ikey_
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Join date: Dec 2009
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#1
Ok y'all, time for a new guitar. have a mega gas and i need some good advice. i have almost 100% settled on a double cut, PRS body style with 24 frets. i am going to outline the basis for this, must haves, and things i dont want!

price range maxing out at about 1600. will consider slightly more if worth it. by slightly i mean like 1800.

3 guitars that catch my eye are a carvin CT624 or CT424, used PRS johnny hiland, used PRS ce24. . If anybody has experience with these models please share.

- i want a double cut preferably carved top with nice finish options. looks comfort, etc.

- i want 24 frets to make getting to the 22nd fret easier! stay away neck heel! also, i would like to see how it makes the neck pup sound

- i would prefer good switching options and versatility, and GREAT build quality

- coil tapping options and or a SSH setup, HSH will be considered

Must haves:
locking tuners
1 volume knob!
good upper fret access!
24 frets

would likes:
25 inch scale
carved top
good woods, color and hardware options
stainless frets
tunomatic bridge, string thru body is a plus
strap locks
birdseye maple fretboard
body binding
body contours

will NOT have:

a floyd or a wilkinson
2 volume knobs
a rosewood fretboard
super small frets
single cut or poor upper fret access

i will play anything from jazz to hard rock / classic metal. i want smooth and sexy, bard and growl, spank, blues, and higher gain bite all in one guitar or the closest thing to it. i realize i may have to upgrade pups or make modifications.

i plan to use pedals, coil tapping etc, a volume knob, and a ebony / maple board to get all the pop, gain manipulations and response, and tonal changes i can out of one guitar through my versatile amp.

my primary genre is rock / blues

Thanks,

/Ikey_
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
sea`
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#2
I think Carvins are 25.5 inch scale, not 25 inch.

The Carvin is better bang for your buck new (unbeatable in my opinion) but the used PRS, if in good condition, will probably be more what you want. I think Carvin are comparable to PRS most of the time, but PRS does have slightly better attention to detail and consistency.
ikey_
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#3
nope, the bolt on carvins are 25.5, the rest at 25.

not meant to be a carvin vs prs, but it just so happens those two brands fit my needs well. if there are other brands that make such models i am very eager to know.

i can definitely buy used PRS CE24s off guitar center website for like 900-1300. tempting.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
Tom 1.0
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#4
PRS all day every day.

I like Carvin but both those PRS models are superb.
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dspellman
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#5
Quote by sea`
I think Carvins are 25.5 inch scale, not 25 inch.


Nope. Carvins are 25" scale unless it's a bolt neck or a Holdsworth. Attention to detail on them has really been good (you don't get birds and moons, however). I've got half a dozen guitars and one bass from them. All are 24-fret.
Last edited by dspellman at Jul 8, 2013,
Mister A.J.
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#6
Quote by dspellman
Nope. Carvins are 25" scale unless it's a bolt neck or a Holdsworth. Attention to detail on them has really been good (you don't get birds and moons, however). I've got half a dozen guitars and one bass from them. All are 24-fret.

And the DC800 is a 27" and I think the CT7s are 25.5".


Personally, I'd go Carvin. The only gripe on mine was a misspelling of my name on the truss rod cover, but they were more than happy to fix it for free. The guys there are great, to say the least.
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Last edited by Mister A.J. at Jul 8, 2013,
sea`
Registered User
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#7
Quote by dspellman
Nope. Carvins are 25" scale unless it's a bolt neck or a Holdsworth. Attention to detail on them has really been good (you don't get birds and moons, however). I've got half a dozen guitars and one bass from them. All are 24-fret.

My bad, you're quite right. I have a DC700 and it's 25.5 however.
dspellman
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#9
Quote by sea`
My bad, you're quite right. I have a DC700 and it's 25.5 however.


Yup, that's another exception.
Actually I have an unusual one. It's a neck-through DC-145 that was built with a 25.5" scale. They tried this ONE year (1991) and were so unsuccessful with it at the time (their clientele was all about 24-fret 24.75" shredder guitars) that they dumped the idea and have steadfastly refused to revisit it ever since (it's a family owned business and they have a long memory). I think it would probably be quite successful now, and I'd love to get a backup for this particular guitar (it's solid koa), but so far...can't.
ikey_
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#10
hoe about a parker maxxfly?
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
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(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
LP_CL
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#11
Resale value of the prs is much higher. Just throwing this in...
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FatalGear41
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#12
It sounds like you are describing the Carvin CT624 guitar. It has 24 frets, one volume knob and one tone knob, a 25" scale, no tremolo unless you want one, your choice of fret size and shape (as well as regular nickel-silver or stainless steel) and custom options to die for. The build quality is second to none.

http://www.carvinguitars.com/catalog/guitars/ct624

Go for it! They're great guitars!
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ikey_
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#13
correct. i am fairly certain i will buy a carvin ct624 but i want to do my dilligence.

