ch1ng_chung
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#1
How does Guthrie Govan get that slap sound in the beginning? I've been playing 2.5 years and yet I can't even come close to that. Also, I'm having great trouble figuring out what notes he plays. I slow it down to .5 speed and even then it's too fast for me to remember what it sounds like when I try to put it on the fretboard.

I won't resort to tabs. Tabs are for the weak willed.

And why is this song so hard to learn? I could translate YJM's Far Beyond the Sun by ear, including putting a chorded intro, half a year ago, and that song's a million times faster than Wonderul Slipper Thing.
Last edited by ch1ng_chung at Jan 29, 2013,
Junior#1
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#2
Quote by ch1ng_chung
How does Guthrie Govan get that slap sound in the beginning? I've been playing 2.5 years and yet I can't even come close to that. Also, I'm having great trouble figuring out what notes he plays. I slow it down to .5 speed and even then it's too fast for me to remember what it sounds like when I try to put it on the fretboard.

I won't resort to tabs. Tabs are for the weak willed.

And why is this song so hard to learn? I could translate YJM's Far Beyond the Sun by ear, including putting a chorded intro, half a year ago, and that song's a million times faster than Wonderul Slipper Thing.

Why is it so hard? Because it's Guthrie. He is a truly phenomenal guitarist with some incredible songs. Naturally, some are going to be ridiculously hard to play.

This might help:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLNOgcEfBE4
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Soccerguy
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#3
Tabs are a great learning tool. Don't be pretentious.
This is not just a tonne of fretted notes like YJM's wankery. These aren't sounds you will be used to hearing on a guitar, so clearly you'll have a bit, if not a lot, of difficulty. Try learning to slap on guitar first, then work your way up to this song.
Also, I don't think the speed of the song is really the problem, I think it is most likely the skill of the guitarist playing the song that is making it harder to figure it out. YJM has a very fast, yet much more simplistic style of playing, while Guthrie is the opposite, not to say he can't play fast.

Edit: To clarify the last bit, it's no so much the skill of the guitarist as the difficulty of the song. Guthrie's songs will be harder than most any other song you come across, I mean, watch a video of him, his skill is beyond comprehension. Yngwie, while still having lots of speed and skill, just hasn't composed near as difficult songs.
Last edited by Soccerguy at Jan 29, 2013,
ProgFripp74
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#4
Malmsteen is not faster than Guthrie for a start, the harmony lead break in WST is far faster and more accurate than anything Malmsteen could play.
Also, don't be a pretentious shred monkey, lots of people use tabs to play songs, its common and I'm sure lots of people who use tabs could play the song whereas you can't.

Actual advice: Just look at youtube vids on bass slapping or the vid above.
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shredder3386
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#5
I didn't even read the question, all I know is Guthrie Govan is amazing and watching that video made me instantly turn on Erotic Cakes for the millionth time.
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#6
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Sickz
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#7
The reason you are having a harder time picking out Guthrie over Malmsteen is because Guthrie uses alot of jazz playing. That would be alot of chromatic playing, altered lines aswell as playing "outside" the key. Malmsteens style is not that hard to pick out, but it's of course hard to play.

I transcribed Wonderful Slippery Thing a while ago, and it's one of the hardest tune i have ever transcribed. Just because of the reasons stated above aswell as guthries phrasing. Some stuff he plays on that song you just don't hear that distinctly, but if it was taken away you would notice. I am talking about small pre bends/bends, sliding, etc
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ch1ng_chung
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#9
Quote by Zaphod_Beeblebr
Well when you're done being a prick, check this out: http://www.freewebs.com/deadferretconundrum2/guthriegovan.htm


wow... shocks me that Govan would tab something out. Then again, it is the only effective notation for guitar. What shocked me even more is when I found out that I had transcribed the first few seconds of the song correctly by ear
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#10
Quote by ch1ng_chung
wow... shocks me that Govan would tab something out. Then again, it is the only effective notation for guitar. What shocked me even more is when I found out that I had transcribed the first few seconds of the song correctly by ear


