If you want to trigger a debate among guitarists, inject the subject of shredding into the conversation. Besides seeming to have advocates and detractors in equal numbers, the topic gives rise to more fundamental questions: What constitutes shredding? Who were – and are – its greatest practitioners? Is shredding all about technical skill, or is it possible to convey real emotion in those blizzards of runs, the way a blues guitarist can rip your heart out with a single note?
Many guitarists trace the art of shredding back to the first Van Halen album. Others insist the phenomenon began earlier, with Uli Jon Roth’s work in The Scorpions or even with Alvin Lee or Ritchie Blackmore, at the dawn of the ’70s. Few would deny, however, that the era in which shredding fully took flight was the middle to late ’80s.
Three guitarists in particular – Steve Vai, Joe Satriani and Eric Johnson – were extolled as frontrunners in the field as the concept of shredding took hold at that time. Each made pioneering albums in the ’80s that remain signposts for any player – shredder or not. Below, we present thoughts from each of them on a shred-guitar legacy that, rightly or wrongly, they are credited with furthering. Be sure to let us know how you feel about shredding, in the comments section.
Joe Satriani, from Guitar World, December 2010: "I couldn’t understand how people would think that I was a shredder. If you listen to Surfing with the Alien or Not of this Earth, which came out around the same general period, you would know that I was just a total oddball and had nothing to do with that whole movement. When I think of songs like ‘Echo’ and ‘Midnight’ and ‘Always with Me, Always with You,’ from Surfing – I mean, there’s no way those compositions could be on a ‘shred’ record. I remember thinking, ‘I’m much more bluesy than everybody.’ Maybe people weren’t seeing or hearing that at the time; they were all caught up in a scene. I was really just using speed – fast, aggressive playing – as an effect."
Eric Johnson, January 2011:"I’m probably a bit hypocritical when it comes to shredding. I’ll do a show and shred a 15-minute solo, and then listen to a tape of it later and think, ‘What am I doing? That was good for about two minutes.’ Part of it is entertainment. But on the other hand, if you play a show where you just shred for two hours, you’ll see a lot of the crowd – especially the guys’ wives or dates – start to zone out, and want to go home. And who can blame them? That sort of playing is okay if it’s done properly and within the context of a song. But I came to love guitar because I heard Brian Jones play a cool fuzz-tone lick on ‘Satisfaction.’ I heard Hendrix do the same thing on ‘May This Be Love.’ I love melody, but then again some people listen to shredding and hear strong melodies there. It’s a matter of what turns you on. I don’t think it’s about whether you shred or not, it’s about the musicality behind it. And that’s subjective."
Steve Vai, August 2012, from a forthcoming interview with M – Music & Musicians:"In the ’80s, the trend was the ability to play the hell out of your instrument. That’s how I envisioned myself playing, and I really liked it. A lot of people were pseudo-shredding – a lot of the ’80s bands had people who were great guitar players who were doing nothing but that – and there was nothing wrong with that. It was acceptable and it was part of what was going on. But then it hit a wall, as most genres and trends do. Somebody came along – as always happens – and started creating new music that was very different. And that was grunge. But it wasn’t as if players like Joe and Eric and me said, ‘Oh boy, what are we going to do, now that people are no longer playing guitar solos?’ Playing as we did was why we started playing in the first place, and changes in trends weren’t going to stop us. Now there’s a trend in shred-guitar playing that dwarfs what we were doing back them. To me it sometimes sounds less like music than like fascinating ways to impress yourself. But there are people who feel that way about how I play. That’s fine, and to a degree it’s true. Some of how I play is because I like to fascinate myself. But it’s certainly not everything."
I'm not usually a fan of shredding due to the fact that sometimes it can feel like a "cope and paste" kind of thing. I think if it's presented properly it can definitely fit. But most of the time it just seems like shredding for shredding. I still respect the people that dedicate a lot of time to perfecting their art though.
