tall011
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2013
369 IQ
#1
So I'm going to do this...

[forbidden link]

...but what should i focus on after i got it all down/what's the next step/how do i apply the knowledge ya know? i don't want to just memorize it and then not put it to full use ya know?

What are all the door this could open?

Bonus question (i'd love to know): what doors isn't this opening?
tall011
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2013
369 IQ
#2
ok so that [forbidden link] was just a website teaching how to "memorizing the fingerboard" in 16 days or w/e it seems pretty legit.

you can google Learn The Guitar Fingerboard Thoroughly in 16 Days if you want to find the article i'm talking about
Junior#1
Is SouTaicho Yamamoto-san
Join date: Oct 2007
238 IQ
#3
Quote by tall011
ok so that [forbidden link] was just a website teaching how to "memorizing the fingerboard" in 16 days or w/e it seems pretty legit.

you can google Learn The Guitar Fingerboard Thoroughly in 16 Days if you want to find the article i'm talking about

Memorizing the fretboard in 16 days seems anything but legit.

Get fretboard warrior. It's a free download and is really helpful.

Learning the fretboard will make basically everything easier, especially when coupled with a good understanding of theory. You won't need to think about where the notes are and where to go, you will just know. Plus naming chords will be a piece of cake. It will basically help you out with every aspect of theory, but obviously you will still need to practice in order to improve your technique.
Quote by Geldin
Junior's usually at least a little terse, but he knows his stuff. I've always read his posts in a grouchy grandfather voice, a grouchy grandfather with a huge stiffy for alternate picking.
Besides that, he's right this time. As usual.
crazysam23_Atax
Feuergesicht
Join date: Oct 2009
5,710 IQ
#4
@Junior:
He's probably an adbot, which is why his links didn't work. New users can't post links, because the adbots were getting atrocious.
cdgraves
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Join date: Jan 2013
43 IQ
#6
Nobody needs outside sources to learn the fretboard. Each fret is a half step. Do the math yourself.
tall011
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2013
369 IQ
#7
Quote by cdgraves
Nobody needs outside sources to learn the fretboard. Each fret is a half step. Do the math yourself.


got it, but my main question is like what's the next step? once i learn it how's that helpful? i'm asking cause i read like "oh yeah once i learned the fretboard it took my guitar to the next level".... but i've got this vision of myself memorizing the shit out of the fretboard and then like ya know? not knowing what to do with all those memorized notes and shit? i would love sum1 to point me in the right direction if u know kind of what i'm asking?
tall011
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2013
369 IQ
#8
Quote by Junior#1
Memorizing the fretboard in 16 days seems anything but legit.

Get fretboard warrior. It's a free download and is really helpful.

Learning the fretboard will make basically everything easier, especially when coupled with a good understanding of theory. You won't need to think about where the notes are and where to go, you will just know. Plus naming chords will be a piece of cake. It will basically help you out with every aspect of theory, but obviously you will still need to practice in order to improve your technique.


- what theory should i learn after i have like the very very basics...
- what good is "knowing where to go"......
- I don't see how naming chords will become a piece of cake
- what good is just naming chords (seriouslyy... i don't get it)

lol like sorry... what you said really WAS helpful! and i'm sorry if it sounds like i'm asking stupid questions i would just like to understand this thoroughly as possible. I can't stand not getting better (just strumming chords)/ not having something new to think about and practice
evolucian
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2008
682 IQ
#9
Once you know the fretboard... you don't have to think that much anymore and have more time to drool while playing a solo.

On the bright side, you'll know where every note is, how the next note will affect the current progression (once the relevant theory is learned), and it'll also help in getting laid. <---- That right there should be the #1 answer to learning anything correctly. Even rocket scientists get laid (cos they know shit).
Last edited by evolucian at Apr 3, 2013,
ArtistLion
Registered User
Join date: Oct 2012
818 IQ
#10
helps with transcribing songs, making your own chords, making your own arpeggios and making your own riffs
tall011
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2013
369 IQ
#11
"Combining music theory (understanding scales, modes, chord structure, improvising over chord progressions, etc, etc.) and knowing all the notes on the fingerboard will open up a whole new world."

Somebody want to help me with all the shit up there that's in parenthesis. like explain how to approach going about learning all that shit. like some links to some site that will teach that shit would be helpful or books or something ya know. like some step by step instructions for all that shit. that would be much appreciated thank you all

ill look it up myself if i have to, but if you anybody has any good recommendations i'd love to check it out. Fretboard warrior was actually a great suggestion.
Last edited by tall011 at Apr 3, 2013,
Ignore
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Join date: Jul 2012
799 IQ
#13
Just learn all that shit, All that shit up there, that shit in parenthesis.

No seriously just learn it. I found it not too hard to learn, ofcourse it will take time. But most of all it takes dedication and discipline, there's no app that's gonna help you with that.
GuitarLogic
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Join date: Jan 2011
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#14
I'm sorry, but OP seems like a bit of a troll. I apologize if that is not the case.

But anyways. You could think of it this way; Imagine not knowing what letter each key on the keyboard(a typing keyboard, not a piano) represents. Now imagine trying to write a coherent paragraph that way (and no, there's no back space).

