standards.

The preamp, however, is another story.
The 12AX7 in the HT5 is buried in the preamp. The input gain stage is SS, then another one after that (two different chips, one for each channel; the overdrive is definitely from a chip, it's just a little tubescreamer type clipping circuit in there) and then you get to the actual tube. There's two gain stages (one per triode) there, and then it hits three more ICs: one for amplification, one for the EQ driver, one for the FX loop driver. Then there's a SS recovery stage, and a SS phase inverter before the 12BH7 power tube. Long story short, this thing has chips out the ass and the preamp tube is there to make you feel better.

So the topology is basically like this (on the OD channel) : SS input > SS overdrive > tube amplification > SS amplification > SS phase inverter > tube power. The ICs for stuff like the FX loop and the EQ are sort of understandable, but the SS overdrive and first gain stage seem dumb to me, and make me think that the tube is doing absolutely nothing. They could have used it for the first gain stage so you could OD the front end properly, and then use the second half for at least some of the gain from the OD channel, but instead they just dumped it in the middle of a bunch of chips that I suspect are doing the lion's share of the actual amplification and tone shaping.
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