Page 2 of 2
JustRooster
Professionally Crabby
Join date: Jan 2005
7,261 IQ
#41
The only reason we have lost music is because we never had the ability to record them. We still listen to every single style of music since the dawn of modern recording, and even some we don't in the classical world.

I don't think the guitar's going anywhere any time soon.

Quote by EyeNon15
Thats too bad, I was under the impression I was arguing something profound

LP1951
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2012
346 IQ
#42
Quote by KG6_Steven
Careful. If you want to get into a discussion of accidentals, the true definition of an accidental is a note that is not diatonic to a particular key. In the key of D, for example, F# and C# are not accidentals. They are diatonic notes to that key. In the key of G, an F would be considered an accidental. From what I've been told and what I've read, the black keys are simply referred to as "the black keys," while the white keys are simply referred to as "the white keys." To refer to the black keys as accidentals, is incorrect. I've been taking piano lessons for just over two years.


I would say so. To say that the black keys are accidental is tantamount to saying that the piano keyboard is accidental. An accidental is an off key note which is inserted in a melody sometimes accidentally or by a trained musician for nuance.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
Mephaphil
No empty frets.
Join date: Apr 2012
1,956 IQ
#43
Let's get back on track before it does become a discussion about theory.

With the garage rock/blues revival there's quite a few good rock n roll bands.

Jack Whites stuff, especially with the Raconteurs, the Black Keys, although a little samey and simple and a band I like a lot, Band of Skulls.

Will blues continue to be revived in such a way? It's cool, but how many times can it be unique? It's getting a little repetitive, which is annoying as it's my favourite genre.
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


Last edited by Mephaphil at Dec 29, 2012,
WholeLottaIzzy
UGs Only Rhythm Guitarist
Join date: Apr 2011
6,046 IQ
#44
There will always be guitar music. It's just such a versatile instrument you can put it in every genre of music. It's popularity just fluctuates that's all. I believe since Nirvana it's popularity fell but I am sure with the increase of games such as rocksmith and guitar hero, it's definitely on the rise. Guitar bands are doing very well lately. For Fighters are on top of their game, as are Muse. Bands like Mudford and Sons and Ben Howard also becoming very popular.
LP1951
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2012
346 IQ
#45
Quote by WholeLottaIzzy
There will always be guitar music. It's just such a versatile instrument you can put it in every genre of music. It's popularity just fluctuates that's all. I believe since Nirvana it's popularity fell but I am sure with the increase of games such as rocksmith and guitar hero, it's definitely on the rise. Guitar bands are doing very well lately. For Fighters are on top of their game, as are Muse. Bands like Mudford and Sons and Ben Howard also becoming very popular.


Definitely!

The Guitar is here to stay!
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
sashki
Join date: Feb 2005
6,833 IQ
#46
While I can see guitar music diminishing in popularity, I don't think it's going to disappear completely. The guitar, especially the electric variety, plays a huge role in the popular culture of the late 20th century. It has cemented its place in history, and is still used for new and innovative music today. It's not going anywhere.

I've noticed a recent revival in acoustic and "rootsy" blues-influenced electric guitar music. I think it provides a convenient alternative for people who aren't into the whole electronic thing. Acoustic folk music is pretty much the polar opposite of electropop and dubstep or whatever the kids listen to these days.
Quote by Mephaphil

Will blues continue to be revived in such a way? It's cool, but how many times can it be unique? It's getting a little repetitive, which is annoying as it's my favourite genre.

I'm no expert on blues, but I think many people adhere too rigidly to the standard 12-bar blues structure. However, that is not the only thing that defines the blues genre, and it's possible to move away from the structure while still making blues music.

Does that make any sense?
Last edited by sashki at Dec 29, 2012,
dannyalcatraz
Black Cherry Jello
Join date: Dec 2008
3,265 IQ
#47
People also forget or don't realize that, while its not necessarily the focal instrument, guitar keeps getting used in all kinds of electronica and rap, especially in compositions. Devo, for instance, always included the guitar work of Bob Mothersbaugh. Stetsasonic had a full band- not unlike the Roots or Outkast- on the rap side.

