Jimmy Page is being sued by the man who wrote and first recorded the song Dazed And Confused.
Jake Holmes, an American folk singer, claims that Page and Led Zeppelin infringed his copyright, as his version came out two years prior to Zeppelin’s more famous one, on their self-titled, debut album.
However, even if he is successful in this federal law suit (filed in California), Holmes could only claim money owed during the past three years, due to the statute of limitations.
The story started in 1967 when Holmes recorded this song for his debut album "The Above Ground Sound" Of Jake Holmes. What made it unusual was the whole record was done with just bass, guitar and vocals – no drums.
Released in June 1967, the album wasn’t at all well received, but on August 25 the same year, he supported The Yardbirds (featuring Page) when they played at the Village Theater in Greenwich Village, New York.
So impressed were the British band with the song that they decided to develop their own version. This was a much longer one, with Page using a violin bow on his guitar.
Although The Yardbirds never did a studio version of this, there have been a couple of live recordings put out. One from a French TV show in March 1968 (which cropped up on a live album released in 2000) actually has Holmes down as writing the song.
By the time Zeppelin recorded Dazed And Confused, Page had changed so much of the song – lyrically and musically – that he was credited as the sole writer. Holmes did try to contact Page, but with no luck. However, he always refused to take legal action – until now.
You can make your mind up now as to whether Holmes’ law suit has any validity
To prevent bullsh*t like this, they should have just named Jake Holmes as the writer and Jimmy Page as the arranger. No big deal...
Seriously, how hard is it to do that? Weird Al makes an entire career of stuff like this, and how many times has he been sued? Artists just need to be honest and accurate credit whomever's responsible. There's no shame in covering a song if you can do it well.
the beginning/openning chord of the track reminds me of black dpg....i feel Jimmy Page stole enuff to say the idea isnt original..but he definately changed and added enuff to say his version's better/ his own
why hasnt anything been said until now? hasn't it been quite a long time since the release of the song? (i dont know the exact date) but seriously, wtfff?
apparently if your song is named the same, and there are a couple of highly discrete sound similarities between the two you can sue? When as a whole they are completely different? this is bs
Both versions have their merits. Although Zep may have recorded the definitive version I always like to respect the original and there are aspects of Holmes' version that are superior in my opinion. That said if he wanted to sue them, he prob should have done it years and years and years ago.
apparently if your song is named the same, and there are a couple of highly discrete sound similarities between the two you can sue? When as a whole they are completely different? this is bs
In fairness alot of zep's early stuff has been known to be stolen. But thats what blues/folk artists do, cover other people's songs. Nothing wrong with it.
About ****ing time..
I just took a led zep class in university and one of the major discussions were "rip-off vs. reinvention".
Of course zep made the song way way better, but they stole the riff, were too lazy to change the lyrics/song title, and apparently ignored the letter Jake Holmes previously sent to Page.
so... he waited until 2010 to file a lawsuit when his song came out in 68 and Zeppelins in 69. Im suprised he has a case due to copyright law statutes.
About ****ing time..
I just took a led zep class in university and one of the major discussions were "rip-off vs. reinvention".
Of course zep made the song way way better, but they stole the riff, were too lazy to change the lyrics/song title, and apparently ignored the letter Jake Holmes previously sent to Page.
Actually if you listen to the lyrics the only part that's the same is, "I'm Dazed and Confused..." The riff is a little different too, during the verse Holmes only plays the first four notes of the descending cromatic riff plus the pickup whereas Zeppelin goes on to play the second strain as well through the verse. So all in all they didn't rip it off because as there are some similarities there are major differences
Half of you are morons. Page has admitted that they used the song, and then expanded on it. Technically it is Holme's song. Page deserved it, he could of just stated Holme's as the writer or at least CHANGED the name of the song.
Hasn't Led Zeppelin been accused of Plagiarism numerous times? They just need to give credit where it's due.
Holmes version does sound like Zeppelin's. The guitar kind of does too, but I agree, Led Zeppelin's version is much better.
"HE PLAYED AN "A" NOTE AND THAN A "C" JUST LIKE MY SONG! I DEMAND MONEY!"
-Some Guy that failed at music.