for the record, i called a local shop with a credit card ready to buy a PRS johnny hiland with a case for 1400 bucks but it just solf 3 hours before i called.

i would buy it, if i didnt like it i would flip it for 1200-1400 and then still buy the carvin. a win win. unfortunately, not possible. i could still get a hiland for that price, but really, i dislike the idea or ordering a PRS i cannot see, have it shipped etc, etc, and go through hassle. This was right down the road.

and honestly, i trust carvin. if nothing else, i may buy PRS pups and put it in the carvin. also, the carivn woods absolutely murder PRS woods (unless a 10 top).

again, this is not supposed to be a verse thread, i actually would like suggestions for PRS style guitar builders. DO NOT SAY ED ROMAN. i dont trust him.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
ikey_
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#14
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
Robbgnarly
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#15
I don't like the way they carve the top on the S2, it looks ugly when compared to the CE/CU/STD models.


And carvins are nice, but I'd rather have the PRS CE
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dannyalcatraz
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#17
Beyond Carvin, you might check out Jon Kammerer guitars. His standard, customizable model guitars start at $1500; customs start at $1750.

http://jonkammerercustoms.com/newsite1_003.htm

I own 5 myself, so consider me biased.
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Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Jul 10, 2013,
dspellman
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#18
Quote by ikey_


again, this is not supposed to be a verse thread, i actually would like suggestions for PRS style guitar builders. DO NOT SAY ED ROMAN. i dont trust him.


Ed's dead.
Tom 1.0
Hot For Teacher
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#19
Just buy a PRS.

Buying one unseen is no greater risk than buying a Carvin.

Don't forget at least the PRs will retain some residual value.
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ikey_
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#20
there really is no less risk buying a used PRS from GC then buying from carvin considering both return policies. for the record, i would own a PRS right now buy my local store sold it....

i would still like to take suggestions for brands / custom builders. if not, im 99% sure im getting a carvin.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
ikey_
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#21
i really can't decide between 24 and 22 frets, this is becoming a show stopper for me. really dont know.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
Robbgnarly
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#22
Do you really play on the 23rd or 24th frets? I have found that a 21-22 fret guitar is just fine for my style of playing
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2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
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ikey_
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#23
that decision is based on geting better access around teh 12-22 frets without the neck heel becoming involved. it seems to me like even around the 19th frets (fairly common in a lot of solos) on a 24 fretter seems to feel more like the rest of the neck, rather than the thick feeling you get when you start getting up around the heel.

also, i realize it may brighten up the tone a tad, which i was interested to experiment with.

however, if my playing style is not going to fit the instrument if a 24 fretter, then i wont get it. really it has nothing to do with hitting hi notes or shredding. at all.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
icronic
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#24
Quote by ikey_
that decision is based on geting better access around teh 12-22 frets without the neck heel becoming involved. it seems to me like even around the 19th frets (fairly common in a lot of solos) on a 24 fretter seems to feel more like the rest of the neck, rather than the thick feeling you get when you start getting up around the heel.


I've got a Carvin CS6 Single cut with only 22 frets and I can get to the 22 fret on that with no real trouble, so honestly I think you'd be fine with a plain old CS6.

Personally, I think you get a loy more bang for your buck with Carvin, I'd say a $3800 PRS Custom 24 is maybe 10-15% better than my $1800 Carin CS6. Plus having a custom guitar is a very nice thing indeed.

That said, the resale on a Carvin is terrible. I mean really terrible. There are also a lot of complaints about the electronics and pickups. Personally I'm happy with the pickups, I find they're quite unique sounding. Almost round and slightly compressed. I've also heard that if you want to upgrade pots you have to do some routing.
Robbgnarly
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#25
Quote by icronic
I've got a Carvin CS6 Single cut with only 22 frets and I can get to the 22 fret on that with no real trouble, so honestly I think you'd be fine with a plain old CS6.

Personally, I think you get a loy more bang for your buck with Carvin, I'd say a $3800 PRS Custom 24 is maybe 10-15% better than my $1800 Carin CS6. Plus having a custom guitar is a very nice thing indeed.

That said, the resale on a Carvin is terrible. I mean really terrible. There are also a lot of complaints about the electronics and pickups. Personally I'm happy with the pickups, I find they're quite unique sounding. Almost round and slightly compressed. I've also heard that if you want to upgrade pots you have to do some routing.

Carvins are deff nice guitars, but PRS is better in every way IMO. Carvin pickups are horrid at best.

