Van_Sloth
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2013
20 IQ
#1
So, here are my first two metal songs, kinda rough around the edges so far, and the second song is only about 60% finished.
Any ideas on how to integrate more keyboard playing into the songs? I've made the decision that I want a keyboardist in my band, but I feel that I have a hard time writing keyboard parts. Any tips or tricks?
Attachments:
The Forest Is Alive.gpx
Tower of Valkyries.gpx
MobiuZ
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2009
120 IQ
#3
Quote by SSympathy
what the **** is a gpx file?


plz dont comment if you're just gonna troll , i understand you're a gp5 guy but you dont have to be a dick just because some people use gpx instead.

as for the actual question you pose

i think it really is matter of figuring this out for yourself , to me thats what creating music is all about , i know this isnt the easy answer you were hoping for but than again creating quality music isnt easy , it requires dedication , discipline and determination , if you have those skills than im sure you will figure this out.

allthough i use a fair amount of keyboard myself , but i only use it as background sound to fatten up the whole section/mood and only go for simple chords mostly.

i listened to your songs and i could tell you what i would do with the keyboard parts , but whats the use ? this is your music not mine so its up to you to figure out how you want to use this to define your own style

anyway my opinion would be to not add to much keyboard melody since it wil just clutter the whole thing seeing as your already have a lot of stuff going on with the rest of the instruments , but again thats my opinion so just figure out what you want it to be.

oh and if you want your songs to sound a bit more natural on gpx id suggest using pickstrokes , it makes it a lot better than you would expect , other than that you have a pretty good sound

if you feel like critting one of my songs id apreciate it , they are in my sig
Last edited by MobiuZ at Dec 23, 2013,
JelloCrust
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2012
50 IQ
#5
Seriously, I don't think anybody is going to be able to listen to a .gpx. But unless it is power metal, symphonic metal, or symphonic black metal, get rid of that keyboard.
pAWNlol
master of the diddly-doo
Join date: Sep 2012
311 IQ
#6
Quote by JelloCrust
Seriously, I don't think anybody is going to be able to listen to a .gpx. But unless it is power metal, symphonic metal, or symphonic black metal, get rid of that keyboard.

thats a little closed-minded and rude, dont you think? lots of great bands in other genres have keyboard, especially prog

hell, why not give one of my songs a listen. it has keyboard, but its none of the genres you listed
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1625561&page=1&pp=20

also OP, please re-upload in a gp5 format. only like, 3-4 people on here will be able to check out a gp6 file
JelloCrust
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2012
50 IQ
#7
Quote by pAWNlol
thats a little closed-minded and rude, dont you think? lots of great bands in other genres have keyboard, especially prog

hell, why not give one of my songs a listen. it has keyboard, but its none of the genres you listed
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1625561&page=1&pp=20

also OP, please re-upload in a gp5 format. only like, 3-4 people on here will be able to check out a gp6 file



I was drunk! But I mean, keyboards are usually really awkward in metal (aside from those sub-generas), that's all I'm saying. Give me some country, orTom Waits-like shit, and yeah, keyboards work, but from metal, the keys are kind of over wrought, and not a stylistic match. After producing enough albums for upstart bands, I think I have a handle on this.
MobiuZ
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2009
120 IQ
#8
Quote by JelloCrust
I was drunk! But I mean, keyboards are usually really awkward in metal (aside from those sub-generas), that's all I'm saying. Give me some country, orTom Waits-like shit, and yeah, keyboards work, but from metal, the keys are kind of over wrought, and not a stylistic match. After producing enough albums for upstart bands, I think I have a handle on this.


thats your opinion , and i don't agree , if used well it can add a lot of mood to a song regardless of genre imo.

anyway guys , there is no way to export from gpx to gp5 , yes i know gpx sucks , gp5 is better blablabla.

but why dont you guys want to download/use gpx ? give me one good reason apart from the learning curve that you have to go through a bit , just one , plz.
Last edited by MobiuZ at Dec 24, 2013,
Cavalcade
razor sharp
Join date: Jul 2011
621 IQ
#9
Quote by MobiuZ

anyway guys , there is no way to export from gpx to gp5

lol no
Quote by MobiuZ

but why dont you guys want to download/use gpx ? give me one good reason apart from the learning curve that you have to go through a bit , just one , plz.