Agreed. Honestly they took the bass rift and then proceeded to play something based off the original. Regardless of what is said or what was done all artist are stealing from each other. There is enough difference in the songs that Zeppelin should be able to get away with this. The similarities aren't exactly blatant aside from the bass riff. Personally if I wrote version one and then Zeppelin came out with their version I would be less inclined to sue and more inclined to try and use it as an excuse to meet Jimmy and then run around being stoked that Led Zeppelin was sort of playing my shit.
Plus its not like the world isn't aware of the fact that Zeppelin was running around taking other peoples stuff and re-working it into epic-ness.
Also Holems its been like 40 year, the statute of limitations ran out like 35 years ago. You tried something when it happened and then gave up. You can't just wait 40 years and decide to take action. Move on.
When Coldplay was accused of plagiarism everyone thought Satriani was right for suing them. When Led Zeppelin are accused people think THEY are right, because "Led Zeppelin's version is much better". The song is a cover, and the guy who wrote the original should get credit, even if the cover is very different (and much better).
They sound pretty similar. Even the tempo is close, and the feel of the song remains the same.
kettmannism wrote:
It's a lot like how Mozart used to do variations on songs. I wouldn't say it's a cover, but it is, for sure, a variation.
Well, Mozart used to do variations, and now people today do variations on classical music, but that was so long ago that it's basically a public domain argument now. Page should at least be discredited.
The bass-line and vocal style are pretty similar. Zep would have saved their lawyers and their conscience a whole load of grief by just crediting the guy, which they clearly did copy.
It's no excuse to say 'that's what all folk/blues people do'. That doesn't change the fact that it's been copied. Lots of people steal, that doesn't make it ok.
I hope his lawsuit does go through, so people behave more responsibly in producing music.
Had Page read/responded to his letter originally and said 'Dear Mr. Holmes, I see your point but I feel that the song has been changed substantially and beyond recognition from the other one. Thank you for your inspiration. J.Page' he would do better in court. He was irresponsible and didn't. Throw the book at him judge!
Hasn't Led Zeppelin been accused of Plagiarism numerous times? They just need to give credit where it's due.
To be fair, they usually do. A lot of their early songs are folk and blues covers/adaptations and they're not shy about their influences. They rightly take no shame in developing other peoples ideas into something more grand.
I have no idea why they didn't credit Holmes, the song's obviously based on his version. He's a bit late though, especially because he'll only get royalties for the last 3 years. He's probably just skint and trying to get some long overdue money.
Everyone keeps saying Zeppelin stole songs, but nobody has offered any examples or evidence. This song should be the only one really in question.
when the levee breaks was lyrically taken from a guy named Kansas Joe and he wasn't credited...many of their earlier albums were bascially comprised of recycled blues riffs. you'd be hard pressed to find blues artists with truly original riffs in general, hough
IMO, the only thing that Holmes deserves is credit for the writing. As far as money goes, he shouldn't get a cent, because if he REALLY cared and this WASNT an act of desperation, he would have done it ages ago before Zeppelin ever got successful. Unless he's been in a coma for half a century, he gets no money.
To prevent bullsh*t like this, they should have just named Jake Holmes as the writer and Jimmy Page as the arranger. No big deal...
Seriously, how hard is it to do that? Weird Al makes an entire career of stuff like this, and how many times has he been sued? Artists just need to be honest and accurate credit whomever's responsible. There's no shame in covering a song if you can do it well.
Weird Al does parody, which is covered under copyright law. You can't sue someone for parodying your song (or you can't win, at least).
Also, if you look at a lot of the blues from the 30/40/50s/ etc they do borrow off each other a lot, I mean obviously it became quite distasteful to do such things later on but I think Zep pulled it in when it was just stopping, still somewhat acceptable, but more people weren't as simple any more. Still a great band, despite not writing a handful of riffs from their early era.
Good for this guy, he see's that he can get the money or credit he deserves, but he's many years too late. Also Jimmy's version gives me orgasms. All he really did was take inspiration from this song, not much of it is the same, kind of like sampling a song for your own.
Psst, as if every other Zeppelin song weren't a ripoff of something. I do love Zep deeply, and I think the guys were just such an amazing force that whatever they stole they made into something completely else, so I don't really give a shit about page being the magpie he was, but just saying, it's true.
they should have credited him
its pretty easy to tell its the exact same thing. although i wonder why he's just now complaining about this 43 years later
About ****ing time..