And it goes both ways- this year, both Korn and Muse released albums including elements from the latest electronic genre to rise to the top of the popularity mountain, namely dubstep/brostep.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!


alhaq369
It is very impotent to success a business.
Huge Guy
My muscles sure are mean!
Join date: Sep 2012
792 IQ
#48
Quote by Mephaphil
The Sax example should have been explained a bit better. In the 30's and 40's the Sax was pretty cool to play, like the electric guitar of the 60's. It was much more popular due to jazz being everywhere. But now, it's a select few and not many people outside of particular areas play it. Even in the 80's it would be identifiable on a lot of popular, radio played tracks. But now you'll hardly ever hear one, because music has changed drastically over the last couple of decades. It's not long for such a popular instrument to become nearly obsolete for commercial pop music.

When I have kids I'd love to be able to teach them the guitar and have them talk to me about the Clash and Rage Against the Machine etc as they get into the bands I got into when they get old enough, and I don't see indie or blues based garage rock becoming ancient anytime soon, but their kids? Will they look at my Gibson like one might look at a recorder, cool, but outdated in many forms of popular culture?


I don't know how old you are but I always see the yunguns on here talking about bands I liked when I was a kid; Megadeth, Metallica, heck even Zeppelin is still huge.
I have two kids now, ages 2 and 4. Really too young to learn but they love it when daddy takes out his 'tar (as the 2-year-old says)

I think we are going to see guitar more and more linked to computers and digital effects etc. Back in my day *cue old man voice* we did not have modelling amps, for example.

Maybe we'll see more types of new effects that can only be done on a computer (if they don't have these already.)
KG6_Steven
Eats ponies for breakfast
Join date: Nov 2006
3,163 IQ
#49
Quote by LP1951
Definitely!

The Guitar is here to stay!



We said the same thing about bulletin boards and modems back in the early 90s.

Change. It's a happening thing.
Huge Guy
My muscles sure are mean!
Join date: Sep 2012
792 IQ
#50
Quote by KG6_Steven
We said the same thing about bulletin boards and modems back in the early 90s.

Change. It's a happening thing.


Apples and oranges.
JustRooster
Professionally Crabby
Join date: Jan 2005
7,261 IQ
#51
Quote by Huge Guy
Apples and oranges.



I like plums.

Quote by EyeNon15
Thats too bad, I was under the impression I was arguing something profound

azrael4h
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2012
226 IQ
#52
Quote by Mephaphil
The Sax example should have been explained a bit better. In the 30's and 40's the Sax was pretty cool to play, like the electric guitar of the 60's. It was much more popular due to jazz being everywhere. But now, it's a select few and not many people outside of particular areas play it. Even in the 80's it would be identifiable on a lot of popular, radio played tracks. But now you'll hardly ever hear one, because music has changed drastically over the last couple of decades. It's not long for such a popular instrument to become nearly obsolete for commercial pop music.


On the other hand, I've noticed more and more new artists making use of fiddles/violins, mandolins, and even the occasional banjo in rock and pop (Bon Jovi has made use of a fiddle recently, Third Day has made extensive use of mandolin and banjo backing their usual Gibson electrics, Project 86 used mandolin and pipes, etc...). So while guitar may wane some, which is has in the past 60 years, that doesn't mean it'll come close to dying, and doesn't mean it won't come back later.
dannyalcatraz
Black Cherry Jello
Join date: Dec 2008
3,265 IQ
#53
Quote by azrael4h
On the other hand, I've noticed more and more new artists making use of fiddles/violins, mandolins, and even the occasional banjo in rock and pop (Bon Jovi has made use of a fiddle recently, Third Day has made extensive use of mandolin and banjo backing their usual Gibson electrics, Project 86 used mandolin and pipes, etc...). So while guitar may wane some, which is has in the past 60 years, that doesn't mean it'll come close to dying, and doesn't mean it won't come back later.

