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Old 12-26-2007, 06:42 PM   #1
beckyjc
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The Official Thread of all things Laney

The Official Thread of all things Laney

The Laney Cult GROUP

To join the cult just add "Member of the Laney Cult" to your signature, no need to PM me as i'm not keeping any records, but it would be nice to leave a message in the thread and contribute abit.

Guitar Amps Model List
* Represents discontinued models
Valve
VC15 / VC30
LC15 / LC30 / LC50 / LC50H*
VC50* / VC100* / VH100R
Chrom-O-Zone
GH50L / GH100L / GH100TI
TT50 / TT100 / TT50H / TT100H
L5T / L20H / L20T
AOR-ProTube (A50H/100H A30/50/100) Series I/II* / ProTube Lead* / PreAOR-Protube (PT30/50/100) Series I/II*

Solid State
LG12 / LG20 / LG35R
LV100 / LV200 / LV300 / LV300T / LV300H
LX12 / LX20 / LX20R / LX35 / LX35R / LX85R
LX20D / LX35D / LX65D / LX120T / LX120H
GC30* / GC50* / GC100*
LA30C (Acoustic) / LA65C (Acoustic)
A1 (Acoustic)

Laney Tone Guide by Timi_Hendrix

Clean
Very Good:VC30, VC50/100, VH100R, TT50/100, Chrome-O-Zone, L20.
Good: VC15, GH50/100/100TI, LC15/30/50, L5.
Poor: AOR, Pro-Tube

Low Gain
Very Good:VC15, VC30, L5/20.
Good: TT50/100, AOR, Pro-Tube, Chrome-O-Zone.
Poor: VC50/100, VH100R, GH50/100/100TI, LC15/30/50.

Mid Gain
Very Good: AOR, Pro-Tube, TT50/100
Good: VC15/30, VC50/100, VH100R, TT50/100, LC15/30/50, GH50/100/100TI, Chrome-O-Zone, L5/20.
Poor: N/A

High Gain
Very Good: VC50/100, VH100R, GH50/100/100TI, TT50/100
Good: LC15/30/50, AOR, Pro-Tube, Chrome-O-Zone.
Poor: VC15/30, L5/20

Note from Geoff
From now on, can people submit their reviews to UG and then I'll put the links to them here please? We're going to run out of space soon if every review is written in the posts. We can get a lot more up if i just paste links to them.
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Last edited by beckyjc : 01-02-2008 at 01:55 PM.
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:43 PM   #2
beckyjc
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Location: N. Wales, UK
FAQ:
Where can I buy Laney from?
UK
If youíre in the UK Laney has a dealer search, itís more common to find them (In the real world.) in smaller shops than big chain stores.
http://www.headstockdistribution.com/dealersearch.php
You can order directly from; (These are secure websites.)
www.gak.co.uk
www.dolphinmusic.co.uk
www.guitars.co.uk
www.imuso.co.uk
www.guitar.co.uk
www.thomann.de (The rest of EU too.)

US
Laney are a lot harder to find, they are slowly going more international but the chances are theyíre a lot more expensive outside of the UK.
http://www.laney.co.uk/dealers_usa .php
Buying online has also proved difficult
www.ebay.com (Would be your best bet of getting a good deal on one)
www.wholenote.com
www.activemusician.com
www.musiciansfriend.com

AUS
http://www.guitarparadise.com.au/Te...090/GUITAR-AMPS

What are the difference between the LC and the VC seeing that theyíre in a similar price range?
The VC and LC are very different amps, the VC is warmer, more vintage and British voiced with low-mid gain. The LC is brighter more modern and American voiced with a bit more gain. Both are good amps but overall the VC excels as the better amp, the clean channel is nicer, it fills up at loud volumes where the LC sounds more brittle when you crank it, apparenlty this is to do with the solid state transistors used to help overdrive the amp. If you're looking for something modern sounding with a bit of gain and aren't too fussed on volume then go for the LC otherwise the VC is the better choice IMO.