"What sort of void am I filling in terms of musical composition? And the answer is nothing. I'm doing f*ck all. I'm sitting around here, pissing around trying to make music that people are gonna like."
- Devin Townsend
Incorrect. Sweep picking can be used in blues,and be used in a manner other than shredding, or as you say. It is used to outline the chord you are playing over top of correct? Therefore it can be used in other ways than just playing it excessively fast.
I think shredding is cool once in a while, but not for an entire show or album. I saw a Tony MacAlpine performance at a guitar program a few years ago and it was the coolest thing in the world for five minutes. Then it wasn't. Every song in his hour long set sounded just like the last one and it bored me to death. I respect the time and dedication it takes to learn to play like that but don't do it constantly.
I think with these things theres an element of wether or not you can actually do it. I cant shred and dont really like the sound of it so have never really tried, thus of course Im going to say I dont care for it. If I was more gifted on the guitar maybe I would think differently though. There is certainly an element of jealousy involved with this debate sometimes, not exclusively, but sometimes.
As such I suppose I have to put my opinion across which is that shredding, although impressive, rarely leads to a good song. I think people who learn it can become a little obsessed with it and forget that writing a good song as a whole carries so much more weight than a gazillion note 30 second solo towards the end of a song... I dunno though, does it really matter, each to their own and all that...
Shredding is good if you can hit the RIGHT notes, like Marty Friedman, Randy Rhoads, and Steve Vai. Shredding just to hit notes is tasteless and annoying.
I've always enjoyed good shredding. Jeff Loomis, Chris Broderick, Vai, Mike Amott.. I love their styles and how they play. While I'm not a big Rusty Cooley fan, he never ceases to amaze me, and I can honestly say his record with Outworld is phenomenal, and I love the shredding on it.
Look, shredding mostly applies to fans of metal/hard rock. It all comes down to what music one listens to. Some prefer more emotion or rawness, others prefer speedy shred solos. I, personally, lean towards more emotional playing and I like things like sloppiness and imperfections, I consider them traits of the guitarists personality. I appreciate the skill shred takes but it doesn't really sound great to me. That being said, UG is fishing for comments really, there are probably 1-2 shred debates a week anyway.
King/Hanneman aren't shredders. Twenty seconds of whammy abuse is not considered shredding. But it is disappointing to see how they left out some important early-mid 80s shredders like Lynch and Yngwie.
There is no comparison between Slayer and Buckethead. King and Hanneman are kids compared to Buckethead. I like Slayer a lot, but what Slayer calls 'solos' is pure distorted nonsense. Besides, great musicians can not only shred, but create sophisticated music that you can listen to longer than just a few minutes.
Alright, it's clear at this point that you're about the age of 13 and just discovered rock/metal using the typical introductory bands - but get your head out of your ass and stop thinking you're so elite because you've heard of Slayer and Pantera. There are MUCH better examples of shredding.
I am not 13, I have herd of buckethead and respect him, but don't like his music or aparance.I am suprised that UG did not reresent slayer or yngwie malstine for thare style of shreding an as allways
pepole blow eveything out of proprotions.
and shreding is very vuage so any one has
thear own styles.
The shred on Warning on the first Black Sabbath album will always be my favorite. I think it shaped the way a lot of musicians shred today. Then again, any band I've seen live that didn't have some connection to Ozzy or Dio, there was no shredding.
I shall quote Hendrix
"The blues is easy to play, but hard to feel."
I prefer the playing of guitarists like Hendrix, Blackmore, Gilmour and Page to the playing of Laiho, Van Halen, Malmsteen and Hammet...
It's all a matter of opinion though, because at the end of the day, music is a biased topic.
Sorry, but guitar shredding is still years before classical music shredding.
Show me guitar shred with better (or just as good) melody (yes! actual melody, not mindless playing random notes that fits scale) than Chopin's Fantasie Impromptu for example.