PRS will also hold its value much better. Buy a $2000 Carvin and you migh get $800 resale if your lucky. Buy a$2000 PRS and you will get $1300+ on resale( just something to consider). I paid $1425 for my PRS CE22 new and I can get $1100 any day for it used 10+ yrs later
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2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
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Morley Bad Horsie 2
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ikey_
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#26
well ive considered all of this. i have made an attempt to buy a johnny hiland and it was sold.

i am just too darn picky to buy without trying and buy guitar center used (best shot at a PRS) is meh and i am too picky to buy a cookie cutter PRS. for example, i picked up a PRS McCarty and absoutely hated the finish on the neck and the bridge. stunning guitar though.

yes, i could sell the prs for what i buy it for, the carvin will chop about 40% off immeidately. i get it. i have made the decision to buy a car vin in the following finish or close to it



this took my 3 hours. literally. i got home at 6, and i didnt order my carvin cause as of 9:15 PM after they closed, i was still undecided on color. literally 3 hrs and 15 min. ive seen every carvin made at this point.

i was on the fence about 24 frets. i decided if i get it and i dislike the color or 24 frets, i will return it in 10 days and buy a 22 fret in a different color.

i also was back and forth on the tone change of a 24 fret neck pickup. then i listened to santana. i realize his guitar, amp etc, is different and his playing is god, but dammit dont tell me you can't get a smooth rich tone out of a 24 fret, and im going to give it the old college try.

beyond the ussual carvin specs:
ct624
tune o matic string through
sunset burst flame
bireseye maple fretboard
stainless medium jumbos
4+2 holdsworth style headstock
stock locking tuners
strap locks
tusq compensated nut
rosewood knobs (i hate metal knobs...yeah i am THAT picky)
Tweed case
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
Last edited by ikey_ at Jul 16, 2013,
dannyalcatraz
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#27
And now, we await your NGD!
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gregs1020
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#28
that looks great, i bet yours will too!

also are carvins nitro or poly finishes?
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dspellman
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#29
Quote by gregs1020
that looks great, i bet yours will too!

also are carvins nitro or poly finishes?


Carvins are UV-catalyzed polyester (I think, as opposed to polyurethane) finish these days. My oldest Carvin is an 88 or 89. All seven of my Carvins are in *great*shape except for one. Someone decided that tung oil finish over a koa body and neck was a good idea. Not so much. I'm sure it looked pretty when new, but it's a 1991 and it looks a bit ratty these days. I don't want to sell it because it plays amazingly well and it's seriously rare, one of the only 25.5" neck-throughs that Carvin made.

I have to take issue with a couple of points presented earlier. Their pots and pickups are just fine. I have just one, an '89 with a set of the older M22 pickups, that I personally think is a bit anemic. The current C22, H22 pickups and the old M22SD are outstanding. The older guitars have no issues with the pots and they're actually pretty progressive, rather than some of the on-off pots that plague some Gibsons these days.

I really have no issues with resale; every one of my Carvins is worth more now than when I bought it. Then again, I don't buy a guitar and resell it within a year or two.

As for 24-fret vs. 22-fret -- like the OP, I think that having an extra two frets really isn't a case of requiring you to shred <G>. As he notes, it mostly just gets the upper frets out in the wind where you can more easily get to them. There's no significant tone difference due to the shorter distance between bridge and neck pickup. At this point, a majority of my guitars are 24-fret guitars, and I don't think there are any shortcomings; only benefits.
Last edited by dspellman at Jul 16, 2013,
Mister A.J.
Ker-Blang-a-Woggle
Join date: May 2011
318 IQ
#30
Quote by ikey_
well ive considered all of this. i have made an attempt to buy a johnny hiland and it was sold.

i am just too darn picky to buy without trying and buy guitar center used (best shot at a PRS) is meh and i am too picky to buy a cookie cutter PRS. for example, i picked up a PRS McCarty and absoutely hated the finish on the neck and the bridge. stunning guitar though.

yes, i could sell the prs for what i buy it for, the carvin will chop about 40% off immeidately. i get it. i have made the decision to buy a car vin in the following finish or close to it



this took my 3 hours. literally. i got home at 6, and i didnt order my carvin cause as of 9:15 PM after they closed, i was still undecided on color. literally 3 hrs and 15 min. ive seen every carvin made at this point.

i was on the fence about 24 frets. i decided if i get it and i dislike the color or 24 frets, i will return it in 10 days and buy a 22 fret in a different color.

i also was back and forth on the tone change of a 24 fret neck pickup. then i listened to santana. i realize his guitar, amp etc, is different and his playing is god, but dammit dont tell me you can't get a smooth rich tone out of a 24 fret, and im going to give it the old college try.

beyond the ussual carvin specs:
ct624
tune o matic string through
sunset burst flame
bireseye maple fretboard
stainless medium jumbos
4+2 holdsworth style headstock
stock locking tuners
strap locks
tusq compensated nut
rosewood knobs (i hate metal knobs...yeah i am THAT picky)
Tweed case

Holy shit, that looks almost exactly like my CT7.
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