I just took a led zep class in university and one of the major discussions were "rip-off vs. reinvention".
Of course zep made the song way way better, but they stole the riff, were too lazy to change the lyrics/song title, and apparently ignored the letter Jake Holmes previously sent to Page.
Actually if you listen to the lyrics the only part that's the same is, "I'm Dazed and Confused..." The riff is a little different too, during the verse Holmes only plays the first four notes of the descending cromatic riff plus the pickup whereas Zeppelin goes on to play the second strain as well through the verse. So all in all they didn't rip it off because as there are some similarities there are
major differences
All that really matters is that the vocal melody is the same. partially.
First of all if I had come across Mr. Holmes version on youtube, or heard it playing somewhere I would instantly recognize it as a very close similarity to Led Zep's. Then I would most definitely look into who's version was out first. The feel of the song, the main riff, even most of the vocals are very close to the one we all know from Led Zeppelin.
So Zeppelin changed a few lyrics around, and extended some of the music to make it more "epic"... We are comparing basically a single man with an acoustic guitar, to a band featuring four of the most talented musicians from the past century!
I think everyone would agree that if Jimi Hendrix had not give Bob Dylan credit for "All Along the Watchtower", everyone would be on Dylan's side %100, even though Hendrix's version was indeed "epic". Just because this guy is just a little unknown folk artist doesn't make it any different.
And for as why he need's the money now, that is none of our business. Perhaps his wife is sick with cancer, or something in which is not just for greedy purposes. Led Zeppelin have plenty of money, and have been very fortunate, and could afford to give this man credit, and respectively throw this man a bone, or two! He shouldn't have to ask for it in the first place. And this is coming from someone who has every Led Zeppelin album, and is huge fan.
First of all if I had come across Mr. Holmes version on youtube, or heard it playing somewhere I would instantly recognize it as a very close similarity to Led Zep's. Then I would most definitely look into who's version was out first. The feel of the song, the main riff, even most of the vocals are very close to the one we all know from Led Zeppelin.
So Zeppelin changed a few lyrics around, and extended some of the music to make it more "epic"... We are comparing basically a single man with an acoustic guitar, to a band featuring four of the most talented musicians from the past century!
I think everyone would agree that if Jimi Hendrix had not give Bob Dylan credit for "All Along the Watchtower", everyone would be on Dylan's side %100, even though Hendrix's version was indeed "epic". Just because this guy is just a little unknown folk artist doesn't make it any different.
And for as why he need's the money now, that is none of our business. Perhaps his wife is sick with cancer, or something in which is not just for greedy purposes. Led Zeppelin have plenty of money, and have been very fortunate, and could afford to give this man credit, and respectively throw this man a bone, or two! He shouldn't have to ask for it in the first place. And this is coming from someone who has every Led Zeppelin album, and is huge fan.
the guy has every right to be angry. led zeppelin took songs from other people all the time without crediting them, but he should've done this a long time ago.
The song on the album just before "Dazed and Confused", "Babe I'm Gonna Leave You", is basically covered as well. It was also changed a bit, but it is also noted so on the album, where it reads Traditional, Arranged by Jimmy Page.
Here is Joan Baez, singing the "traditional" version of the song back in 1962.
A simple 'written by' would have solved this entire mess. As it stands, the guy has a point - he was uncredited and recieved no royalties. Now, I wouldnt listen to his recording of the song, and I think the Zep one is far superior, but that's their mistake.
This is definatley plagerized and Page should be sued. It should have been done decades befor and Holmes might have made a buck or two! He never should have waited this long. However, I am shocked. I am surprised to hear this. And whatever, I Play other guitarists material all the time and change it after plying something for 5 minutes a song can morph into almost anything. The courts will have to decide not me... Thank the lord!
Honestly it's a valid argument. They are very similar. Page should just be thankful it came so late because only having to pay out for the last three years is such a small amount compared to what that song has made for them since it was released.
Regardless, the man wrote the song first, Page obviously stole a bit of it. I don't care which version people think is better, the fact of the matter is Holmes wrote the driving riff behind the song first. You can't say that riff isn't a huge part of the song. If only for that, he should be credited.
And which version had actual talent on it? Piss off buddy your like 40 years to late to try and claim any real money off this stunt. Even if he wins the claim no one is going to buy his album or even say that he had the better version. Congrats on the 500 bucks you'll make off this.
