I'm getting Superior Drummer 2.0 and I want to know which expansion is best for.....

#1
.....Heavy Metal. Like drummer good for anything from All That Remain to Meshuggah and beyond. Basically drums with moderate intensity, to some really intense stuff

I'll know doubt dabble with the regular Superior Drummer 2.0 software, but feel I'll eventually buy an expansion later on and would like to know which one sounds best for my tastes.

BTW, my styles are close a mix of LoG, Machine Head, Behemoth, and some good ol' Thrash
Last edited by bdof at Jan 16, 2013,
#2
I only know Metal Machine. The OHs and Room mics are pretty kickass and the toms are good enough. I can't say I really liked the kick and snare. I prefer the ones in 2.0.

Edit: I meant Metal Foundry....
Last edited by Sethis at Jan 16, 2013,
#3
Well if you'd done some research you'd of found this...

http://www.toontrack.com/products.asp?item=51

Hell it's even sampled from the Meshuggah drummer and it sounds a hell of a lot better than DKFH mind.

Though a lot of people I know say they like the regular avatar kit for metal just fine.
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#5
Depends on what you have to spend. I don't think you can go wrong with The Metal Foundry if you have the money and hard disc space. Because it's made for SD2 instead of EZDrummer it has a lot more samples per drum and more drums than Drumkit from Hell or any of their other older offerings. On the other hand, it is twice as expensive and uses 35GB of hard drive space compared to 1GB for DFH. (also, the Meshuggah drummer was involved in the recordings of several of Toontrack's metal drumkits, including The Metal Foundry)

One thing I'd recommend is playing around with SD2 for a while. It already has a lot of drums by itself and plenty of tools for tweaking sounds. You may be able to get the sound you want by playing with the EQ, comp, reverb, etc. without spending a bunch of money on an expansion. Might be worth the time to find out.
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#6
Well, personally I'd get Steven Slate Drums 4 if I were in your situation (already have it though) but each to their own...
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#7
Quote by DisarmGoliath
Well, personally I'd get Steven Slate Drums 4 if I were in your situation (already have it though) but each to their own...


Yeah slates samples kill toontracks. The interface isn't quite as good, but the samples are killer.
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#8
Metal Machine is a must buy if your doing metal with Superior Drummer the standard drums samples are better then the EZdrummer libaries ( I have Drumkit From Hell, Metal Machine & Metalheads ),. But the Metal Machine raises the level above that again " for metal drums.

there is no point even talking about Steven Slate if you already have Superior Drummer. it's just silly fan boy BS.
Last edited by T4D at Jan 17, 2013,
#9
I only find Metal Foundry usable for cymbals, they sound great. The kit on the other hand needs a lot of work because they are all off pitch and wonky sounding. I use the stock Avatar kit or Music City with Metal Foundry cymbals on a serious production, but usually I just slap Metal Machine on there and call it a day cause it sounds ****ing fantastic.

SSD is worth a look too, but unlike most of the others here, I find the kits kinda boring and harder to work with toget a unique sound. The CLA expansion is great though, but I certainly wouldn't buy it for whatever Steven is asking for it now.
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#10
Hehe CLA for $99.


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#11
When it gets to the point between Superior and Slate, it really has less to do with quality and more with personal choice. I myself prefer Slate, but others may like Superior more. Honestly, you can't go wrong either way, it's just what you feel suits you better.
#12
Quote by ChemicalFire
Yeah slates samples kill toontracks. The interface isn't quite as good, but the samples are killer.

I'm amazed by all the praise for Slate....everything I've heard of theirs sounds overly processed and fake, hardly any dynamics. I've just listened to about 50 demos on the website and if that's the best it can do, I'll pass!

I guess that's ok for metal or pop where ridiculous levels of 'fakeness' are common, but I hate that style of production anyway.
Superior is far more realistic if you're using an electric kit, stuff like the hihat transmutation and sample switching is miles above. Analogue Drums and NI Studio Drummer are also nice.
#13
I'm not bashing either program, but it seems kinda stupid to be asking a question specifically related to superior then being recommended that TS buys a whole different program.
#14
Quote by kyle62
I'm amazed by all the praise for Slate....everything I've heard of theirs sounds overly processed and fake, hardly any dynamics. I've just listened to about 50 demos on the website and if that's the best it can do, I'll pass!

I guess that's ok for metal or pop where ridiculous levels of 'fakeness' are common, but I hate that style of production anyway.
Superior is far more realistic if you're using an electric kit, stuff like the hihat transmutation and sample switching is miles above. Analogue Drums and NI Studio Drummer are also nice.