Gilbert is very, very good, also this song, but when he started shredding it was kinda meh. That's what I'm talking about.
Also guitar shred have tendencies to be just single notes streak playing to rather simple backing track. Classical music is more complex. I'm still waiting for guitarist who will play shred THAT good.
As most of you have already replied, in the right context shredding sounds awesome and can truly be an awesome climax in a song. Paul Gilbert's "Technical Difficulties" is to me an example of how a person can mix in shred with some really funky riffs to keep the song interesting. With that being said, as I got more skilled at guitar and was able to shred to a certain extent I became less impressed with that and more impressed with song composition. It became more interesting figuring out how a guitarists create cool harmonies and how a cool riff can change "tone" depending on the chord change behind it. To a certain extent there is that "awe" factor and when you can't do something as well as you like to, you admire those that can.
That pretty much sums up exactly how my thoughts about shredding evolved. Paul Gilbert is my favourite shred guitarist because he makes it tasteful and doesn't go completely overboard (unlike a certain Swede). Composing harmonies and figuring out how everything works musically is a much more cerebral task than shredding, which I now get the feeling is just more of a 'have correct practice and learn tricks of the trade' thing. Listening to classical music and the blues completely changed my perspective on what it means to be 'skilled' as a musician.
I dig shredding, when it's not pointless. Yngwie Malmsteen on his first albums, Ritchie Blackmore, and so it goes... but I can't stand pointless guitar wanking like Michael Angelo Batio.
If you're going to play lots of notes at a fast tempo, make sure it's actually good. Like Guthrie Govan or Shawn Lane. And what about Django Reinhardt? That dude was better than everyone on this site and he only had 2 working fingers.
it's all about how it's all composed and put together. a solo. shredding the entire thing could or could not be incredible. it doesn't all have to be 16th notes at 200+ bpm.
I'm not really a fan of shredding in general, but if I had to pick a shredder that actually had feel, it would have to be John Petrucci, even though I don't really like Dream Theater.
Now from a standpoint of sheer technical ability, while still managing to be creative, I'd say Buckethead.
I'd go to Paul Gilbert for a shredder with feel
I think Petrucci is to much about sheer speed and and odd time signatures most of the time but it's kinda like comparing apples with pears
I think the thing with Petrucci is that he's almost too good and too technical because of his musical back ground, and thats why sometimes i think DT's stuff lacks a certain something.
I think "substance" is the word you're searching for. Think of Jimi Hendrix for example; he was technically pretty sloppy, but he put so much into every note he played that it was incredible. I could say the same for someone like Kurt Cobain or even Jimmy Page. There are people who can shred at 300 bpm, and there are those who believe putting YOURSELF into your work is what's most important. I generally prefer those in the latter category.
I really like some fast shred passages but too much and it's really boring. I really like the way Protest the Hero does it, it's fast-paced and Luke is def. shredding but there's always a pretty good sense of melody to it. Sometimes the melody aspect is totally lost then it's just a bunch of boring notes.
I'm a sucker for a good melody. And while shred solos contain a lot of rather superfluous speedy notes, there are almost always these occasional glimpses of a great melody, and they're usually enough to hook me in. Sometimes speed has great effect, like how BTBAM's solos are often interesting at their fastest.
As for playing, I'm an advocate of learning as much technique and theory as possible. Really, learn to shred. You don't have to necessarily use what you learn, but learn it anyways. I'd rather know most of a musical language than a fraction of it.
I hate when people say "shredding" started in the 80's.
Shredding, aka playing fast, technically difficult music, has been around since the instruments themselves were invented.
I consider "shredders" like EVH, Steve Vai, Yngwie Malmstee, etc. to be more of a separate genre themselves, rather than the epitomes of shredding. Plenty of people can shred, they just happened to become famous for it.