I did, actually. I used it for well over a year. I ended up uninstalling it and switching back to GP5. The sound is terrible, even compared to GM, the new drum system is a pain in the ass, you can't change the number of strings in a track after you add it, you're limited to GP6's soundbanks instead of the GM patches, and the way it handles keyboard tracks is counter-intuitive. Instead of tabbing keys like another guitar track, letting you copy/paste data from other guitar tracks, you're forced to tab it like whatever instrument corresponds to the patch you're using.
Come to think of it, since you're all about keys, why are you using GP6? What do you see in it that I'm missing?
Ometh
UG Addict
Join date: Oct 2009
401 IQ
#10
Omg this again?

GP6 is decent if you want to show your song to someone and you want it to sound better/more realistic than MIDI/RSE1 but still it doesn't beat an actual recording. The drum programming is atrocious and the interface is a cluttered mess, definitely a lackluster program. That didn't stop me from writing a couple of songs on it tho.

Also, I tried to help TS by converting the GPX files to GP5 format (yeah Mobiuz you're wrong), but I can't get assign the different tracks to different instruments because of GP5's stupid track limit/MIDI bullshit. I'd recommend TS to just export the files to WAV using GP6, then converting them to MP3's at 128kbps and uploading them to his profile/SoundCloud/SoundButt/ButtCloud/wtv

And yeah, apparently I can no longer write or speak correct english, I guess my brain is fucked
Last edited by Ometh at Dec 25, 2013,
Dregen
-
Join date: Dec 2007
311 IQ
#11
i like GP6. you just have to learn how to tweak things to get it to sound good. the distorted guitars really suck though, but a clean on ff or fff can do the trick.
Last edited by Dregen at Dec 25, 2013,
Cavalcade
razor sharp
Join date: Jul 2011
621 IQ
#12
Quote by Dregen
i like GP6. you just have to learn how to tweak things to get it to sound good. the distorted guitars really suck though, but a clean on ff or fff can do the trick.

Guitar Pro is a program for making tabs and scores. Not demos. If you're just writing music, you don't have time to tweak. Arobas tried to make GP6 more of a "demoing" tool, with its "realistic" (in big air-quotes) sounds, and I think GM sounds better if you're just editing music, which is why I still use TuxGuitar and GP5 instead.
Last edited by Cavalcade at Dec 25, 2013,
MobiuZ
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2009
120 IQ
#13
Quote by Cavalcade
lol no

I did, actually. I used it for well over a year. I ended up uninstalling it and switching back to GP5. The sound is terrible, even compared to GM, the new drum system is a pain in the ass, you can't change the number of strings in a track after you add it, you're limited to GP6's soundbanks instead of the GM patches, and the way it handles keyboard tracks is counter-intuitive. Instead of tabbing keys like another guitar track, letting you copy/paste data from other guitar tracks, you're forced to tab it like whatever instrument corresponds to the patch you're using.
Come to think of it, since you're all about keys, why are you using GP6? What do you see in it that I'm missing?


most of the reasons u gave actually have to do with the learning curve.
and im surprised u think the sound is terrible , since you could could argue that gp5 is even worse. anyway what i like about it is that it has more options and a BETTER sound imo ( still nothing like a real recording , but hey what can u expect ? ) i love fiddling around with the different amps and setups and creating my own sort of sound with it , even though i used to do that when i started with gpx , i dont do it that much anymore. but still , the options are there.

anyway it just comes down to personal preference and whether u are prepared to relearn the program and adapt to it.

Quote by Ometh

Also, I tried to help TS by converting the GPX files to GP5 format (yeah Mobiuz you're wrong)

what i meant with that is that there is no direct way to export it , sure there are workarounds , but there is no standard export to .gp5
Last edited by MobiuZ at Dec 27, 2013,
Ometh
UG Addict
Join date: Oct 2009
401 IQ
#15
Quote by xbitmetal
GP5 or no help.

Read my post, his tracks won't work properly in GP5

EDIT:
Quote by MobiuZ
what i meant with that is that there is no direct way to export it , sure there are workarounds , but there is no standard export to .gp5

Yes there is:

Exportar = export, if you really can't figure that out by yourself
Last edited by Ometh at Dec 27, 2013,
tritao
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2011
20 IQ
#16
Unfortunately the GP5 exporter is really buggy (it does not work with any of my tracks...)