It does other stuff too... it's just that I don't own any of the jazz kits or anything as their all in premium only. And the demo's on all drum software websites are awful. I'm surprised you haven't noticed that.
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#15
Quote by kyle62
I'm amazed by all the praise for Slate


You've got 25 kits that sound good out of the box for most situations for $99 with the EX version. Yeah, its not perfect but neither is Superior. The cymbals in the stock Superior kit are meh. I know I'm going retail prices here but you're looking at $250 for Superior + $150 for the Metal Foundry and you've hit a decent sound. Plus, if you want to get the most out of Superior, you need a huge hard drive to hold the 60gb library for the 2.
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
#16
Quote by chatterbox272
I'm not bashing either program, but it seems kinda stupid to be asking a question specifically related to superior then being recommended that TS buys a whole different program.

Not really. The TS says he's "getting" Superior, as in, he doesn't have it yet. A lot of times on the forum, people just plan on buying something because that's the one they've heard talked about the most, not because they've made their own choice on which sounds best to them, for what they need. People giving recommendations outside of S2.0, when he doesn't yet have it is a worthwhile response, if not at least togget the TS thinking
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#17
Quote by chatterbox272
I'm not bashing either program, but it seems kinda stupid to be asking a question specifically related to superior then being recommended that TS buys a whole different program.


Prefect once you go down a good path $$$ wise there is no need to be told HEY this path is better when it's only "personal" opinion.


Just like it's offensive to tell people using Sonar OR Cubase or Logic etc That Protools is better... just leave it ,. a good tool is a good tool,. Being a good artist and producing good art is the challenge.


But if your using Audacity Your should be told about Reaper hey it's free Well nearly
#19
Quote by T4D
Just like it's offensive to tell people using Sonar OR Cubase or Logic etc That Protools is better... just leave it ,. a good tool is a good tool,. Being a good artist and producing good art is the challenge.


As the only person who uses Pro Tools here (I know there are more, shutup), I tell people to stay away from it since its a $$$ pit. Though I also tell them to avoid Cubase too :p

Though I do agree with what Matrix is saying as the reason he's probably looking at SD 2.0 is the same reason that a new person comes in here and asks if Pro Tools is worth buying. Drum Programs aren't massively advertised outside of Toontracks products so most people think its the only one or the best one because its got the biggest ad.

Edit

where is your computer from the 90's ?

I have 256 of SSD HD and 3 TB HD Storeage ?.. & 60 GB feaks you out


You do realize that there are a lot of users on here that are limited to whatever their laptop can hold which is usually around 500gb? Yes, you can buy external drives but considering most people here can't justify $60 on Reaper, thats just not an option.
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
Last edited by lockwolf at Jan 17, 2013,
#21
I own it, I just don't use it as much as SSD since I can get a sound I like out of the box whereas with Superior, I have to spend like 10 minutes setting up the drums the way I like to get a good sound. Its not as easy as SSD or Addictive Drums (lol) to share kits from different expansions which was a huge turnoff. The drum samples are good but in all reality, its not enough for me to justify going out and spending $400 for it and Metal Foundry (I used to work in a studio, got some nice software for free when it closed, this being one) when you've got SSD at the other end with EX being great for most uses at $99.

I know, its all art and a personal thing or whatnot but when you've gotta spend $400 to get a good sound versus $99, at the end of the day, I've still got an extra $300 to spend on hookers and blow.
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
#22
SD2 is fine, I've used it. It does the job and it does sound really rather real.


But I've just found that I've enjoyed working with SSD4 far more. It feels more stream lined to me.

Also you want dynamics. Here's some dynamics, (STARTS AT 7:30):

http://youtu.be/lWOte-BbEHA
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Last edited by ChemicalFire at Jan 17, 2013,
#23
Quote by MatrixClaw
Not really. The TS says he's "getting" Superior, as in, he doesn't have it yet. A lot of times on the forum, people just plan on buying something because that's the one they've heard talked about the most, not because they've made their own choice on which sounds best to them, for what they need. People giving recommendations outside of S2.0, when he doesn't yet have it is a worthwhile response, if not at least togget the TS thinking

Exactly.....

I'm mainly looking for a program that is solid across the board in audio quality, has an easy to use interface that's still quite deep, isn't overly difficult as far as writing out the drum parts, and has PLENTY of solid expansions.

$$$ really isn't an issue. I need to go out and get a new laptop anyways, so it's nice to hear how much space I'll need in advance

In case it wasn't obvious before, I'm a newb at this stuff, lol. Where's another great thread to further my education after I get what I need from this one?
#24
In the end it boils down to taste. You've gotta take a look about, see what you can afford, what sounds good for what you wanna do.