In the late 60s in the underground blues rock scene (Which is what Zeppelin were a part of, while they were the New Yardbirds and had not recorded their first album yet) everybody stole songs from everyone else! No one really cared. Then Zeppelin got famous off of some of them and then a few people got greedy and tried to sue.
To prevent bullsh*t like this, they should have just named Jake Holmes as the writer and Jimmy Page as the arranger. No big deal...
Seriously, how hard is it to do that? Weird Al makes an entire career of stuff like this, and how many times has he been sued? Artists just need to be honest and accurate credit whomever's responsible. There's no shame in covering a song if you can do it well.
Weird Al also contacts and gets permission from EVERYONE he covers though.
zeppelins version is way way better but its ovious that they ripped it off this guy cause its got the same melody and bassline its just longer and got different words but even those are similar
About ****ing time..
I just took a led zep class in university and one of the major discussions were "rip-off vs. reinvention".
Of course zep made the song way way better, but they stole the riff, were too lazy to change the lyrics/song title, and apparently ignored the letter Jake Holmes previously sent to Page.
What the hell is a 'led zep' class and what cereal box did you get your degree in bullshit from?
seriously? I'm sure both sides have their reasons and like the article said Holmes tried contacting Page and stealing is still stealing even if it is the mighty zeppelin..Look at Kwame Detroit's former mayor he's been corrupt for ages and now his ass is locked up in jail..I think he should be noted that Page screwed himself and knows it.
They are not that similar,the bass line and a couple of words are the same,but they 2 totally different songs. Sure, Page probably lifted those parts from Holmes song,but it's not like the Lemon song and Howling Wolf's Killing Floor -those 2 songs are very similar ! Probably Holmes should get some money from Page,because of the main riff.
I love Led Zeppelin but all the fan boys saying Holmes shouldn't get a cent are ridiculous. Who cares if he waited decades to file a claim. I'm sure if a successful band stole (too extreme of a word but you get it) your song you'd want something too.
dude technically pagey could get off by saying zepps version is a dub and slap a "dazed and confused taken from jake holmes" sticker on this crap and its all good
To prevent bullsh*t like this, they should have just named Jake Holmes as the writer and Jimmy Page as the arranger. No big deal...
Seriously, how hard is it to do that? Weird Al makes an entire career of stuff like this, and how many times has he been sued? Artists just need to be honest and accurate credit whomever's responsible. There's no shame in covering a song if you can do it well.
Weird Al also contacts and gets permission from EVERYONE he covers though.
weird al does not. why would that rapper have threatend to kick his ass if he had permission?
Covering a song is not stealing it. I would be pumped if Jimmy Page liked my song so much that he wanted to do a version of it.
You're completely right. Unfortunatly, that has nothing to do with this article as Led Zeppelin didn't cover the song. They listed Jimmy Page as the writer and didn't give any recognition to the original artist. That's not covering, that's stealing.
Covering a song is not stealing it. I would be pumped if Jimmy Page liked my song so much that he wanted to do a version of it.
You're completely right. Unfortunatly, that has nothing to do with this article as Led Zeppelin didn't cover the song. They listed Jimmy Page as the writer and didn't give any recognition to the original artist. That's not covering, that's stealing.
The point is that these 2 versions are so different that calling it "stealing" is absolutely ridiculous.
To prevent bullsh*t like this, they should have just named Jake Holmes as the writer and Jimmy Page as the arranger. No big deal...
Seriously, how hard is it to do that? Weird Al makes an entire career of stuff like this, and how many times has he been sued? Artists just need to be honest and accurate credit whomever's responsible. There's no shame in covering a song if you can do it well.
Weird Al also contacts and gets permission from EVERYONE he covers though.
weird al does not. why would that rapper have threatend to kick his ass if he had permission?
wierd al does get permission for EVERY song that he records, he has a ton of unrecorded stuff that he plays live that he hasn't gotten permission for, but that's different. also, legally he doesn't need permission to make a parody, at least in certain places. some people just get angry that his joke songs about their song are more successful than the original
that said, this is complete money grabbing bullshit. Page DID steal the song, but this guy noticed it 40something years ago, wrote a letter, and took it no further, and NOW he wants to do something about it?
im pretty sure Led Zeppelin 1 was a ripoff of alot of things, especially ripoffs of memebers of the yardbirds. im pretty sure its no big secret in rocknroll that many riffs were stolen in that album. but who cares. long live led zeppelin. **** this fool.
i think he does have a case, despite how late he is in suing page. and whether the zeppelin song is cooler or not, the base of this song WAS taken. and besides, its not that hard to just put in the album that it was written by someone else. no problem, and no one would pay attention to it anyways.