On a recent Later...with Jools Holland, Public Image Limited played 3 songs. The lead guitarist- Lu Edmonds- used a Tele on one song, but used a bazouki on the other two.

Let me say that the bazouki with guitar effects was unearthly...

(but so was his Tele)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fV-z07K0lz8&sns=em
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!


alhaq369
It is very impotent to success a business.
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Dec 29, 2012,
MaggaraMarine
Slapping the bass.
Join date: Oct 2009
3,484 IQ
#54
Guitar has been used in classical and folk music for a long time. And you can't play rock music without that dirty electric guitar sound. I'm not sure if people will listen to rock music that much in the future. But people still listen to over 300 years old classical music so why not? Pop music might become more electronic and people might not use real instruments that much any more in the future. But I'm sure people will listen to old music like we listen to old music today.

But as somebody said, with guitar you can play many notes at the same time so it's a versatile instrument. People still play saxophone and all the other instruments even though they aren't used in pop music that much. They are still used in jazz and classical and lots of music has been written for them.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
LP1951
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2012
346 IQ
#55
Quote by MaggaraMarine
Guitar has been used in classical and folk music for a long time. And you can't play rock music without that dirty electric guitar sound. I'm not sure if people will listen to rock music that much in the future. But people still listen to over 300 years old classical music so why not?

But as somebody said, with guitar you can play many notes at the same time so it's a versatile instrument...


Exactly.

The guitar like the piano is polyphonic. It is silly to compare a guitar to a sax. (Incidentally I used to play sax.) A better comparison is guitar to other polyphonic stringed instruments: sitar, banjo, koto, harp, bouzouki (which is just another name for a mandola), mandolin or mandola.

I play electric and acoustic mandolin and mandolas. I love those instruments. The are smaller and even more easily portable than guitars, but the guitar is much more versatile and better suited for composing.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
Last edited by LP1951 at Dec 30, 2012,
Mephaphil
No empty frets.
Join date: Apr 2012
1,956 IQ
#56
Quote by Huge Guy
I don't know how old you are


I'm late 20's.

Quote by LP1951
The guitar like the piano is polyphonic. It is silly to compare a guitar to a sax. (Incidentally I used to play sax.) A better comparison is guitar to other polyphonic stringed instruments: sitar, banjo, kyoto, harp, bouzouki (which is just another name for a mandola), mandolin or mandola.


No one compared the guitar to the sax. The popularity was compared, the influence in popular culture was compared, not the instrument. It's silly to not realise that. Comparing a sitar to the guitar in popular music would be ridiculous, and wouldn't make any sense to the argument which is; the sax was big, it ain't big now, could the guitar be forgotten? If you then want to talk about the instrument being generally more accessible that's cool and relevant, but no one said they were similar instruments in any way.
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


LP1951
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2012
346 IQ
#57
Quote by dannyalcatraz
On a recent Later...with Jools Holland, Public Image Limited played 3 songs. The lead guitarist- Lu Edmonds- used a Tele on one song, but used a bazouki on the other two.

Let me say that the bazouki with guitar effects was unearthly...

(but so was his Tele)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fV-z07K0lz8&sns=em


A bazouki (mandola) is a fun instrument to play. Like a guitar you can do bends and finger pick. I found that it was relatively easy instrument to learn to play. A whole lot easier than a sitar or a banjo.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
LP1951
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2012
346 IQ
#58
Quote by azrael4h
On the other hand, I've noticed more and more new artists making use of fiddles/violins, mandolins, and even the occasional banjo in rock and pop (Bon Jovi has made use of a fiddle recently, Third Day has made extensive use of mandolin and banjo backing their usual Gibson electrics, Project 86 used mandolin and pipes, etc...)...


I've always loved the sound of mandolins. Jimmy Page and John Paul Jones put mandolins to great use with Led Zeppelin in the 70s. Others bands used violins in the 60s and 70s and of course Dave Matthews band uses a violin extensively. But the guitar was always and still is the most prominent stringed instrument used in popular music.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
Mephaphil
No empty frets.
Join date: Apr 2012
1,956 IQ
#59
The latest Maccabees album; Given to the Wild is really awesome. Very cinematic. It's completely dominated by orchestral instruments, with Sax's all over the place.