Can the VC do metal? How heavy can it go?
The VC is a very versatile amp, but not a lot of gain, without help it could probably manage classic rock at bedroom volumes, much further than that and it will need and OD to manage, cranked it could handle a bit more. But youíre best bet is to buy an OD, a simple tubescreamer (Ibanez TS9/808, Maxon OD9/808 or the cheap Digitech Bad Monkey if youíre on a budget.) or the likes would push enough gain out of it but you may need an EQ pedal to shape the tone into a more metal oriented sound. You should definitely try it first seeing as peoples tastes and ideas of what high gain is are different.

Which speaker variation/wattage should I get of the VC? What's the difference?
The newer VCs are all equipped with pretty poor speakers, the 112 has a single Celestion Seventy 80, the 210 has a pair of custom designed Jensens and the 212 has a par of the Celestions again, the VC15 has the same custom designed Jensen.

The older VCs where Loaded with HH Invaders which were too my knowledge a lot better than the Celestions/Jensens in the current VCs. I'm not 100% though. In terms in quality all the speakers are pretty poor-average, including the Jensens, in my personal opinion, the 112 or 110 is the best option, lighter, more compact and in the long run it's easier and cheaper to swap out the speaker to something better quality if the time comes.

Of course having two speakers is going to push more air and seem louder, but my 112 is already ridiculously loud. You aren't going to need it, unless you want to stick a pair of 25/whatever watt speakers into it. Then go for it.

Which brings me onto my next point, wattage, the 15 and the 30 are pretty much the same amp, cosmetically the 15 has buttons for the bright/drive channel switch, the 15 also features a tone knob (Supposed to be the similar to presence.) which the 30 doesn't have. Both are very loud amps, neither of them are quiet enough for you to be able to crank up in your bedroom, but they both sound good at bedroom volumes anyhow. They're both gig worthy, capable of handling small pub gigs, and maybe a medium sized gigs for the 30, but otherwise you'll be hooked up to the PA. The 15 is slightly boxy sounding due to a smaller speaker, it also runs in class A/B mode as opposed to class A, but this just effects how hot the amp runs at certain volumes. But both are very good choice.

Difference between LC15 and LC15R?
The 15R has reverb built in (Footswitchable), an effects loop and a speaker out. Otherwise they're the same.

Is the VC15/30 or LC15/30/50 loud enough to be used in band situations?
VC15
The 15 will on its own get over drums and the rest of the band to suitable enough levels, it will handle small-mediumish sized gigs, and will handle larger with PA of course.

VC30
Will do this with ease, of course the more expensive seaker variations will push more air, but the difference isnt big enough to really to persuade you into buying the 210/212 over the 112. Unless your talking about playing in an arena, it'll manage fine without PA if the room your in has decent acoustics to distribute the sound, but PA always helps.

LC15
IMO, is quite a bit boxier than its vintagely voiced sister the VC15, it would suffice in band practice situations, but probably due to the smaller chase and the general brittleness of the sound of it cranked, your much better off going with the LC30 if you want to do much more than pretty small pub gigs without PA.

LC30,
Just as the VC30 would do it with ease, but again its not one for cranking to 10, but with that kind of power, I doubt youd need too.

LC50
You must be kidding. It'll kill you.
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#1 of the Orange TH30 Clique


Last edited by beckyjc : 12-27-2007 at 07:26 AM.
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:43 PM   #3
guitarcrazy1991
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Alright, so PM me your Laney reviews and I'll put them here...

Reviews: (Extra special thankyou to the people who wrote them. )
Laney VC50 review by Lauke_101 (Discontinued)
For all the features Iíll refer to the Laney site, just look up the VH100R there, it has the same features. Only difference is the VC50 is a 50 watt 2x12 combo amp. This amp also has a bigger brother (or sister, whatever you like) in the VC100 which is a 100 watts (what a surprise) 2x12 combo. Mine is loaded with HH Premier Vintage 60 speakers, no name ECC83 pre amp tubes and Sovtek 6L6 power tubes. I bought this amp second hand and I guess itís from 1995 when I look at the date on the output transformer.
This amp is very versatile, 2 channels and 2 gain modes per channel will probably give you all the tones you want. You can get Hendrix and Frusciante like tone, some darker jazzy tones, shimmery or warm cleans with lots of headroom, AC/DC style crunch, hard rock tones, droning stoner, 80s trash metal and modern metal and thereís probably even more in it. Also this amp can be superloud so itís definitely gig worthy, but you can get still use it in your bedroom because it doesnít turn muddy on low volumes like a Marshall would. I do find that I get some Ďicepickí sometimes but I have rather bright power tubes in it and slightly harsh speakers (although theyíre not that bad). I do feel I can get more out of this amp by replacing the speakers and experimenting with some different tubes. Overall I love this amp, itís my first tube amp, itís very versatile, I got it quite cheap, it looks very good and most of all sounds absolutely amazing. And if youíre very keen on how you look I can recommend it as well because of its mirroring faceplate


Laney VC50 review by timi_hendrix
2x12 Valve Combo, 1996, bought used for ?275.