I hope that analogy wasn't too confusing.
"Reality is merely an illusion albeit a very persistent one"
- Albert Einstein


My Soundcloud: link
Last edited by GuitarLogic at Apr 4, 2013,
20Tigers
1
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640 IQ
#15
Quote by GuitarLogic
I'm sorry, but OP seems like a bit of a troll. I apologize if that is not the case.

But anyways. You could think of it this way; Imagine not knowing what letter each key on the keyboard(a typing keyboard, not a piano) represents. Now imagine trying to write a coherent paragraph that way (and no, there's no back space).

I hope that analogy wasn't too confusing.

The analogy is not confusing but it is not accurate.

On a keyboard(typing) you must know the letters so that you can string them together to form words and communicate ideas. So knowing the letter of each key is pretty important. On the fretboard you are trying to string together SOUNDS (not letters or note names) to form musical ideas.

Someone can know the sounds their instrument makes and not know any of the notes of the fretboard. They will be much better equipped to express their musical ideas than someone that learns the notes of the fretboard in 16 days but doesn't really know the sounds those notes represent.

OP,
Learn the fretboard notes it is helpful to know. But don't get too excited about that being the key to expressing yourself with complete musical freedom. Learning all the chords being able to spell them etc etc also does not allow you musical freedom on your instrument. But they are useful to know. Spend time listening, singing, practicing, and playing music.

Knowing C to F is a perfect fourth is one thing and it is a good thing to know, HEARING a C and F and knowing it is a perfect fourth is MUCH more beneficial. HEARING a pitch and being able to sing, or play a perfect fourth above it is even more beneficial.
Si
GuitarMunky
I play guitar n stuff
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#16
Quote by 20Tigers
\

Someone can know the sounds their instrument makes and not know any of the notes of the fretboard. They will be much better equipped to express their musical ideas than someone that learns the notes of the fretboard in 16 days but doesn't really know the sounds those notes represent.



This
tall011
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2013
369 IQ
#17
@20tigers, i appreciate the thoughtful reply. You said "spend time listening, singing, practicing, and playing music," but do you have any advice on how to practice my "hearing"? any pointers at all (more or less) would be appreciated
HotspurJr
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2011
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#18
Quote by tall011
@20tigers, i appreciate the thoughtful reply. You said "spend time listening, singing, practicing, and playing music," but do you have any advice on how to practice my "hearing"? any pointers at all (more or less) would be appreciated


You have to consciously make a point to develop your ear.

I recommend using the functional ear trainer, a free download from miles.be. Did wonders for me.

You should also practice transcribing. Start with simple melodies that you know by heart, and try to play them on your guitar.

This will be slow and crazy frustrating at first. Keep at it.
sweetdude3000
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Join date: Mar 2012
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#19
I think I see what the TS is saying. What is the point of knowing where each note is on the finger board in a split second. It is easy to find them by reference if you know your octaves and the tuning in fourths to find the patterns. I think it makes sense for the 5th and 6th strings for barre chords but not sure about knowing all the notes by heart. That took some time to get there. Maybe if you are changing keys a lot and you need to know where the tonic notes are located on the fly? Do people really think in a middle of a solo, okay I need this Bb note to form a major seventh chord. I think it makes sense to know how to find your shapes in patterns in advance, practice those, instead of doing it on the fly. Anyway Hotspur Jr's advice is sound, know the sounds as well as the theory side.
mdc
UG's Mr Chord Man
Join date: Feb 2008
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#20
Quote by tall011
@20tigers, i appreciate the thoughtful reply. You said "spend time listening, singing, practicing, and playing music," but do you have any advice on how to practice my "hearing"? any pointers at all (more or less) would be appreciated

Just to reiterate, learning the notes on the fretboard is absolutely pointless. That's the equivalent of memorizing the alphabet, but not knowing how to use the letters, in other words, not knowing how to SPELL.

SOUND. Intervals, relative pitch training, melodic first, then harmonic, then the six different types of triads, then all the 7th chords, the all the 9th chords and further extensions.

If you were in college, they'd have you trained up in all of that within a year. So, there's your benchmark, a year.
sweetdude3000
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Join date: Mar 2012
1,172 IQ
#21
Quote by tall011
"Combining music theory (understanding scales, modes, chord structure, improvising over chord progressions, etc, etc.) and knowing all the notes on the fingerboard will open up a whole new world."

Somebody want to help me with all the shit up there that's in parenthesis. like explain how to approach going about learning all that shit. like some links to some site that will teach that shit would be helpful or books or something ya know. like some step by step instructions for all that shit. that would be much appreciated thank you all

ill look it up myself if i have to, but if you anybody has any good recommendations i'd love to check it out. Fretboard warrior was actually a great suggestion.