Page ripped off SO MANY artists it's really ridiculous.. lots of people cover old blues and folk songs, but they always give credit to the original artist. I guess Jimmy thought he didn't need to. hope this guy wins
Something is not right with this story. i understand that the "original" was by jake holmes. but if he recorded it in 68, how come jimmy page was playing it with the yardbirds before then? anyone?
kinda a dick move to not even give him some sort of credit
it's my understanding that there are a few more circumstances like this one regarding zep songs
lol, it wouldn't be the first song led zeppelin took and didn't give the originals credit for. A little late though, the guy probably just went broke and needed money so now decided to bring it up, lol.
they are similar songs, however the differences are definite enough that it may not be worth this guys time, but i dont think i (as well as any of you) know enough about the copy write laws to say either way. that being said, it makes a whole lot of sense for the yardbirds to play this song, it got their feel. also this guys may have tried to contact led zeppelin, but tell me when the last time any one was able to actually get a message to the biggest musical act in the world? i mean come on. and i also love how everyone loves to hate on led zeppelin for "stealing" so much, and completely forgets about almost their entire catalogue of original stuff. it just seems extremely fashionable to hate on led zeppelin because they're so huge. whats the problem with them? the improvisational skills? stage presence? range/depth/dynamics in song writing. and im pretty sure not everyone in the world was as worried about "getting theirs" in 1969 like they are now, not in music anyway, especially blues music. ever listen to elmore james? howlin wolf? muddy waters? lots of similar riffs/base lines, even similar lyrics between them. its easy to be on jimmy pages case and call him lazy or unoriginal when you havent ever done anything original, or anything anyone will remember. keep talking though cause i highly doubt jimmy really cares when he's playing guitar better than any of us, and making more money than any of us can imagine.
To prevent bullsh*t like this, they should have just named Jake Holmes as the writer and Jimmy Page as the arranger. No big deal...
Seriously, how hard is it to do that? Weird Al makes an entire career of stuff like this, and how many times has he been sued? Artists just need to be honest and accurate credit whomever's responsible. There's no shame in covering a song if you can do it well.
Ya but Weird Al is a joke, so there's a difference. Oh wait, never mind.
The thing is if I hadn't ever seen this article and heard this Jake Holmes song maybe on the radio or heard some buddy of mine playing it I would instantly say "that's dazed and confused" Although listening to it knowing that he is filing a lawsuit about it I can say "oh these aren't the same! Come on dude!" Now don't get the wrong idea I love Zeppelin and they should win but this guy definitely has a point.
Zeppelin definitely copied the song, that's been well established before this lawsuit was ever conceived, but Holmes has always chosen to let them have their way with his song. As has been stated, folk/blues artists use each others' material all the time; its more of a community of musicians than a competitive market, but they really should have given him credit. Failing to give credit is Zeppelin's main shortcoming.
About ****ing time..
I just took a led zep class in university and one of the major discussions were "rip-off vs. reinvention".
Of course zep made the song way way better, but they stole the riff, were too lazy to change the lyrics/song title, and apparently ignored the letter Jake Holmes previously sent to Page.
...they did change the lyrics... and the are hundreds of songs that end up with similar titles. check how many bands have made a song titled War. And taking inspiration to reinvent something isnt stealing its tribute this guys just jealous. plus hes a little late to the party to sue now.
Folk/Blues artists "borrow" each others' music. That's just the way it was back then. I don't have a problem with what Led Zep did, EXCEPT they should have credited Holmes. But if he had a problem with it, he should have sued 40 years ago. The fact he's waited this long shows that he doesn't care about the music, only the cash he could potentially receive.
About ****ing time..
I just took a led zep class in university and one of the major discussions were "rip-off vs. reinvention".
Of course zep made the song way way better, but they stole the riff, were too lazy to change the lyrics/song title, and apparently ignored the letter Jake Holmes previously sent to Page.
