nazgulas
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Join date: Mar 2011
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#1
Hi everyone,

So What do you think? Will 20 watt guitar amp sound loud enough in a small pub along with other instruments (bass, drums)?

Also, could you tell me if drums would be ok on it's own or do I need a bunch of microphones around the drum kit (considering the poor gear that I have)?

Thanks for any help
GaryBillington
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#2
A 20 watt tube amp would probably be OK.

A 20 watt solid state amp....not so much.

If you're just doing small pub gigs, the drums will be fine on their own. They only need mic'ing up when you progress onto much larger venues.
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#3
Yes, everything he said. What amp are you playing, also?
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nazgulas
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#4
I use Orange CR20LDX. But I am thinkinking of buying another guitar cube at about the same price range. Any suggestions what I should look for?

Thanks Guys!
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#5
Quote by nazgulas
Hi everyone,

So What do you think? Will 20 watt guitar amp sound loud enough in a small pub along with other instruments (bass, drums)?

Also, could you tell me if drums would be ok on it's own or do I need a bunch of microphones around the drum kit (considering the poor gear that I have)?

Thanks for any help

In my experience in a small venue we have had to go to extraordinary effort to make the drums quieter.
If I miss one day of practice, I notice it.
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GaryBillington
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#6
Quote by nazgulas
I use Orange CR20LDX. But I am thinkinking of buying another guitar cube at about the same price range. Any suggestions what I should look for?

Thanks Guys!

What you have is an acceptable practice amp - if you're starting to gig you've outgrown it. A quick search shows that as £130ish - is that your total budget or can you stretch it at all? You won't get much of a gigging amp for that sort of money.

Tell us these so we can provide some useful advice:
Budget
Location
Style/Genre
Other kit
Used or new
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PluckingGood
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#7
I read a lot of reviews before getting my Orange micro-terror 20W with PPC108 cab, total price £150. From what I read it would be good enough for practice, studio and small venues. Only issue would be whether or not you could hear yourself over the sound of the drums behind you as it's closed back.
Offworld92
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#8
In my experience, no. But it depends a lot on how hard your drummer hits and what style you're playing.
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Ian_the_fox
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#9
What kind of music are you playing? That makes every world of difference.
nazgulas
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Join date: Mar 2011
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#10
I play brit pop/punk rock.
I could afford to spend £200-£250 for an amp.

I found some 120w guitar cubes for this price. Do you think this would be enough?

Despite the price, could you tell me what gear should I have to get me going? And which is better:powerful combo amp or amp head with a big speaker?
I am really confused now because I want to make good investment. I just want to have a good starting gear for gigging so I won't be frustrated with the quality of the sound during the show.

As I told earlier, I am aiming for small venues like pubs.

Please share your opinion.

Thanks
Last edited by nazgulas at Nov 9, 2012,
Ian_the_fox
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#11
What do you mean by "120w guitar cube"? As in the Roland Cube? Do they even have a 120w guitar model? Even so, 120w solid state won't seem as powerful as even a 30w tube amp.


40-50w tube will be enough. Within your budget you should find a used Marshall DSL401. That's the ideal amp for pop punk playing.

Generally a head and separate cab will be more flexible and more projecting than a combo (if you get a 4x12), but they often cost more and are far out of your budget, at least decent ones. A combo will be the most you'll need if you're just playing bars/pubs.
nazgulas
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#12
Quote by Ian_the_fox
What do you mean by "120w guitar cube"? As in the Roland Cube? Do they even have a 120w guitar model? Even so, 120w solid state won't seem as powerful as even a 30w tube amp.


40-50w tube will be enough. Within your budget you should find a used Marshall DSL401. That's the ideal amp for pop punk playing.

Generally a head and separate cab will be more flexible and more projecting than a combo (if you get a 4x12), but they often cost more and are far out of your budget, at least decent ones. A combo will be the most you'll need if you're just playing bars/pubs.

I mean Behringer V-Tone GMX212 for example. Also there is Fender Frontman 212R Amplifier of 100watts for about the same price. So I am looking at these kind of things.
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#13
Quote by Ian_the_fox
What do you mean by "120w guitar cube"? As in the Roland Cube? Do they even have a 120w guitar model? Even so, 120w solid state won't seem as powerful as even a 30w tube amp.

Yeah, because they don't feel the same. Also, explain how it won't seem as powerful, you do understand how wattage works, don't you?

TS, if you're playing with distortion and cleans aren't terribly important, 20-30 watts should be okay. Realistically you should be letting FOH mic you up so they can include you in the mix anyway. But you I'd aim for a combo with a 12" speaker rather than the Micro Terror's matching 8" inch cab. Have a look for a used DSL401 combo or a Peavey Classic 30, however you may have to raise your budget a tad to find one, but it'll be worth it nonetheless.
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#14
Quote by nazgulas
I mean Behringer V-Tone GMX212 for example. Also there is Fender Frontman 212R Amplifier of 100watts for about the same price. So I am looking at these kind of things.

Nope. Don't waste your time on either of those. Horrible amplifiers.

TS, if you're playing with distortion and cleans aren't terribly important, 20-30 watts should be okay. Realistically you should be letting FOH mic you up so they can include you in the mix anyway. But you I'd aim for a combo with a 12" speaker rather than the Micro Terror's matching 8" inch cab. Have a look for a used DSL401 combo or a Peavey Classic 30, however you may have to raise your budget a tad to find one, but it'll be worth it nonetheless.


