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Old 09-23-2008, 01:55 AM   #21
psychodelia
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Originally Posted by Galvanise69
Obviously we wont come out with the same song (yeah right) but how creative can we get the only things that can be varied are

- The Phrasing and Rhythm

- The Harmonies we put with the Melodic aspects of the line


But therein lies the fun, no?

Rhythm is such a strong (and, unfortunately sometimes overlooked) aspect of creating a good melody. It's much easier for us to talk about harmonic progressions, rather than the strength of a rhythm, so it's not always mentioned too much around here. If nothing else, this is a good exercise to get you in the habit of considering the importance of rhythm.

And plus, you're into all those weird-ass substitutions that aren't always practically applicable... here's a chance to try some out!


I know that this idea of chance in composition might run counter to the idea that YOU are the sole Creator of the Work, but putting a serious effort towards making it work will really push your creativity to unexplored places. Even if you don't like the end result, if you've actually put in a good effort, I don't think the result will be a failure from a standpoint of your progress as a composer.
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Old 09-23-2008, 01:58 AM   #22
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I know that this idea of chance in composition might run counter to the idea that YOU are the sole Creator of the Work, but putting a serious effort towards making it work will really push your creativity to unexplored places. Even if you don't like the end result, if you've actually put in a good effort, I don't think the result will be a failure from a standpoint of your progress as a composer.


And that is exactly the point. Confining yourself in a box forces you to use the few liberties you have in unusual ways you may not have thought of if given the freedom to do anything.
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Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
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Old 09-23-2008, 02:16 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by 20Tigers
Galvanise, I guess either join in or wait and see what happens - you're kind of on a negative vibe man.


What exactally did you mean?

Im not up to the standards on joining? It would be horrible if I did? Negative Vibe from who?

Archeo: Had a few more questions about the rules (im aware there not up yet)

The only rules we have so far are

Notes: A A# B D G# A C G# F# F
Time Signature: 10/4
Sub-Dividing: 4 + 3 + 3

So, what about harmonies/chords for starters.

Are they to be taken from the above row of tones? Can they be chords from the above row of tones only in that order?

What about harmonies from a given instrument we might choose to put in there?

Would we only be able to harmonise from that tone row?

Polyrhythm also kinda defeats phrasing the bar, 4 + 3 + 3, or did you ditch that rule?
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Old 09-23-2008, 02:24 AM   #24
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I'm writing up the final rules right now. You'll be happy to know that I've eliminated the time signature requirement (or, at least, made it much less specific)
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Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
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Old 09-23-2008, 02:30 AM   #25
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Yes, and no.

Im fine working with rules, without rules, it'll give me a new view point to look at composing from, new things to try out, new ideas to experiment with.
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Old 09-23-2008, 02:50 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by demonofthenight
In a week of so I'll write a lesson/article on writing single melodic lines which will explain why.

To give you a taste, that melody lacks a strong resolution. Semitonal movement down is quite weak compared to semitonal movement upwards or tonal movement down, but stronger than a disjunt movement. Melodies need movement, purpose, resolution, intelligence, repetitve without sounding obnoxious and they need to be meticulous.

Carry on though. I'm very interested in these proceedings and I am willing to help anyone that asks for help.


I'd like to see that lesson/article when you're done.
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Old 09-23-2008, 03:12 AM   #27
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To give you a taste, that melody lacks a strong resolution. Semitonal movement down is quite weak compared to semitonal movement upwards or tonal movement down, but stronger than a disjunt movement. Melodies need movement, purpose, resolution, intelligence, repetitve without sounding obnoxious and they need to be meticulous.


The melody was selected, quite literally, with the roll of a twelve sided die. The purpose was to force people both to compose well outside of their element, and to make due with what they have when handicapped. If the melody itself doesn't offer a strong resolution, then create context that does.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmac72187
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
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Old 09-23-2008, 03:30 AM   #28
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I agree with what both of you are saying, the melody is very chromatic, to me, it feels like it resolves in the last five notes, of course, the phrasing has much to do with resolution too.

Its definatley a challange, I hope, at least, Ill learn a lot from, putting myself in circumstances which are unusual, and learning to compensate for them.
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Old 09-23-2008, 03:30 AM   #29
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I read your entire post and I'm very interested, but it's quite early around here now, and I have no clue what to do with the notes.

Are we allowed to make chords with them? Harmonize? Or are we only allowed to play those notes?

Anyway, If you could clear this up for me, I will join in.
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Old 09-23-2008, 03:32 AM   #30
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^ Thats what I asked, harmonies would have a lot to do with it, are we restricted to harmones within that row of tones?

Are harmonies completley un-restricted?

(not to be an arse, I know your still writing up those rules)
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Old 09-23-2008, 03:53 AM   #31
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The rules are up. If there are any questions, just ask.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmac72187
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
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Old 09-23-2008, 04:09 AM   #32
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Cool, cheers, reading them now.
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Old 09-23-2008, 04:37 AM   #33
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ok, a lot of what you talk about seems way over my head, but I'm gonna give this a try anyway, though it may not turn out anything near acceptable.
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Old 09-23-2008, 04:43 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The4thHorsemen
ok, a lot of what you talk about seems way over my head, but I'm gonna give this a try anyway, though it may not turn out anything near acceptable.


There is no "acceptable". The whole point is to learn and share ideas. This whole project is directed at people who feel that stuff like this is "over their heads". Anyone who doesn't understand anything can simply post here and discuss it as a group.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmac72187
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
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Old 09-23-2008, 05:13 AM   #35
Galvanise69
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Archeo, you mentioned a mutation of ternary for being A - B - A.

I always thought it was:

Binary: A B
Ternary: A B A
Rhondo: A B A C (A)

So far I only have a horn line, its hard finding things to put with this, its shit as

Last edited by Galvanise69 : 09-23-2008 at 05:17 AM.
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Old 09-23-2008, 05:30 AM   #36
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I'll give this a shot tonight when I get home. Seems very interesting.
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Old 09-23-2008, 05:35 AM   #37
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ok, this is all I have going right now, I can't figure out how to make it all go together and make sense though...

edit: hang on, firefox is screwing with me.

doubledit: it won't let me attach it for some reason. it keeps opening the link to upload something in the same tab, so when I've uploaded it I can't go back to submit the post
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Old 09-23-2008, 05:43 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archeo Avis
The melody was selected, quite literally, with the roll of a twelve sided die. The purpose was to force people both to compose well outside of their element, and to make due with what they have when handicapped. If the melody itself doesn't offer a strong resolution, then create context that does.

And with that post, I am a whole lot more interested. Lets see, it resolves downwards semitonally, so would the majority of you do a sort of phrygian thing in the last couple of bars? That might be against the rules though, I think archeo might wants us to stick to the same key/mode.
If I can find enough ideas (doubtfull) I might write something up in fl

I'll have to reread the rule. Because I'm in holiday mode, thinking really hurts
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Old 09-23-2008, 05:49 AM   #39
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Archeo: One question, are we allowed to phrase the ntoes of the main theme as tones of a chord, Im having trouble coming up with a melody that doesnt sound like random people farting : P
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Old 09-23-2008, 07:33 AM   #40
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We have to use the ten notes in that order, sweet as. Can we add notes after the ten when creating the main theme? Or is it just the ten to create a main theme and then we build around that?
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