I define shredding as guitar soloing at high speed, with a high degree of technicality, and generally involving sweep-picking or tapping. I enjoy it in that I admire the skill it takes and it is fun to watch. That being said, as much as I love an awesome solo, I prefer them to not be shreddy, because when it gets too shreddy sounding, it sounds tacky. It's like when a guy rips it up on guitar on stage but looks like he isn't trying; it takes away from it. But hey, I can't shred.
I really don't think that there's a "best" speed to play the guitar at; fast playing can sound good, slow playing can sound good, and making out that one is always more emotional or melodic than the other is a bit silly.
Having said that, I think even the best guitar players (in any genre) struggle to play extended solos without running out of good ideas; and this is maybe what gives shred such a bad name, as the term has strong connotations with instrumental artists, bands with lots of solos and so on.
I feel like too many guitarists these days use shredding as a crutch almost. They shred instead of putting melody or emotion into the solos.
However, shredding can be AWESOME when used properly. My vote for the best shredders would be the Amott brothers from Arch Enemy because they aren't always just ripping out lightning fast solos; they often have slightly down tempo melodic licks and passages that they bridge with shredding.
If the phrasing is good the solos are going to be good, no matter if you play fast or not, as you can feel listening to David Gilmour or Guthrie Govan. Period.
It looks like Buckethead is playing at a wedding. Can you imagine trying to convince your bride's parents, and just the bride for that matter, to allow that. Hilarious!!
In my opinion there are very few shredders that can shred with emotion. Jason Becker for example... the guy can play 3 notes and I almost cry. Randy Rhoads as well (if he is considered a shredder). I mostly listen to genres that don't even have solos like grunge, alternative metal, nu metal etc. because I think that there's a lot of originality in their songs even though they lack technique. If people would shred without it feeling like they are just trying to impress you by playing the most common licks in metal only 10 times faster than the average man, then i'd appreciate shredding much more.
I think there needs to be more shredding in modern music. As a guitarist I'm sick of hearing a so called "solo" that's only a few measures long. I play jazz and blues guitar so I understand the concept of less is more in some cases, but I also like to rock out and sometimes I want to hear a 3 or 4 minute solo on an album. That's one of the reasons I love Dinosaur Jr. J Mascis can shred for 10 minutes and the song doesn't lose any feeling or identity.
I think that Petruccis older work with DT is a good example of shredding with emotion. Nowdays it's kinda like he just wants a good workout while playing his guitar. I was pleasantly surprised by their latest album though.
i like some shredding but not like 10 mins. like a nice bluesy solo with some shred worked into it is pretty good. the solo needs feel not just an exercise
I'm pretty sure Shawn Lane proved you can be one of the fastest and still be one of the best phrasers ever. But Lane was anything but your ordinary guitarist.
I disagree. Most of DTs ballads have wonderful solos where you can hear Petrucci rape the guitar for about 6 seconds and then finish with a...with magic. lol listen to Hollow Years live at Budokan.
Jeff Loomis is the kind of shred I enjoy. He does it very tastefully in my opinion, and when he has videos of playthroughs or shows how he comes up with what he does, there's a lot of emotion and substance in his music. It may be fast a lot of the time, but he really knows what he's doing and he works with all of his abilities, not just one or two techniques.
That being said, as I've gotten better at guitar I've gotten less gaga over what he does, but I'm more interested in the technical/theoretical aspects of his fast playing and fast playing in general, rather than just thinking 'omgz this sounds amazing' and leaving it at that.
Shredding is sort of a dumb term residing within the guitar community. It has sort of a negative connotation attatched to it. Should all music be dumbed down into mediocre mush? Just like pitch, volume, and tempo, fast playing should be used dynamically with some sort of musical intent. Speed within a guitarist disposal allows him/her to achieve new tonal possibilities and in no way should be condemned. Have you ever heard Shostikovich's 8th string quartet? Some of the parts are quite fast, but the frantic pacing of those parts serve a purpose: they effectively convey a sense of panic or depressive madness. Speed is a tool, not a gimmick.