Really great album.
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


LP1951
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2012
346 IQ
#60
...It's completely dominated by orchestral instruments, with Sax's all over the place...QUOTE]

The sax is not an orchestral instrument. It was invented in 1846 after all the greatest orchestral composers were dead.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
Mephaphil
No empty frets.
Join date: Apr 2012
1,956 IQ
#61
Quote by Mephaphil
...It's completely dominated by orchestral instruments, with Sax's all over the place...QUOTE]

The sax is not an orchestral instrument. It was invented in 1846 after all the greatest orchestral composers were dead.


I never said that it was. 'With' after the comma meaning accompanied by.
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


Last edited by Mephaphil at Dec 30, 2012,
beau05
UG Senior Member
Join date: Jul 2005
451 IQ
#62
If you look closely, our entire society is a cluster-f*ck conglomerate of various types of music lovers

Its most likely happened because information is so accessible these days. Kids can pick a decade out of the last 100 years and pretend like its 1984 right in the middle of the Bay area thrash scene (know me, before you judge me).

I wouldn't say there's a popular "trend", the landscape doesn't change like it used to. We no longer just get our musical needs from the local record store or the local pop radio station, its like a Doctor Who episode I watched where there was a single point in time where every thing that had ever happened, was happening all at once (Winston Churchill, in a pyramid, being raided by a SWAT team), thats exactly how I see the music scene

I don't think there will ever be another massive shift like there has been (maybe small ones, but not big), kids will just make whatever they like, regardless of the current trends
Mephaphil
No empty frets.
Join date: Apr 2012
1,956 IQ
#63
Quote by beau05
its like a Doctor Who episode I watched where there was a single point in time where every thing that had ever happened, was happening all at once (Winston Churchill, in a pyramid, being raided by a SWAT team), thats exactly how I see the music scene.


Epic!
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


beau05
UG Senior Member
Join date: Jul 2005
451 IQ
#64
Quote by Mephaphil
Epic!


Haha it was! Funnily (more sadly), it was the first ever time I've watched a Doctor Who episode, now I'm hooked
HomerSGR
What?
Join date: Feb 2008
1,012 IQ
#65
Quote by beau05
If you look closely, our entire society is a cluster-f*ck conglomerate of various types of music lovers

Its most likely happened because information is so accessible these days. Kids can pick a decade out of the last 100 years and pretend like its 1984 right in the middle of the Bay area thrash scene (know me, before you judge me).

I wouldn't say there's a popular "trend", the landscape doesn't change like it used to. We no longer just get our musical needs from the local record store or the local pop radio station, its like a Doctor Who episode I watched where there was a single point in time where every thing that had ever happened, was happening all at once (Winston Churchill, in a pyramid, being raided by a SWAT team), thats exactly how I see the music scene

I don't think there will ever be another massive shift like there has been (maybe small ones, but not big), kids will just make whatever they like, regardless of the current trends


A very good post. I absolutely believe in this, but there's also still the mainstream. Currently, I see Iron Maiden, Swedish House Mafia and Bruce Springsteen selling out the new (huge) indoor Friends Arena in Stockholm, Sweden. That is three very different acts, two of them is guitar based while one is not. And while these are different, there is not room for too many of these vastly popular acts - in a city of around 1 500 000 people in a country with a population of just 9,5 million, you can't expect to sell out an arena with a capacity of 65 000 people every day of the year.

And so, there is not room for every kind of music.
"Your signature can not be longer than 250 characters."

How you know you have too many guitars...