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nazgulas
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#15
I also forgot to mention that I am in a band that use 2 guitars so would it be better to have two seperate and cheaper amps or more expensive single amp that I could share with my bandmate?
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#16
Quote by nazgulas
I also forgot to mention that I am in a band that use 2 guitars so would it be better to have two seperate and cheaper amps or more expensive single amp that I could share with my bandmate?

Make him buy his own amp.
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nazgulas
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#17
Quote by Eppicurt
Yeah, because they don't feel the same. Also, explain how it won't seem as powerful, you do understand how wattage works, don't you?

TS, if you're playing with distortion and cleans aren't terribly important, 20-30 watts should be okay. Realistically you should be letting FOH mic you up so they can include you in the mix anyway. But you I'd aim for a combo with a 12" speaker rather than the Micro Terror's matching 8" inch cab. Have a look for a used DSL401 combo or a Peavey Classic 30, however you may have to raise your budget a tad to find one, but it'll be worth it nonetheless.

Yes, I understand how wattage works, I was pretty good at physics I understand that it's not only the power that makes it sound great. There are a lot of other factors aswell. But by saying 'power' I mean the loudness of the tune without any crap sound in addition
nazgulas
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#18
Quote by Eppicurt
Make him buy his own amp.

The problem is that 'he' is my brother who is struggling with the money at the moment
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#19
Quote by nazgulas
Yes, I understand how wattage works, I was pretty good at physics I understand that it's not only the power that makes it sound great. There are a lot of other factors aswell. But by saying 'power' I mean the loudness of the tune without any crap sound in addition

That wasn't directed at you dude.

But take what I posted with some consideration, you're better off saving a tad more and buying something better suited for what you want. The Behringer and Fender amps you listed are garbage and are not worth your time.

Quote by nazgulas
The problem is that 'he' is my brother who is struggling with the money at the moment

Guitar amps aren't designed to be able to run 2 guitars at once, buying two cheap amps is going to bite you on the ass in the long run. I can appreciate and respect you want to help your brother out, but I just don't want you to waste your money.
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Last edited by Eppicurt at Nov 9, 2012,
nazgulas
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#20
Quote by Eppicurt
That wasn't directed at you dude.

But take what I posted with some consideration, you're better off saving a tad more and buying something better suited for what you want. The Behringer and Fender amps you listed are garbage and are not worth your time.


Guitar amps aren't designed to be able to run 2 guitars at once, buying two cheap amps is going to bite you on the ass in the long run. I can appreciate and respect you want to help your brother out, but I just don't want you to waste your money.

I appreciate that
I will take it into consideration because I don't want to be a joke on the stage. Maybe I'll not get the amp as good as I want, but I will try to get a decent one, that's for sure

Cheers
Perverockstar69
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#21
My LC15 gives good brit rock sound in small gigs, BTW, it's always good idea to mic your amp.

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lucky1978
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#22
I can get a clean(enough) tone outta my Rebel 20 while keeping up with drums and it's loud as fudge in a small bar. We're always mic'ed in a bar anyways though

I've seen a band where both guitarists used frontman 212's and it worked out well. Though they had good songs and that makes a world of difference. Maybe give those a try if you can find them cheap enough.
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#23
Quote by Eppicurt
Yeah, because they don't feel the same. Also, explain how it won't seem as powerful, you do understand how wattage works, don't you?
The wattage just is the rating of the max power before the power amp begins to clip, but that has nothing do do with what makes tubes sound louder. The method of both amplification and clipping causes our ears to perceive it as louder, which is why they slice through walls more.

Had to do a report on this crap earlier this year. I also have plenty experience of running a 100w tube amp into a 1x12 next to several 120w SS halfstacks. TS needs a tube amp.


The DSL honestly is your best bet. Plus you're in England so you should be able to get a Marshall for cheaper.
austinblair
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#24
Those drums are gunna be loud as you know what in a pub... I can hear my drum kit from about half a mile down the road...
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#25
Quote by austinblair
Those drums are gunna be loud as you know what in a pub... I can hear my drum kit from about half a mile down the road...

You must have very long arms.
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#26
Quote by GaryBillington
You must have very long arms.

Almost half a mile, eh?
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#28
Quote by lucky1978
I can get a clean(enough) tone outta my Rebel 20 while keeping up with drums and it's loud as fudge in a small bar. We're always mic'ed in a bar anyways though

I've seen a band where both guitarists used frontman 212's and it worked out well. Though they had good songs and that makes a world of difference. Maybe give those a try if you can find them cheap enough.


I don't know what it is, but my Vox AC15C1 is actually a match for my friend's frontman 212 when his clean volume and my master volume are matched. Now, my cleans have to be slightly hairy, but it matches.
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#29
In most pubs I find that the most that you usually need to mike up is the kick drum. Once the pub fills up the kick drum gets lost. Just tossing an SM57 inside the kick drum usually suffices.

If you don't need pristine cleans a 20W tube amp will easily get over most drummers. But it's no big deal, you just mike up the amp (you should be doing that anyway really) and organise hand signals with the sound guy so he knows when you are about to turn down so he can turn you up in the foldback and FoH.
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nazgulas
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#30
If I get a good amp head, does it matter what amp cab I use? Because I am pretty handy with wood and electronics so I could easily make one cabinet myself. Do you think this would lower the price for the gear I am looking for?
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#31
^ it matters what speakers you put in the cab, and it matters that you make the cab out of plywood. you can also make it open or closed back depending on your preferences.