...they did change the lyrics... and the are hundreds of songs that end up with similar titles. check how many bands have made a song titled War. And taking inspiration to reinvent something isnt stealing its tribute this guys just jealous. plus hes a little late to the party to sue now.
Yeah, except LZ took both the riff, and the lyrical theme as well as the title of the song.
Remember the Rolling Stones Sued The Verve? (bittersweet symphony)
...
i like this guys version, its got some sorta DIFFERANT vibe, more DARK! i'm not i'mpressed by the LATENESS in the suit, but whatever, a rip-off is a rip-off...
and i agree, they shoulda credited JAKE as to Writing and Page for arrangement.
FIN.
The vocal melody and bassline are both similar, which is most definitely enough to say the original was written by Holmes. Page should have given credit where it was due, regardless of whether or not he "thought he had changed enough of it". At least a phone call.
But I'm excited to hear as the case goes on about why he chose to wait 40 years to file suit.
First, I'd like to say that Zep totally stole the song, but.....
1. LZ's version absolutely rapes Holmes' version
2. Jake Holmes, you are officially the biggest spaz ever for trying to do something about it 41 years later, when every one in the world would love to claim to have been the writer of now extremely famous Led Zeppelin songs. Your just a weeeee bit late. Go create another shitty song we can rip off into a masterpiece or do something with more of a point. Like power washing a dirt driveway.
people reuse songs all the time. All Zeppelin did was change some words and made it a hard rock classic. The only similarities is really the "I've been dazed and confused..." line, and the bassline.
Zeppelin copied tonnes of songs, the Lemon Song, You Shook Me, How Many More Times... the list goes on.
well, it is not the exact same thing, if their gonna ban page then elvis presley should ban every other rock n roll bands for taking the jailhouse rock inspiration.
Anyway, arent we in 2010, is this the time to sue? lol
It's a little late in the game to be bitchin´ about it, me thinks. Maybe he only recently heard the Zep version. LOL
My thoughts exactly. there is no way he went all these years without hearing this song or someone else telling him about it. It's impossible. Zeppelin seems to be the king at stealing songs though. I can't think of one song that they put out that someone hasn't claimed they stole from them. Even if only half of the cases are true that's still pretty bad.
This is BS paige should be sued. They sound completely different. any retard could figure out that they arent the same song. As for the other guy he's just trying to make a quick buck. Nice timing @$$hole!!
Although I agree Zeps version is better, I also believe that credit should be given where it due. Page should of mentioned Holmes name, but then again a majority of Zeppelins library is stolen material so he couldnt make one exception.
This is BS paige should be sued. They sound completely different. any retard could figure out that they arent the same song. As for the other guy he's just trying to make a quick buck. Nice timing @$$hole!!
imbaguitar :
About ****ing time..
I just took a led zep class in university and one of the major discussions were "rip-off vs. reinvention".
Of course zep made the song way way better, but they stole the riff, were too lazy to change the lyrics/song title, and apparently ignored the letter Jake Holmes previously sent to Page.
You took a class on Led Zeppelin?!?!?! Must be one Hell of an University.
Going off a live version by The Yardbirds w/ Page, which can be found on Youtube....well the Yardbirds version was MUCH closer to the original, sharing lyrics, but Zep's "Dazed and Confused" didn't evolve far enough away from the original to be its own song. This isn't the case of "Sweet Home Alabama" and "Werewolves of London", which share the same riff/chord sequence but are still quite different songs. This is quite blatant theft, even if Page didn't intend as such. The guy deserves his share.
For that matter, Led Zeppelin and Pagey are overrated, but that's neither here nor there.
Page uses a cello bow. Not a violin bow. Led zeppelin's version is far different and better, although Jake's version is pleasant as well, they are totally different.NO ONE CAN SUE ZEPPELIN! you must be crazy, they can get away with murda dog! They are Rock gods. OJ even got away with murder. The Case will never arise, Page's Solo is too powerful and thats enough said.period.
Something is not right with this story. i understand that the "original" was by jake holmes. but if he recorded it in 68, how come jimmy page was playing it with the yardbirds before then? anyone?
