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Old 08-22-2014, 08:56 PM   #1
LenGuitardrum
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Guitar Drum- New Invention

I am the inventor of the Guitar Drum, it is an attachable accessory for an acoustic guitar that allows you to get similar sounds to that of a cajon. I am planning on releasing them on Kickstarter September 15th. Currently I have three different woods that I am offering; Koa, Mango, and Poplar. Please check it out and I would love to get your opinion on it! Also if you like the product and would like to be notified as soon as the kickstarter is live you can sign up here http://prefundia.com/projects/view/guitar-drum/2376/.

Here are a couple of demo videos:

http://youtu.be/4cqpKi8imxI

http://youtu.be/boKcd5sJomE

Thanks,

Lenny
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Old 08-22-2014, 09:01 PM   #2
chrismendiola
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I actually think it's a cool idea. I think you'll get some backlash from fingerstyle purists, though.
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Old 08-22-2014, 09:25 PM   #3
stepchildusmc
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Originally Posted by chrismendiola
I actually think it's a cool idea. I think you'll get some backlash from fingerstyle purists, though.

I don't think that's the target audience
it seems interesting in concept. the links would be easier to follow if they were ... uhh ... there.
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Old 08-22-2014, 10:15 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by stepchildusmc
I don't think that's the target audience
it seems interesting in concept. the links would be easier to follow if they were ... uhh ... there.

........."LenGuitardrum"................"Banned"...............

I guess we'll never know.

If you feel a noblesse oblige to piss away money on any number of half baked "creative" projects, go right to the horse's ass, er, I mean mouth: https://www.kickstarter.com/

BTW, the links are sort of "there", the hyperlink function has been removed.

Here's the video:

(A full YouTube link is always secure, (https)

The kid's a great guitar player, but the "guitar drum" is mostly bogus. All it looks like is a tap plate, (golpeador), in fancy wood.

So, unless there's some fantastagorical electronic inside, there's nothing to see here folks. Move along.

Last edited by Captaincranky : 08-22-2014 at 10:58 PM.
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Old 08-23-2014, 04:46 AM   #5
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I made a new account, didn't realize that I couldn't post the same thing in two places.....any-who. I appreciate the feedback on it for sure. But it does do more than the golpeador, you can actually do a lot of similar beats like you can on the cajon. I think this vid shows it a bit better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ud1IxJWqCU4

Last edited by Gdrum : 08-23-2014 at 04:59 AM.
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Old 08-23-2014, 01:08 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Gdrum
I made a new account, didn't realize that I couldn't post the same thing in two places.....any-who. I appreciate the feedback on it for sure. But it does do more than the golpeador, you can actually do a lot of similar beats like you can on the cajon. I think this vid shows it a bit better.
You know, I can't for the life of me, even see a tap plate on Ms. Quintero's guitar:


Last edited by Captaincranky : 08-23-2014 at 01:35 PM.
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Old 08-23-2014, 05:32 PM   #7
Tony Done
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I like the idea, but I'm wondering have much more effective it is than a piezo or Baggs M1 soundhole pickup (the latter is very sensitive to body sounds). Where I can most definitely see a place for it is on an electric or "solidbody acoustic" like a Gibson Chet Atkins or Godin.
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Old 08-24-2014, 04:53 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Tony Done
I like the idea, but I'm wondering have much more effective it is than a piezo or Baggs M1 soundhole pickup (the latter is very sensitive to body sounds). Where I can most definitely see a place for it is on an electric or "solidbody acoustic" like a Gibson Chet Atkins or Godin.
My concern is this, how does this thing attach? Double sided tape? If so, you ge a sticky mess if you try to remove it. Double sided tape is usually made of foam. Foam absorbs some of the impact, so you have to hit the guitar slightly harder. That may be splitting hairs.

The truth is, I still firmly believe this is nothing more than an upside down accessory golpeador, tap plate, or pick guard, call it what you will.

If you want to sensitize the soundboard, you can always add a contact mic at or near where you're going to be, "golpeando".

Other than that, if you want matching pick guards top and bottom, buy one of those nasty Fender, "Dick Dale Signature" all laminate something or others.