Features
This is a 50 watt all-valve 2x12 amp. 2 channels, each channel has switchable gain and reverb. Seperate EQ for each channel, bright switch on clean, master resonance switch and presence dial. Runs off 6 12AX7 preamp valves and two power amp valves. The amp has a bias switch so you can use 6l6S or EL34s.

At the moment it has Sovtek preamp valves (not sure what type) and a pair of Sovtek 5881s. They're about 3 years old, but I'm getting some new ones in a couple of weeks so I'll update this thread when I get them

Quality

Well, first off this thing is heavy. It takes two people to carry it, and I managed to put my back out moving it across my room. It's very sturdily built, with an open back construction. It's in very good condition considering the age of it. The two handles are a godsend, because like I said it takes two of you to carry it. They're very well situated compared to some amps. The footswitch still works and all of the knobs etc are fine, no crackling whatsoever.

Sound
Channel A (Clean): Wow. This amp has a really nice clean tone - very fendery. The bright switch is pretty much redundant as the amp is voiced so brightly already. The sound is very warm and sparkly, and sounds nice with a good bit of reverb. The quality of the amp's reverb isn't brilliant, but is perfectly usable. Without the drive engaged, this channel stays clean up to really high volumes. I'd say it starts to break up around 7-8 on the volume, which is louder than I'll ever need it to go.

UPDATE: With the new JJ valves, the clean sound is fatter and breaks up a lot earlier. My bridge pickup (which would be considered hot) pushes it into breakup when the volume's on 3. The lower output neck pickup pushes the amp into breakup at about 4.

The drive on this channel isn't as good as the clean - you have to take some time to find a nice balance between the gain and volume controls to get a nice breakup sound. I'd put some of this down to the valves - basically, they're ****. They sound really ratty for mid-gain kinda stuff, and I'm hoping that when I change them this tone will improve a bit. I can get decent blues tones out of this, but I'd say it needs an OD to shine. Again, I'll update this section when I've got new valves and my OD pedal in a couple of weeks.

UPDATE: The new valves gave this sound a lot more beef and the breakup is a lot less ratty. The breakup comes on earlier too, so all in all a big improvement.

Channel B (Dirty):
Okay, brutally honest: Without the drive engaged, this channel sucks. Ratty, weak distortion. But when you kick in the extra drive and find a nice balance between the gain and drive controls, it sounds awesome.

It has loads of gain, but it tends to get noisy with such levels and I prefer the sound when it's backed off a bit. My favourite sound is with the gain at 4 and the drive at 7. Gives a very powerful, crunchy sound. High gain, but still very clear.

The EQ is central to getting a good sound from this channel - I set the bass at a bit under 5, treble at 3 and mids at 6.5-7. This helps give that powerful, thick tone and avoids the dreaded ice-pick sound you get when you put the treble up too high. You have to be sparing with the reverb, as with most dirty channels, as it can muddy up the tone if you're not careful.

This channel sounds a bit weak and trebly at lower volumes (the little master volume trick helps this) - but once you get it up past two and a half or so it sounds awesome. I play with it at about 3, which is enough to make the floor shake.

SUPER BONUS HINT: I like to combine this channel with my Epi Valve Jr cranked up to get a nice mix of tones. Sounds awesome.

I've used the amp for band practice, and it cuts through ten times better than my old amp. Sits in the mix really nicely, and sounds awesome.

UPDATE: The new valves again improved things a lot. The sound's bassier and fuller, which gives it a fatter sound and reduces the ice-pick enormously. I've had to do some re-EQing due to the tonal difference, so my treble and presence is a little higher. The treble's gone up to 4 or 5 and the presence to 3 or just under that. My mids have gone up to 7 and the bass is the same as before.