For Metal though It's a toss up between SSD4 and SD2 I'd say. The price point depends on which version of SSD4 you get. The EX version is $99 and it covers metal pretty well.
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#25
Glad Matrix had my back while I was at work, and it seems I was correct to presume TS hadn't bought Superior yet (as evidenced, though already mentioned, by the "getting" in the OP). Personally, I don't like the sound of Superior (even the expansion packs) and prefer the layout of SSD (though I guess that's because it's the first drum program I've actually wanted to buy through liking what I'd seen and heard, so it's familiar now).

As for programming the drum parts, you'll likely be using your DAW's (recording program's) 'Piano Roll' function, regardless of the drum sequencer you get - don't be intimidated by it, even though it might look confusing or like a keyboard/instrument... it is just a grid that you add the notes to, and can define their length and velocity (how 'hard' the hit is), as well as when they occur, down to the smallest increment your DAW can measure MIDI too (usually it's the equivalent of a sample, I believe, giving you up to 44,100 increments per second if you zoom in enough, or even more if you use a higher sample rate!).
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#27
No problem You're cheerful enough, maybe I'm in too good a mood and will regret it but if you have any specific questions about recording, feel free to PM me and I don't mind answering - will save the thread getting derailed, or you creating more threads to ask them.
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#28
I quite like both of them - but I use Superior, personally.
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#29
I will say - If you like fat snares, SSD is definitely the way to go in that aspect. It takes a lot of work to get a huge snare sound in Superior, whereas the Slate snares are nice and big.

If I had to describe SSD and S2.0 in a few words, for SSD it'd be "big," though that often means the low-end can easily get out of control in mixes and the toms kind of blend together, whereas S2.0 is "clean and precise." When I started using Superior switching from SSD3.5 at the time, I instantly noticed how surgically precise the drums sounded, they cut through my mixes insanely well. However - Without a lot of work, they definitely lack the "wow" factor you get when you hear how huge of a tone you get with SSD.

Which one you like better is totally up to you. Personally, if I had to choose, I'd probably go with SSD for kicks and snares and S2.0 for everything else. Depending on genre, that could change though, as I prefer SSD for rock and lighter, whereas S2.0 alone really delivers for extreme metal with blast beats and very quick bass, where SSD might get too boomy.
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#30
Quote by MatrixClaw
I will say - If you like fat snares, SSD is definitely the way to go in that aspect. It takes a lot of work to get a huge snare sound in Superior, whereas the Slate snares are nice and big.

If I had to describe SSD and S2.0 in a few words, for SSD it'd be "big," though that often means the low-end can easily get out of control in mixes and the toms kind of blend together, whereas S2.0 is "clean and precise." When I started using Superior switching from SSD3.5 at the time, I instantly noticed how surgically precise the drums sounded, they cut through my mixes insanely well. However - Without a lot of work, they definitely lack the "wow" factor you get when you hear how huge of a tone you get with SSD.

Which one you like better is totally up to you. Personally, if I had to choose, I'd probably go with SSD for kicks and snares and S2.0 for everything else. Depending on genre, that could change though, as I prefer SSD for rock and lighter, whereas S2.0 alone really delivers for extreme metal with blast beats and very quick bass, where SSD might get too boomy.


Agreed with this totally. SSD out of the box sounds way "bigger" and I personally much prefer it to toontracks stuff. BUT with work Toontrack stuff can sound better, but it takes time comping the snares and eqing the kick. Where SSD is ready to go (although I usually put a touch more comp on the snares)
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#31
Quote by MatrixClaw
I will say - If you like fat snares, SSD is definitely the way to go in that aspect. It takes a lot of work to get a huge snare sound in Superior, whereas the Slate snares are nice and big.

If I had to describe SSD and S2.0 in a few words, for SSD it'd be "big," though that often means the low-end can easily get out of control in mixes and the toms kind of blend together, whereas S2.0 is "clean and precise." When I started using Superior switching from SSD3.5 at the time, I instantly noticed how surgically precise the drums sounded, they cut through my mixes insanely well. However - Without a lot of work, they definitely lack the "wow" factor you get when you hear how huge of a tone you get with SSD.

Which one you like better is totally up to you. Personally, if I had to choose, I'd probably go with SSD for kicks and snares and S2.0 for everything else. Depending on genre, that could change though, as I prefer SSD for rock and lighter, whereas S2.0 alone really delivers for extreme metal with blast beats and very quick bass, where SSD might get too boomy.

Seconding the "precise" bit about superior. The toms can get boomy on SD pretty easily though if you aren't careful.
Current Gear:
LTD MH-400
PRS SE Custom 24 (BKP C-Bomb/VHII)
ESP Horizon NT-7 (SD Full Shreds)
UA Apollo Twin Duo
Peavey Revalver 4, UAD Friedman BE100/DS40
Focal Alpha 65 monitors
Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.