In a way im mildly okay with shredding, but theres a limit to everything. I for one am a huge fan of Stoner and Doom metal bands. But even I get tired of hearing slow heavily distorted guitars and go to stuff thats a bit more "upbeat".
Also I wish to add that. Playing fast DOES NOT make you a better guitarist. You could play 500 bpm and still not be as good as a person that can only play 120-150 bpm.
To me, the signature to every song is the overall emotion it is supposed to convey and every element of the song (lyrics, vocal style, drum patterns and accents, riffs, licks, SOLOS, etc...) should be in agreement with each other when it comes to it's mood. In the guitar solos for example, regardless of how many notes per minute a solo might be, as long as it has emotion to it that relates to the other elements of the song, it will be just fine.
Tasteful shredding is always entertaining: Guthrie Govan, Paul Gilbert, Andy Timmons, Shawn Lane, Larry Mitchell, etc. Tasteless shredding is bad. Not really a mind-boggling concept, but it doesn't only apply to rock/metal. The blues equivalent would be someone who just wanks on the minor pentatonic and blues scales, cops a few SRV licks, and has no feel, and thinks he's a blues guitarist.
Shredding is such a broad term nowadays. It spans across many different generes, I found that the Jazz Fusion guys like Shawn Lane, Guthrie Govan, Allan Holdsworth, Frank Gamble, Greg Howe etc. Have the most tasteful shredding. But when it comes to shredding in a band John Petrucci takes the cake. His solos are very well structured and are memorable. Listen to Under A Glass Moon or Best Of Times they have amazing solos.
*cough* *cough* gary moore *cough* *cough*
he was a blues artist but u can't deny that the man wrote some awesome riffs and shredded live till he tore your heart out.
Shredding is fine as long as it makes up 5% or less of a solo, anything more is guitar wankery. A solo is like a cake, you can't make the whole damn thing out of icing.
My favorite use of shredding is when you use it to end a solo, or bridge between two parts of a solo. Have a melodic solo, and end it with a blistering run. One of the only guitarists that I like who shreds a lot is Petrucci. He seems to make it melodic more than any other guitarist I listen to.
Shredding? or just playing fluently and well finesse. Shredding seems to suggest some sort of blanket term for fast. Fast with right notes and feel - nice. Fast but a horrible noise- bad. Pretty simple.
Coulda picked a better example of Buckethead, UG. I love his music, but that particular recording would make me run away screaming if I didn't know him.
As a person who shreds constantly, I can say that it is very definitely a fragile thing. You can't be reckless and aimless with it. I can't easily improvise shred solos for songs I write because the speed and technique are meaningless if there's no sensibility, or taste, and it takes a lot of talent and experience to sound out what fits where, and what it evokes. You have to be attuned to how your notes intermingle with the rhythm and the other instruments, not just themselves. Like putting sweeping into improv over a chord vamp. It's tough because you're layering chords over other chords, and you have to really feel what you're doing out and know how the intervals sound together. And you need to take the time to learn that.
A fast passage is fun to play, and fun to watch or hear, but it can't be slapped on. It's almost as if you were writing a fingerpicking part with large string gaps: you have to consider how what you play on the higher strings will complement the bass notes, and vice versa. Good shred is all about the journey and a bold statement. There are lots of ways to approach a solo, but there are really only two broad categories for good shred, as far as I can tell: wicked stuff with the intent to sound evil, funky, or just badass (like in "Mr. Scary" by George Lynch); and melodic, soulful, textured, and rich playing that supports the song and is meaningful (like in "Luck as a Constant" by Periphery).
Oh, and please don't bash the second example until you've heard it. It's a solid solo, whether you like the song/band.
"What sort of void am I filling in terms of musical composition? And the answer is nothing. I'm doing f*ck all. I'm sitting around here, pissing around trying to make music that people are gonna like."
- Devin Townsend