Sorry to be a hold out here, but I still think this is a simple tap plate in furniture finishes.
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Old 08-24-2014, 02:48 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Captaincranky
My concern is this, how does this thing attach? Double sided tape? If so, you ge a sticky mess if you try to remove it. Double sided tape is usually made of foam. Foam absorbs some of the impact, so you have to hit the guitar slightly harder. That may be splitting hairs.

The truth is, I still firmly believe this is nothing more than an upside down accessory golpeador, tap plate, or pick guard, call it what you will.

If you want to sensitize the soundboard, you can always add a contact mic at or near where you're going to be, "golpeando".

Other than that, if you want matching pick guards top and bottom, buy one of those nasty Fender, "Dick Dale Signature" all laminate something or others.

Sorry to be a hold out here, but I still think this is a simple tap plate in furniture finishes.


Yeah, on an acoustic I would go for a pickup that does pick up body sounds (there are plenty of those) and a simple golpeador of some kind, for the reasons you say. But if you wanted tapping sounds on an electric where there are virtually no body sounds..... But doesn't someone already make a fancy midi touch pad for electrics?
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Old 08-24-2014, 02:52 PM   #10
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making a new account will just get you banned again
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Old 08-24-2014, 03:05 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Tony Done
But doesn't someone already make a fancy midi touch pad for electrics?
Well, the "guitar drum" is passive part. Ostensibly, if it attaches via sticky tape, that would absorb more sound not create it. Besides, many electric pickups are potted to prevent them from acting micro-phonically.

So, unless this gets redesigned into a active part, (as with an integral piezo), it would be next to useless on an electric as well. (Obviously IMHO).
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Old 08-24-2014, 04:01 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Captaincranky
Well, the "guitar drum" is passive part. Ostensibly, if it attaches via sticky tape, that would absorb more sound not create it. Besides, many electric pickups are potted to prevent them from acting micro-phonically.

So, unless this gets redesigned into a active part, (as with an integral piezo), it would be next to useless on an electric as well. (Obviously IMHO).


That's what I was assuming, a pickup system, which might possibly run though the existing pickup elctronics.
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Old 08-24-2014, 05:15 PM   #13
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The idea is interesting, but I have a few concerns, and a comment about your videos.

I am concerned as above, as far as how it attaches to the guitar. Also, I am wondering how it will affect the tone of my guitar once I stick it on there. This looks stuck on with adhesive, which I would not to do my guitar.

As far as the video goes, It's cool that you showed it in action, (good job btw) and I think that was necessary, but your videos were mostly that. I would prefer if you told me all about it first. I don't need to hear it in music so much. I would like to see how it attaches, how it is meant to work, like its construction. Is it hollow in some parts? I would like to hear just the sound of the device on its own more as well.

I already get a nice deep bass kick by palming that location on my guitars. I can get a high snare with my thumb around there as well, but the pitch isn't right for me, so maybe a nicer snare might be cool, but also I can get that rhythm from hitting the strings.

I find the best locations for snare sound is down on the side of the guitar at the lower bout area, which gives me easy access to another good location for a nice deep kick. This spot is ideal for any beats, and is suitable for anything rhythmic I would ever want to do, except for the fact that it is a little far from my strings, so I am limited in what I can do simultaneously, or how quickly I can move in and out of beat mode. But that, paired with what I can do near strings, is not so bad.

I would be interested in being able to do more rhythmically with the guitar, in close proximity to the strings, but I'm not sure if this would be adequate.


Your fundamental idea I think is pretty good, but your solution for fastening it doesn't look adequate, and the benefit sound-wise doesn't seem great enough. If it was me, I would place this in a different location, and I would try to find some other way to stick it on. I can't think of a perfect solution for that yet, but tape isn't it. Although, if you make something really cool, really worth it, than maybe it could be something a luthier builds into the guitar, which I would personally be interested in, if it gave me a big advantage and more freedom.

The mission you've embarked on, is a tough one, because I can do a lot with my guitars without adding anything. It's not incredibly easy to improve on that, and if you want me to add something to my guitar, I'm gonna need a very good reason for that, but I definitely won't stick it on. For a prototype that's alright, but I won't stick anything on my guitars.