Apparently once also known as PonyFan #834553.
beau05
UG Senior Member
Join date: Jul 2005
451 IQ
#66
Quote by HomerSGR
A very good post. I absolutely believe in this, but there's also still the mainstream. Currently, I see Iron Maiden, Swedish House Mafia and Bruce Springsteen selling out the new (huge) indoor Friends Arena in Stockholm, Sweden. That is three very different acts, two of them is guitar based while one is not. And while these are different, there is not room for too many of these vastly popular acts - in a city of around 1 500 000 people in a country with a population of just 9,5 million, you can't expect to sell out an arena with a capacity of 65 000 people every day of the year.

And so, there is not room for every kind of music.


Yeah that is a problem, here in New Zealand its a lot worse. Iron Maiden came here about 20 years ago and played to a crowd of 7,000 (yes, that's all), and a few years ago it went up to about 14,000, mind you the NZ music scene (in "pop" terms) revolves around hip hop, trance/dubstep, American based pop, and Gangnam style

I guess there'll always be those big guitar driven rock/metal bands that'll carry the flag so to speak, but we're at a stage where it'll never completely die off.

My suggestion? Have kids and teach them the ways of the axe! (guitar, not sax haha, but to each their own)
LP1951
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2012
346 IQ
#67
Quote by LP1951


I never said that it was...


It is very hard to understand exactly what you are trying to say. First, you try to compare the Guitar, a polyphonic stringed instrument, to the sax, a monophonic brass instrument. Then, you say that the piano keyboard design is accidental. Then, you say that the sax which was invented in 1846 is an orchestral instrument. And then you compare Electric Guitars to Toyota Cars which make no sense whatsoever. It appears that you throw it up against the wall with your posts hoping something sticks and when others call you on your mistakes you try to play a game of semantics and claim your mistakes are simply grammatical errors.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
Last edited by LP1951 at Dec 30, 2012,
Mephaphil
No empty frets.
Join date: Apr 2012
1,956 IQ
#68
Quote by Mephaphil


It is very hard to understand exactly what you are trying to say. First, you try to compare the Guitar, a polyphonic stringed instrument, to the sax, a monophonic brass instrument. Then, you say that the piano keyboard design is accidental. Then, you say that the sax which was invented in 1846 is an orchestral instrument. And then you compare Electric Guitars to Toyota Cars which make no sense whatsoever. It appears that you throw it up against the wall with your posts hoping something sticks and when others call you on your mistakes you try to play a game of semantics and claim your mistakes are simply grammatical errors.


Wtf?

You don't quite get the quote system do you.

I never compared the sax to guitar. I compared it's prevalence in popular culture in the 30's to the prevalence in popular culture of the guitar today, and asked if corporation dominance and the media will stop its decline in the future if/as tastes and music change/evolve. This is the third time I've had to explain this to you. It's not about this instrument vs that instrument. It's about its dominance of X instrument then to dominance now of X instrument.

I never brought up the Toyota comparison. I mean, really.

I never said the piano design was accidental lol. I called the black keys ACCIDENTALS, like a sharp occurring in the C major scale. A mistake which I held my hands up to. I think you misunderstood completely.

I never claimed the Sax was an orchestral instrument, I said the album has loads of orchestral instruments in it, with sax's all over the place. So, perhaps you took another meaning, but I just meant there's violins and cellos AND sax's in abundance on the album. I know what I meant, that's all that matters. I don't think it's that hard to read it from my perspective, perhaps my wording was slightly ambiguous, PERHAPS, but I explained myself.

We're having a nice discussion here and you come trolling in with false accusations, telling me I said things I never did.

If I am wrong I hold my hands up, I don't argue or have arguments here. You are mistaken. Please stop being so confrontational.
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


Last edited by Mephaphil at Dec 30, 2012,
JustRooster
Professionally Crabby
Join date: Jan 2005
7,261 IQ
#69
The summary of this thread is that guitar music will be around, just like many instruments before it are still around.


Also, the Sax is still wildly popular. How is that even a discussion? Anyone who doesn't think the Sax is still big obviously doesn't venture outside of their genre very much.

Quote by EyeNon15
Thats too bad, I was under the impression I was arguing something profound

Last edited by JustRooster at Dec 31, 2012,