I'd be cool with RSE if they expanded the soundset a bit (atm there are no usable strings) and the sounds do not mix very well. The guitar stuff sounds pretty cool though
Ometh
UG Addict
Join date: Oct 2009
401 IQ
#18
Quote by Craziork
ometh is latino :O

Portuguese, to be more precise.
Cavalcade
razor sharp
Join date: Jul 2011
621 IQ
#19
Quote by MobiuZ
most of the reasons u gave actually have to do with the learning curve.

Wanna bet?

*The sound is terrible, even compared to GM: Muddy and compressed. I use GP to write music, not mix it, and if I have to futz around with EQ and comp to get a listenable sound, that's bad. But at least there's an option to use GM instead.
*The new drum system is a pain in the ass: It's a fact that entering notes by keyboard (the fastest method) is slower if every drum has to be on one of like 10-15 different "strings". It will take more keystrokes. Always.
*You can't change the number of strings in a track after you add it: Yeah, "learning curve".
*You're limited to GP6's soundbanks instead of the GM patches: Again, this isn't something you can "learn".
*Instead of tabbing keys like another guitar track, letting you copy/paste data from other guitar tracks, you're forced to tab keys like whatever instrument corresponds to the patch you're using: See above.

I had GP6 for two years. A third year wouldn't have made it any more usable. This is why we're not buying GP6, and this is why we're asking for a GP5 version of your (probably quite lovely) tune.
Zaqq
Registered User
Join date: Oct 2011
589 IQ
#20
I've used GP6 for like 2 years, and it's great for me.

The sound is terrible

With right configuring you may get really great sounds, which show you how the song would really sound. I just saved a few presets for distorted\clean guitar and clean\distorted bass and use them every time, they sound fantastic.

The sound is terrible [...] Muddy and compressed

Again, everything is configurable. I agree, the factory presets sound bad, but a bit setup and presets choosing will make things much, much better than it was in GP5.

the new drum system is a pain in the ass

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the drum system in GP5 consisted of weird numbers over a guitar tab? The system in GP6 is a real drum notation system, which is perfectly made for drums.

,
you can't change the number of strings in a track after you add it,

You can, on newer versions of the program.

the way it handles keyboard tracks is counter-intuitive. Instead of tabbing keys like another guitar track, letting you copy/paste data from other guitar tracks, you're forced to tab it like whatever instrument corresponds to the patch you're using.

If you can read music, this system is better. I can't (lol), so I add a guitar track and then change its sound to whatever I need.
Last edited by Zaqq at Dec 27, 2013,
MobiuZ
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2009
120 IQ
#21
Quote by Ometh
Read my post, his tracks won't work properly in GP5

EDIT:

Yes there is
Exportar = export, if you really can't figure that out by yourself


ok so i guess im wrong on this one , my version doesnt have it though , which version are u using ?

Quote by Cavalcade
Wanna bet?

*The sound is terrible, even compared to GM: Muddy and compressed. I use GP to write music, not mix it, and if I have to futz around with EQ and comp to get a listenable sound, that's bad. But at least there's an option to use GM instead.
*The new drum system is a pain in the ass: It's a fact that entering notes by keyboard (the fastest method) is slower if every drum has to be on one of like 10-15 different "strings". It will take more keystrokes. Always.
*You can't change the number of strings in a track after you add it: Yeah, "learning curve".
*You're limited to GP6's soundbanks instead of the GM patches: Again, this isn't something you can "learn".
*Instead of tabbing keys like another guitar track, letting you copy/paste data from other guitar tracks, you're forced to tab keys like whatever instrument corresponds to the patch you're using: See above.

I had GP6 for two years. A third year wouldn't have made it any more usable. This is why we're not buying GP6, and this is why we're asking for a GP5 version of your (probably quite lovely) tune.


you seem to have a difficult time understanding that all those things are your personal opinion , which a lot of people seem to share , i dont care if im "wrong" or "right" im just telling u what my perspective of it is , which is that i like gpx better than gp5 for the reasons i gave.
Last edited by MobiuZ at Dec 27, 2013,
MobiuZ
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2009
120 IQ
#23
Quote by Ometh
Read my post, his tracks won't work properly in GP5

EDIT:

Yes there is
Exportar = export, if you really can't figure that out by yourself


ok so i guess im wrong on this one , my version doesnt have it though , which version are u using ?

Quote by Cavalcade
Wanna bet?