Get Creative Guitar books by Guthrie Govan and also I'd recommend a Tagliano or Kolb book for soloing. There is a lot of misleading stuff on the net. Those books are cheap and will last you years of time to master all of that.
HotspurJr
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Join date: Jul 2011
191 IQ
#22
[quote="sweetdude3000}. Maybe if you are changing keys a lot and you need to know where the tonic notes are located on the fly? Do people really think in a middle of a solo, okay I need this Bb note to form a major seventh chord. I think it makes sense to know how to find your shapes in patterns in advance, practice those, instead of doing it on the fly. .[/QUOTE"]

I think knowing all the notes is obviously less important that knowing the notes on the two low strings, but you know what?

I think there is an advantage to it. How could there not be?

It's not that hard to learn, although you have to put a little bit of time into it. (5 minutes a day, maybe, for a few weeks). But do you really think there's no advantage?

I wonder why people are always looking for reasons NOT to know stuff. You want to get good at this, soak up everything. No, I wouldn't necessarily put memorizing the fretboard above basic theory or ear training, but as one of those things worth putting a little time in, what's the argument against it?

Certainly any time you're playing with other musicians it's potentially useful. "Go to C# after 4 ..." you don't want to have to stop and think about what you're doing, do you?
Last edited by HotspurJr at Apr 7, 2013,
20Tigers
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#23
Quote by mdc
Just to reiterate, learning the notes on the fretboard is absolutely pointless. That's the equivalent of memorizing the alphabet, but not knowing how to use the letters, in other words, not knowing how to SPELL.

SOUND. Intervals, relative pitch training, melodic first, then harmonic, then the six different types of triads, then all the 7th chords, the all the 9th chords and further extensions.

If you were in college, they'd have you trained up in all of that within a year. So, there's your benchmark, a year.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that learning the notes on the fretboard is "absolutely pointless"
Si
mdc
UG's Mr Chord Man
Join date: Feb 2008
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#24
They're useful for building chords. But a interval's an interval. TS should be able to recognize a major 6th when he hears one. I don't care whether it's F up to D, C up to A, E down to G, or B down to D.
sweetdude3000
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#25
Quote by HotspurJr

I wonder why people are always looking for reasons NOT to know stuff. You want to get good at this, soak up everything. No, I wouldn't necessarily put memorizing the fretboard above basic theory or ear training, but as one of those things worth putting a little time in, what's the argument against it?


Time is a limited commodity. People analyze things on a cost/benefit basis depending on their level of playing at the moment. I think there ought to be a list of priorities out there for a guitar player for well-rounded development based on their style. I would have never considered interval training useful until I read about it. I wouldn't have bothered learning the modes until I developed more of my basic skills. And it's extremely difficult to learn something unless you have a useful application for it, otherwise it won't stick.
20Tigers
1
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#26
^but you can do this at the same time as you do other things. Study intervals & learn note names at the same time. Do ear training and learn the note names at the same time. So the time factor isn't necesarily a factor...but then again I suppose it is if you are going to dedicate a specific amount of time each day with your goal being to learn them all in 16 days.

One clear and definite benefit to knowing the note names is that it allows you to read sheet music. You can not read sheet music without knowing where to find the notes on the fretboard. Of course reading sheet music is not important to a lot of guitarists - but just saying.
Si
Vlasco
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Join date: Jun 2007
121 IQ
#27
Quote by mdc
They're useful for building chords. But a interval's an interval. TS should be able to recognize a major 6th when he hears one. I don't care whether it's F up to D, C up to A, E down to G, or B down to D.



I agree that intervals are important and that the TS should be able to recognise them. However, I do care if it's an F to a D or a C to an A. I don't understand how knowing where the notes are is pointless is anyway.
mdc
UG's Mr Chord Man
Join date: Feb 2008
722 IQ
#28
I'm being a cunt, dude. Of course there is some use in it. Like for reading gigs, really, really ****ing useful.

But for the sake of improvising, if players have a picture of a steady stream of notes of the musical alphabet whizzing through their mind's eye whilst improvising, then they're absolutely off this ****ing planet.

It's just a combination of muscle memory and sound (interval) recognition when it comes to improvising.

Edit: About the sight reading, at a high level, they're not even thinking about the notes, it's just the pattern and contour, and then they instinctively know how to play it, and sight sing it, cuz they've done it so much.

You should agree with that, you play violin.
Last edited by mdc at Apr 9, 2013,
Vlasco
Registered User
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121 IQ
#29
Thinking about every single note is extreme, and you're only talking about one situation. Conversely, even at a high level, people recenter their placement from time to time by knowing their notes while reading - though yes, it is mostly pattern recognition. It would be nearly as ridiculous to maintain an entire piece with only interval and contour recognition.
20Tigers
1
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#30
Quote by mdc
I'm being a cunAbout the sight reading, at a high level, they're not even thinking about the notes, it's just the pattern and contour, and then they instinctively know how to play it, and sight sing it, cuz they've done it so much.

You should agree with that, you play violin.
It's completely irrelevant though.
Regardless of how the pros do it if you want to learn to sight read you must learn the notes on your instrument.
Si
GuitarLogic
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#31
Quote by 20Tigers
The analogy is not confusing but it is not accurate.


You're right. I'm sorry, I couldn't come up with anything better at the moment.
"Reality is merely an illusion albeit a very persistent one"
- Albert Einstein


My Soundcloud: link