bchampion96
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2014
638 IQ
#1
Hi guys,

I'm on my hunt for one guitar to do everything, and one of my requirements is a fully floating tremolo (with routing behind to get decent raising of pitch) but without a locking nut. Before you think I'm being a moron, I'm going to be using a tremol-no, so the guitar will be in hardtail mode most of the time.

Guitars I have found like this so far are music man JP models with that floating bridge and Guthrie Govan's signature suhr guitar.

If you have any suggestions, I'd be very greatful!
bobafettacheese
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Join date: Mar 2011
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#2
I was coming here to recommend the JP. I have no experience with the Govan though. I'm sure the Govan is great, but I personally have GAS for a JP.
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Archer250
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#3
Why not buy one with a locking nut and remove the locking screws?
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bchampion96
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2014
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#4
Quote by Archer250
Why not buy one with a locking nut and remove the locking screws?


I did think about this, but I came to the conclusion that they wouldn't work because they aren't designed to be used like that. Of course I may be wrong, but I'd prefer not to be on a big investment such as this.
Archer250
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#5
You have a point there, but if you find a guitar that suits your need, yet having a locking nut, you can also find a luthier to install a different nut instead.
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vayne92
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#6
JP60 is a solid budget guitar. I bought one just today actually
perilio
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#7
I got the JP 50, it is a pretty nice budget guitar
mjones1992
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#8
Look into getting a standard strat trem system. Yes, it looks like a vintage trem system that doesn't do much, but they can actually be set up to float and to do those 'cricket' noises that a lot of people seem to believe only a floyd rose is capable of.

You can either buy the system separate or just pick up a Standard MiM Fender Strat (not squier). They're like $430 for a 'blemished' one or $500 retail. Not bad at all.

Anyway, another option is to just take off the locking screws. I mean, yes, that's not how 'it was intended to be used', but I've seen people do it. I really don't think aside from some possible tuning issues dependent upon the quality of the guitar and how it's set up, there would be a problem.
Last edited by mjones1992 at Apr 17, 2014,
SkyValley
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Join date: Sep 2006
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#9
I believe Jeff Beck strats are set to float from the factory.
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TheStig1214
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#10
I luthier friend of mine builds custom super strats with strat type trems. He recesses the area behind the trem so even when it's flat it's "floating". You can also float a strat trem without a recess with a good setup.

Wouldn't recommend just taking the locks off a Floyd nut, it wears the strings like crazy.
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bchampion96
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#11
Quote by TheStig1214
I luthier friend of mine builds custom super strats with strat type trems. He recesses the area behind the trem so even when it's flat it's "floating". You can also float a strat trem without a recess with a good setup.

Wouldn't recommend just taking the locks off a Floyd nut, it wears the strings like crazy.


While I realise you can float a strat trem, on an unrouted body, is there enough pull back room for satriani style screams?
dspellman
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Join date: Jan 2012
1,110 IQ
#12
Carvins with Wilkinsons will do that. No locking nut.
There are ALSO some folks who order their guitars with Floyds, but without locking nuts. The reason this can work is that this guitar has locking tuners, a pretty straight line pull, no major tilt-back and a pretty well-done nut. For example...

http://www.carvinguitars.com/guitars-in-stock/109696

Last edited by dspellman at Apr 17, 2014,
bchampion96
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2014
638 IQ
#14
Quote by dspellman
Carvins with Wilkinsons will do that. No locking nut.
There are ALSO some folks who order their guitars with Floyds, but without locking nuts. The reason this can work is that this guitar has locking tuners, a pretty straight line pull, no major tilt-back and a pretty well-done nut. For example...

http://www.carvinguitars.com/guitars-in-stock/109696



Good shout! Do you have to order that custom?
JELIFISH19
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#15
You should try something like that out before buying to see if it's right for you. You won't get much range on a guitar without a locking nut. Double locking trems get their range by shortening the usable string length of the string so it does't have as much material to disperse the energy across when you move the bridge. Subtle changes in the bridge are more dramatic because the usable string length is shorter. You might not get the range you're looking for.
bchampion96
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Join date: Feb 2014
638 IQ
#16
Quote by JELIFISH19
You should try something like that out before buying to see if it's right for you. You won't get much range on a guitar without a locking nut. Double locking trems get their range by shortening the usable string length of the string so it does't have as much material to disperse the energy across when you move the bridge. Subtle changes in the bridge are more dramatic because the usable string length is shorter. You might not get the range you're looking for.