*The sound is terrible, even compared to GM: Muddy and compressed. I use GP to write music, not mix it, and if I have to futz around with EQ and comp to get a listenable sound, that's bad. But at least there's an option to use GM instead.
*The new drum system is a pain in the ass: It's a fact that entering notes by keyboard (the fastest method) is slower if every drum has to be on one of like 10-15 different "strings". It will take more keystrokes. Always.
*You can't change the number of strings in a track after you add it: Yeah, "learning curve".
*You're limited to GP6's soundbanks instead of the GM patches: Again, this isn't something you can "learn".
*Instead of tabbing keys like another guitar track, letting you copy/paste data from other guitar tracks, you're forced to tab keys like whatever instrument corresponds to the patch you're using: See above.

I had GP6 for two years. A third year wouldn't have made it any more usable. This is why we're not buying GP6, and this is why we're asking for a GP5 version of your (probably quite lovely) tune.


you seem to have a difficult time understanding that all those things are your personal opinion , which a lot of people seem to share , i dont care if im "wrong" or "right" im just telling u what my perspective of it is , which is that i like gpx better than gp5 for the reasons i gave.

and tell me how i went from using gp5 to going to gpx and not having a problem with any of the things u list ?
Last edited by MobiuZ at Dec 27, 2013,
Ometh
UG Addict
Join date: Oct 2009
401 IQ
#24
Quote by MobiuZ
ok so i guess im wrong on this one , my version doesnt have it though , which version are u using ?

PM me
Last edited by Ometh at Dec 27, 2013,
Cavalcade
razor sharp
Join date: Jul 2011
621 IQ
#25
Quote by Zaqq

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the drum system in GP5 consisted of weird numbers over a guitar tab? The system in GP6 is a real drum notation system, which is perfectly made for drums.

Most of where we differ may be a matter of opinion, but this part isn't as subjective. Like I said, note entry (by keyboard) is faster if you don't have to switch between 10-15 different lines for each drum. And those "weird numbers" are part of the MIDI standard.
Quote by MobiuZ

you seem to have a difficult time understanding that all those things are your personal opinion , which a lot of people seem to share , i dont care if im "wrong" or "right" im just telling u what my perspective of it is , which is that i like gpx better than gp5 for the reasons i gave.

Well then, here's something objective: the $60 price tag. If someone already has GP5, the alternative (staying with it) is free. If someone is already comfortable with it, the learning curve is flat. I forget where, but there was a recent poll showing that most UGers still use GP5. The bottom line is that if it ain't broke, there's no need to fix it.
If you're used to GP6, feel free to use it. But keep in mind that most of your prospective audience doesn't.
From Your Grave
bampersand
Join date: Jan 2010
459 IQ
#26
Quote by MobiuZ
but why dont you guys want to download/use gpx ? give me one good reason apart from the learning curve that you have to go through a bit , just one , plz.


I have GP6 downloaded and I've had it installed a few times but I dont like to use it because it's not as simple, quick, easy-to-use, or lightweight. I can use 25-30MB RAM with GP5 and I dont remember GP6's RAM usage but I remember it's more. I have a fast enough computer it doesnt matter for general usgae but when I get on a good writing spree and have a bunch of programs open that free RAM is going to matter. But like the others were saying I use it to write and compose music, which is quickest and easiest on GP5 as opposed to GP6. Not just because of a learning curve either.

The only thing that really matters here is that the poster who uploads a .gpx file is limiting himself for potential feedback. I was pretty interested in checking this out after reading the description but when I saw it was .gpx I knew I wasnt going to.

Onto the actual point of this thread. For the songs you're trying to write are there any specific bands that influenced your idea of having keyboards in metal? Because if you just had the ideas "I want to write this kind of metal." and "I think having more keyboard in my metal would be great." rather than "Wow I really love the sound of keyboards in metal songs" then you're trying to do something you're not really familiar with. Not saying that is what happened. That's just my example because my only advice is to find/study music that incorporates keyboards into their metal in the kind of ways you're trying to and see what they do.

It can be argued that then you're just copying other bands instead of doing it the way you would have anyways, but if you've already attempted and are stuck it might help you out of a rut. I'd recommend songs/bands except I'm not into that kind of music. The most immediate example I can think of is The Devil Wears Prada but they mainly only have overlayed synth and breakdown synth riffs and I dont think what youre going for is what they're doing.