Jake Holmes wrote the song in 1976 (read article), he played it live when he opened for the Yardbirds at one of their concerts. The members of the Yardbirds heard the song and were inspired to play their own versoin of it. After the yardbirds disbanded, Page wanted to do yet another version with Led Zeppelin, which
why do people keep saying "its similar but zeppelins is better"
in court it doesnt matter whose is better...if holmes wrote it jimmy page should have given him credit and he deserves some dollars
As much as I love Zeppelin more than any other thing under the sky that can produce sound, and as much as I think the Zeppelin version puts the original version to ancestral disgrace, Jimmy Page should have credited him.
But it's pretty stupid to pursue this only after such a long time. Many others already done it long ago, but maybe he can win this?
The credit should go to the original idea owner... we have to admit that even if we all love Jimmy Page.
It's just too bad for Holmes that if he wins he will only get the $$$ correspondent to the last 3 years... not fair... but then again, since 1967 he had plenty of time to file the suit.
When Coldplay was accused of plagiarism everyone thought Satriani was right for suing them. When Led Zeppelin are accused people think THEY are right, because "Led Zeppelin's version is much better". The song is a cover, and the guy who wrote the original should get credit, even if the cover is very different (and much better).
I was severly against the whole Satch-suing-coldplay thing, for the exact same reasons as I'm against this. it's not a blatant ripoff, it's a couple of notes that are the same.
Jesus christ, get over it, just because you didn't have the talent to make better music.
wow...really guys? wtf? it's obviously the same song. i love the work of led zeppelin, but they took from one artist and made millions off of it. and to all you ppl who say they sound nothing alike...really? r u saying that if you heard the jake holmes verion playing somewhere, you wouldn't say "shit...that's dazed and confused". it's pretty obvious. and waiting 40 yrs to sue....well it happens. if you raped someone 40 yrs ago, you can still be charged...watch out all u rapists from 1970
Zeppelin should do a "Garage Days" album for all the music they've ripped off. Everybody borrows in music. Like Dave Mustaine once said,"There are only so many combinations on a guitar once in awhile you have to borrow." Clapton did it, Vaughn did it but they at least didn't claim the rights. They gave the credit where it's due.
I've always found it hard to justify whether I think the Led Zeppelin usage (of this and several songs) to be right or wrong. It's pretty clear they derived much of this song and others from other songs. I think it's dumb to say they stole all their songs, and just as dumb to say they sound nothing alike. They should definitely have listed it as arranged by Page, but at the time, maybe they or Atlantic thought it would come out looking like a Jazz or Classical record.
You've got to consider also, the label may not have asked/been told who wrote the songs, and the band may have forgotten who they 'borrowed' from, considering the drink and drug they indulged in through the era.
After listening, I think he does deserve some points. It would be a matter of figuring out how many (5%, 10%, 15%...). Because Holmes didn’t resolve the issue from the start I don’t think he should be entitled to any of the earnings that the song incurred over the last 41 years. However if a percentage can be agreed upon then Holmes should be payed at that rate for the next 9 years, after which the song becomes public domain. It’s not up to Jimmy Page to wide Holmes's a$$ for him, if he had taken care of business 41 years ago he wouldn’t be in this situation.
They plagiarized, with a lot of proof.
It's never too late to sue...
They should have gave credit, but it was Peter Grant who made the silly decision to push away the crediting from the first albums, because he felt if Led Zeppelin would come up with these albums with crediting, that the majority of the public will see them as a cover-band, and he didn't like that, even though they had a lot of originality and talent.
After getting sued at the first years, Peter Grant handled it out of court (with money) and then thought he could get away with it.
Well no, now Peter Grant now actually got away with it and left the band in a tight spot, the band shouldn't have ignored Grant's action and should have learned about the consequences.
Or probably Grant talked to them saying they shouldn't credit and they foolishly went "Sure, whatever."
Holmes is clear to go...
He didn't cared at first, he was happy his music (bassline) was making an affect towards the people at the time, and tried to contact Page to tell him about the crediting of his song.
You've got to consider also, the label may not have asked/been told who wrote the songs, and the band may have forgotten who they 'borrowed' from, considering the drink and drug they indulged in through the era.
No they know what they were doing and knew who they were ripping from. These artists were a major influence, it's like you saying if you took drugs and drank then you would forget Led Zeppelin, no, it won't happen.
However Peter Grant was the one who caused this and got away with it leaving Page in a tight spot.