Ease of Use
This is where the amp falls a bit short. I'm sure that if I'd had an instruction manual I would have found it easier to get to grips with, but all the same it was quite confusing.

For one thing, they don't give any indication as to what position is "on" or "off" for the bright and resonance switches. So I had to use my ears for that. Easy with the bright switch, the sharp pain I felt in my ears guided me. The resonance switch was more tricky - I'm assuming it's on when the sound is fatter, because it's supposed to tighten up the bass or something.

Other than that, the EQ and gain sections are relatively simple.

The footswitch however has been a bit of a nightmare. It depends on a very finicky setup of the switches of the amp for it to work, which took me a long time to figure out. Again, I've asked around and think that this might be caused by one of the valves. Either way, it's a bit annoying but I can live with it.

UPDATE: New valves didn't help, but I'm used to the footswitch now.


Laney VC30
Review by beckyjc who screwed up the reliability rating. And will never be able to forget it. And rhcp_freak's review.
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/revi...-112/index.html
(Yes she effed up the average, you must remind her about it every day)
Soundclips:

Last edited by guitarcrazy1991 : 02-10-2008 at 01:49 PM.
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:44 PM   #4
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Reviews (continued)

VC30 Review
Review by MrCarrot

Features
10/10

I've had my VC30 1x12 for 1 month now, and gigged it 4 times in that month. I gave this amp a 10 for features, not because I want seven thousand knobs, but I want just enough knobs to allow me to shape my sound. One clean channel, one dirty channel. A single EQ. Bright switch. Reverb. Overdrive. Two volumes. FX level. Hell, I never even use the FX loop. I'm not one of those purists who demands only my amp's tone, I use pedals to help me with it. But damn, they just about got it right with this. It came with TAD valves which are high quality and don't need replacing until dead, and a Celestion Seventy80 speaker. The speaker is okay, but there's definitely a lot of room for improvement. What annoys me is the casing is so small you couldn't drop an Alnico speaker in there, but the G12H30 or Private Jack are great speakers that suit the amp and fit anyway.

Sound
8.5/10

Well, it does exactly what it says on the tin. EXCEPT IT ISN'T CLASS A. Laney are lying, it's Class AB in Push-Pull. No Class A amp has a Phase Inverter. But even the block diagram seems to say it has a PI ;d

But anyway, sound. Class aside, it's how you'd expect. Cleans are certainly very Voxy, and the OD is somewhat usable. At low volumes especially, the inbuilt OD is really ratty, fuzzy and thin, but when turned up it fills out a lot and you get a AC30TB kind of tone. There's no negative feedback in the power section (No presence control) and this rewards you with a fuller yet more aggressive tone. I never use the bright switch. I prefer my OD tones to have a Marshally tone to them, so instead of using the brighter Vox-like inbuilt Drive, for my stage setup I instead set the Drive to 2 - this gives me predominantly clean, with a bit of breakup when you dig in. Then for OD, I kick my Bad Monkey in, set to boost lots of level, no gain, and a bit of Lower-mids/upper-mids. This makes it sound so amazing. Full, Marshally tone without being too brittle or bassy.

Cleans are nice and Voxy/JTM45-ey, as I said, even when set low on the gain channel like I use it. Very usable. I keep my EQ set at Bass 6 Mids 6 and Treble 5, for every tone I use. It absolutely gets the Razorlight cleans spot on, and RHCP cleans are also nice on it. The cleans are great, the OD is great. Poweramp OD is a bit fuzzy, but being so loud you need never crank it anyway. The amp is quite bright, but it's also quite deeply voiced. It is very definitively British, mid-wise.

Reliability
7/10

Well, it is quite literally built like a tank, I can't fault how it is constructed. Although on christmas day, it blew its first fuse. Bless. I predict it's gonna blow some more, but they cost nothing really. It doesn't bother me, but I could do without the hassle.

Overall
8.5/10

Tonally I can't fault it (although it isn't Class A), especially at £300. The valves are great, the speaker is average but better than most at this price (Peavey Valveking? Classic 30? Hot Rod? Blues Jr?). It looks insanely good, and it's very versatile. Fuses blowing are no problem for me, it's just a great amp.