I think you have done a good job so far though, and you are setting out to actually do this, and that is admirable, and I commend you for that. You should not give up because of what I say, or anyone else says. But that is not to say you shouldn't refine your project some more. It was good playing, and a good job making your videos cheaply, and still professionally, but like I said, I think you should showcase more your product what it is, how it works, what it sounds like, and all that more than just showcase it in action.
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Old 08-24-2014, 05:28 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Captaincranky
You know, I can't for the life of me, even see a tap plate on Ms. Quintero's guitar:



She is not playing with any deep kicks, and is not playing a sort of kick snare rhythm, like you'd hear in rock, or R&B or pop or whatever, but more a kind of bongo thing.

While she is strumming she is getting most her rhythm from hitting the strings, on a very basic constant rhythm. She goes more nuts on a rhythmic break, but it's no secret that there are lots of nice sounding places to rap on your guitar. Lots of acoustic guitarists do that. The thing is, we can't control so much where you can get what sound. Only to a degree. What part of your hand you use, and where on the guitar you hit, are how you can control the sound, but near the sound hole in the middle of the guitar, it is harder to get nice snare sort of sounds. That's a bassy part of the guitar.

She has a crazy way to hit fast as well, I'd like to see that in slow mo. I'm not sure what she's doing exactly, but I roll my fingers for the quick hits. Maybe she is just doing that, but real hard with a lot of wrist action.

This device, presumably, would be for getting good tones for pop drums sort of sounds, like a kick/snare combo, in a location suitable for playing rhythm as you play on your guitar.

It's not a bad idea. It's just real tough to properly implement, and provide a great enough advantage to be worth it. For starters, I think I would put it in a different spot.
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Old 08-24-2014, 06:58 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Tony Done
That's what I was assuming, a pickup system, which might possibly run though the existing pickup elctronics.
As the proud owner of 2 hybrid 12 strings, (Crafter / Taylor T-5 knockoffs), I think I can almost speak intelligently about this.

First, the piezo in the bridge is horribly microphonic. I had to learn to stay light on anchoring on the bridge, because a light tap would generate a ton of low end and probably infrasonic pluses.

Second these guitars are fitted with custom mixing preamps. Balance between the pickups has to be calculated for the specific parts involved. My guitars are Baggs piezos, and Kent Armstrong magnetics.


Now, if we move this discussion over to your basic solid body electric, you'll find all different output PuPs, most of which are passive.

This would force you to design a mixing preamp specific to the individual electric involved.

Next, since we're talking in terms of ACOUSTIC "golpe", a tap plate, passive or active on a solid body, isn't going to sound like an acoustic guitar.

This would mean you'd have to model the output sound of the tap plate to mimic an acoustic.

So, you'd most likely have to supply a separate preamp/modeler to this stick-on tap plate, controlled separately from the guitar's electronics.

I can't altogether picture steel string golpe, let alone electric golpe, but I suppose stranger things have happened...


Or maybe just glue an acoustic magnetic pickup on the electric, and bang away.

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Old 08-24-2014, 07:20 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Captaincranky
As the proud owner of 2 hybrid 12 strings, (Crafter / Taylor T-5 knockoffs), I think I can almost speak intelligently about this.

First, the piezo in the bridge is horribly microphonic. I had to learn to stay light on anchoring on the bridge, because a light tap would generate a ton of low end and probably infrasonic pluses.

Second these guitars are fitted with custom mixing preamps. Balance between the pickups has to be calculated for the specific parts involved. My guitars are Baggs piezos, and Kent Armstrong magnetics.


Now, if we move this discussion over to your basic solid body electric, you'll find all different output PuPs, most of which are passive.

This would force you to design a mixing preamp specific to the individual electric involved.

Next, since we're talking in terms of ACOUSTIC "golpe", a tap plate, passive or active on a solid body, isn't going to sound like an acoustic guitar.

This would mean you'd have to model the output sound of the tap plate to mimic an acoustic.

So, you'd most likely have to supply a separate preamp/modeler to this stick-on tap plate, controlled separately from the guitar's electronics.

I can't altogether picture steel string golpe, let alone electric golpe, but I suppose stranger things have happened...


Or maybe just glue an acoustic magnetic pickup on the electric, and bang away.


That's exactly what I had in mind, a little preamp/EQ/whatever that would blend it with the passive magnetcs without too much grief. I can still see a place for it among say, electric guitar soloists. You could do finger rhythms like tapping on a table top. Or maybe just buy an acoustic with a piezo pickup.
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