By range, do you mean how much you can sharpen or flatten a note with the tremolo? It'll be very tricky to find somewhere that has a guitar like this to try. Music Man Petrucci signatures have the range I need though.
Dave_Mc
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#17
Quote by bchampion96
While I realise you can float a strat trem, on an unrouted body, is there enough pull back room for satriani style screams?


probably not

there are things you can do to compensate, like starting the scream when you've already slightly dived the bar, or bending as well as pulling up, but if you're not ok with doing those, then yeah something recessed is going to have more up-pull.
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Darkdevil725
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#18
Floyd+Locking Tuners+Roller Nut = Set
Just get a regular double locking guitar and get the nut switched for a roller nut and put on some locking tuners.
ryanita
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#19
Quote by vayne92
JP60 is a solid budget guitar. I bought one just today actually


nice recomended vayne92....jp60 it nice and I like...best price..
dspellman
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#20
Quote by bchampion96
Good shout! Do you have to order that custom?


That particular one is in stock. Otherwise, yes, you have to order it custom.
Guy_Mitchell
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#21
I have a Warmoth with a recessed Wilkinson and an LSR roller nut with locking tuners.

Stays in tune like a dream. Can't use it for extreme trem action, but it stays in tune better than my JP BFR, which used to have the best tuning stability for non locking trems in my book.

I think if I put an LSR on the JP, that'd be hilariously stable.
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Offworld92
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#22
I'm not sure if I overlooked this or not, but why exactly do you not want a locking nut?
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dazza027
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#23
Any Fender style trem can be set to float. There are numerous videos on Youtube showing how to accomplish it. Pretty easy mod, I did it to my Jackson but found that the trem arm needed to be bent outwards a tad to allow dive bombs etc (will also get the router out and recess into the body to allow the trem block to move further). Most important thing to do is to get the string tension equal with the springs and keep the nut and saddles lubed to allow settling of the strings after a wham which will help it stay in tune...
Fumble fingers
Registered User
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#24
All G&L's American or Tribute series have Leo Fenders patent DF are floating tremolo and have no locking nut , the DF stands for dual fulcrum ..... very nice controllable trem
Tempoe
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#25
I had a strat+ that came with locking tuners. Relatively stable tuning, but you have to wrap the strings on the post perfectly for this to work. No overlaps, and the right amount of winds to take it near the bottom of the post.
bchampion96
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2014
638 IQ
#26
Quote by Offworld92
I'm not sure if I overlooked this or not, but why exactly do you not want a locking nut?


I tend to hop around string gauges quite often. I just don't want the extra hassle when it comes to changing strings. That's why I'd prefer no floyd rose as you have to (with some of them) clip strings as well and use allen keys all over the place.
monwobobbo
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Join date: Jul 2009
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#27
Quote by bchampion96
I tend to hop around string gauges quite often. I just don't want the extra hassle when it comes to changing strings. That's why I'd prefer no floyd rose as you have to (with some of them) clip strings as well and use allen keys all over the place.


ummm... if you change string gauges then you'd have to reset up the trem for floating. this is a downside of any trem set to float. you need to retain the same string tension for it to float regardless. I have 1 of my strats set to float and it does work well as long as it doesn't bind at nut. as for pull up without rear routing you are fairly limited. of course you can bend a note up then pull on trem to more of a scream (takes a little practice but Uli Roth (Scorpions) used that method and it sounded cool.
bchampion96
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Join date: Feb 2014
638 IQ
#28
Quote by monwobobbo
ummm... if you change string gauges then you'd have to reset up the trem for floating. this is a downside of any trem set to float. you need to retain the same string tension for it to float regardless. I have 1 of my strats set to float and it does work well as long as it doesn't bind at nut. as for pull up without rear routing you are fairly limited. of course you can bend a note up then pull on trem to more of a scream (takes a little practice but Uli Roth (Scorpions) used that method and it sounded cool.


I realise that a full bridge re-setup is needed, but the locking but is another obstacle that I'd prefer not to have. I also change tunings a lot and it'sa hassle (or so I've been told) with fine tuners. Locking tuners and a tremolno should make that a lot easier.
monwobobbo
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#29
Quote by bchampion96
I realise that a full bridge re-setup is needed, but the locking but is another obstacle that I'd prefer not to have. I also change tunings a lot and it'sa hassle (or so I've been told) with fine tuners. Locking tuners and a tremolno should make that a lot easier.


not really you would still have to rebalance the bridge for each tuning. I have a roller nut and locking tuners on one of my strats and that changes nothing in terms of rebalancing the bridge for any changes. as I said this is a downside to floating bridges locking or not.