Laney VC30-212 Review by mcw00t

Features - 8/10

Now, this amp isn't loaded with controls like some are. There's few enough there for it not to be intimidating, but enough to still amuse those that know what they're doing. The bright switch is a favourite of mine, and the reverb is just awesome. the only thing I can nit-pick about is that the EQ doesn't have as much change as I'd want it to, but that might just be me. The High and Low gain inputs are also a very nice feature, I'll be having to add a line switcher into a looper to take advantage of both of those...

Looks - 10/10


If I were to dream of my favourite looking amp, this would be it. Black tolex, no front controls, a silver/chrome backing for those chicken-head controls. It looks placid, yet menacing. The 4 glowing EL84's of fury in the back look brilliant with the rear grille removed, so much so that I have it placed in front of my mirror so I can see them when I play....

Reliability - 9/10

I bought this amp second hand and I seriously cannot think why people bash the reliability of these amps, the guy I bought it off had only 1 problem with it, and that was a slightly dodgy connection on the Lo-Gain input, which was fixed easily.

Sounds - 9.5/10

Clean - This amps clean channel is it's defining feature, I would give up playing metal and rock just so I could use it. It is so nice, it's defined without being brittle, and can be warm and comforting without being muddy, absolutely superb. This (for me) gets even better once we turn the master volume above about 5 or 6, those EL84's start do become overdriven and make the nicest bluesey breakup I've heard, and it even pushes light rock at volume 8/9.

Drive (no overdrive) - I very rarely use this with no overdrive, so this will have to be quite a quick review. I have to say, with the drive maxed out, it still stays very clear defined, but not middy enough for me. The gain at about 4/5 got it to do some nice bluesy sounds, but it's no match for just cranking that clean channel - don't get me wrong on that, it still sounds good, just not as good.

Drive (with overdrive) - Now, where do I start...I'm overdriving my VC30 with the Tubescreamer setting on my Boss ME-50 with the gain all the way down, level just past 12 o clock, master volume on 12 o clock. There's the background. Time for the sounds it gives - Oh. My. God. This just blew me away, i could just sit there and play an E powerchord for eternity. The tone is just wow. You'll have to take out some of the mids to stop it from getting muddy though. You can shape a perfect Opeth tone from it, gain down a little, and you have Dream Theater. Take out a little bass, you have Megadeth. Very versitile in the high gain region, and loud as hell too!

Overall - 10/10

This amp is perfect for what I want to play, the cleans, and the overdriven gain. If this amp were to be stolen, the thief would have a very bad back and wouldn't be able to run very fast with it. If it were broken, I would try to fix it, failing that, cry.

Laney VC15 Reviews by guitarcrazy1991 and Horlicks

http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/revi...-110/index.html

Laney VC15 Review by thellamaking

This amp is very good for Blues/Rock/Indie. The clean channel can do great warm tones for something like Radiohead. With the drive on about 4 you can get great breakup tones without deafening yourself, great for RHCP and KoL. If you kick up the gain it gets into Classic rock territory, I played Black Dog for about 2 hours when i first got this amp :p: and it can juuuust do older metal like Iron Maiden, but you'll need an OD for anything higher in gain. But you wouldn't buy this amp for 'br00tal' distortion. The bright switch is a nice touch, so you change a fairly warm tone to a bright one (Obviously lol) The reverb is very good (spring, i believe) and the tone knob is meant to act like the tone knob of your guitar. Which is a nice feature. The 3 band EQ could be a little more responsive, as it doesn't really do that much difference to the tone. And if you really want this amp to shine, change the speaker and valves. The factory installed ones aren't the best. But these are fairly easy changes. So, in general it's a very good amp, a much better choice than the MG/Spiders/Valvetronix's that are in the same price range (in the UK)

Last edited by guitarcrazy1991 : 12-27-2007 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:45 PM   #5
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Reviews (continued)

Laney VH100R Review by H4T3BR33D3R

Features
10/10
The Laney VH100R is a 100 Watt, class A/B valve amplifier for those who want versatility and tone in one powerful package. The amp features High and Low impedance input jacks, 2 channels with foot switchable gain modes, independent Bass, Middle & Treble controls for each channel, a master presence control, a bright switch, switchable resonance, independent reverb, line outs for silent recording, 16 ohm and 8 ohm speaker connections, and a global effects loop as well as a side effects loop for each channel. The amp also features switchable valve biasing which gives you the option of switching between EL34 and 6L6 power tubes. The amplifier is current loaded with JJ EL34s and Tungsol 12ax7s.

Sound
8.5/10

Turning on the amplifier and plugging in with a humbucker guitar, the clean channel is quite twangy with the bridge pickup. Quite reminiscent of a Fender amplifier. Switching to the neck pickup, the clean is fat but still retains some twang. With a Stratocaster in hand, the clean channelís brilliance makes its presence known. The clean channel really comes alive with single coils. With the bright switch engaged, the channel becomes a little brittle. Like many bright switches, it becomes ineffective when the clean channel is pushed. The second mode on the channel adds a bit of grit. This channel is great for bluesy style leads. The bass is quite flabby on this channel and the channel lacks a bit of definition, itís probably the most lacking on the amplifier. Using the bridge pickup in a Les Paul and switching to the crunch channel rewards me with a growling, overdriven tone reminiscent of early English Rock and Roll tones. Chording is really defined, every note can be heard. Switching to the Rhythm pickup and rolling the tone knob down gives me a near perfect rendition of Claptonís famous woman tone. Switching to the second mode engages an additional gain channel. With both of the drive knobs (Yes, there are 2), at 7, I achieve a tone much like the Marshall Super Lead amplifier. With the gain knobs dimed, I achieve a raunchy distorted tone thatís perfect for new age metal. The problem with Channel two is its excessive brightness. When the treble is past 3, the amp becomes quite harsh sounding. Itís also very noisy on the drive channel, anything past 7 to 8 will require a suppressor to tame down the noise. The effects loop also adds quite a bit of noise so be sure to keep it off or turn the level down when itís not in use.

Reliability
8/10
The amp is bullet-proof. Its construction is quite solid. The only issue Iíve had is the low impedance jack, which seems to cut out frequently. Iíve also noticed that the tolex tears a easy, so if youíre about cosmetics, be a bit more cautious around the amplifier.

Overall
9/10
If youíre looking for a no non-sense, balls to the wall, versatile, tone monster. The Laney VH100R is for you. From sparkling clean to down right mean. I highly recommend it.


More reviews will be appreciated .

Last edited by guitarcrazy1991 : 12-27-2007 at 11:40 AM.
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:46 PM   #6
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PM me your pictures and I'll put them here.

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Old 12-26-2007, 06:47 PM   #7
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:48 PM   #8
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:49 PM   #9
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:50 PM   #10
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W00t for the new Laney thread!

I has Laney pr0nz on my profile too, if you want it.




You don't, do you?
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:50 PM   #11
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What's wrong with the old Laney thread?
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:50 PM   #12
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Can I review the VH100R?
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Dude i like rap and stuff. Im a furry and I also have a wolf plush with a hole that i use at times.


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Old 12-26-2007, 06:50 PM   #13
rhcp_freak
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Can I review the VC30-112?
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Fais wins at life


The obscenely young leader of the Laney Cult

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Old 12-26-2007, 06:51 PM   #14
False_God
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Originally Posted by webbtje
What's wrong with the old Laney thread?

+1
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:53 PM   #15
stevo_epi_SG_wo
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Originally Posted by False_God
+1


i can think of 94 reasons
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:53 PM   #16
H4T3BR33D3R
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Quote:
Originally Posted by False_God
+1


Spam. lots of it.
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I'm not artsy at all. At least not in the visual sense.

But, I did just eat some pizza so I am quite fartsy




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Dude i like rap and stuff. Im a furry and I also have a wolf plush with a hole that i use at times.


Only at times, though.
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:53 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by False_God
+1

+2, too crowded, I suppose? Not any space to post stuffs like pics and reviews?
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:54 PM   #18
guitarcrazy1991
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PM me your pictures and reviews and I'll put them in my posts...
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:55 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H4T3BR33D3R
Spam. lots of it.



It's still open though...

beckyjc, can't you just get the mods to blitz it?

This thread seems to me, as a total Laney thread philistine, to be useless.
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:55 PM   #20
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I'll do a review of the VC15 if you want.
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