1 - He did tab transcriptions of music for Guitar Techniques magazine for a living for a long time.
2 - He claims he can write standard notation much better than he can read it.
3 - Of course you did, you admitted yourself that you had a lot of trouble remembering it when it came to transcribing even with it slowed down.
4 - By your own admission tab is the most effective guitar notation, why the snobbery in the first post?
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ProgFripp74
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#11
Quote by ch1ng_chung
wow... shocks me that Govan would tab something out. Then again, it is the only effective notation for guitar. What shocked me even more is when I found out that I had transcribed the first few seconds of the song correctly by ear


Are you trying to prove how amazing you are because you can listen to something slowed down and transcribe a very small part of it? Then say tabs are for the weak but you can't play the song without one?

Your pretentious hypocrisy is on a level I have not quite seen before, well done.
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mdc
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#12
TS, Guthrie is an improviser. The only thing that stays the same in that song, like all of his songs, is the melody. And in this song, the slap intro, the tapping lick in the middle, and at the end of the song.

I think he'd appreciate that you do those parts justice and improvise the parts that are meant to be improvised.
Morphogenesis26
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#13
Quote by mdc
TS, Guthrie is an improviser. The only thing that stays the same in that song, like all of his songs, is the melody. And in this song, the slap intro, the tapping lick in the middle, and at the end of the song.

I think he'd appreciate that you do those parts justice and improvise the parts that are meant to be improvised.


This. I've tried to doing some of his stuff, like Waves or Fives, and I always end up improvising over the crazy parts and playing the repeated section(Intro of Waves, chorus of Fives, etc.).

Also, Malmsteen's stuff is pretty straightforward and not that hard to tab out by ear.
Freepower
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#15
I've been playing 2.5 years and yet I can't even come close to that.


Quell surprise! Guthrie is hard for a relative beginner to imitate.

Just keep at it and keep using your ears. Getting anywhere near as good as Guthrie will take a lifetime, just like it has for him.
steven seagull
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#16
Quote by Freepower
Quell surprise! Guthrie is hard for a relative beginner to imitate.

Just keep at it and keep using your ears. Getting anywhere near as good as Guthrie will take a lifetime, just like it has for him.

+1


so you've been playing a fraction of the years Guthrie has, you probably haven't practised as much or as much as he did in his first two years and I guarantee your practise hasn't been as intense or focussed as what he was doing.

And you're surprised that you can't play his stuff?
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ch1ng_chung
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#17
Quote by steven seagull
+1


so you've been playing a fraction of the years Guthrie has, you probably haven't practised as much or as much as he did in his first two years and I guarantee your practise hasn't been as intense or focussed as what he was doing.

And you're surprised that you can't play his stuff?


I'm pretty sure Govan started playing guitar when he was around 4
Zaphod_Beeblebr
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#19
Quote by ch1ng_chung
I'm pretty sure Govan started playing guitar when he was around 4


As usual you have completely missed the point in favor of arguing some inconsequential detail.

For the record: Govan was transcribing Joe Pass by ear at a younger age than you even thought about picking up guitar. By that point he had been playing several times longer than you have been now.

When Wonderful Slippery Thing was first written he had already been playing for 19 years. The recorded version on the album was recorded somewhere around 10-13 years after that. There are literally hundreds of reasons why you cannot play this song, let alone transcribe it by ear.
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mdc
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#20
It's also the song that won him Guitarist of the Year, TS. So suck on that.
steven seagull
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#21
About ch1ngchung's channel
This is the channel of the superior guitarist. The superior guitarist plays what he deems worthy of his level. He is on a whole new level of guitar-mastery. The superior guitarist started guitar in June, 2010. Before that date, he didn't even know what a "fret" was.

There's your problem. Right there.

Assuming that's not meant ironically you're way too far up your own arse, and with that kind of arrogance you'll never progress. You evidently only really care about one thing, being good at guitar so you can show off, and that's a poor mindset when it comes to improving.

Technically you have some ability and are quite mobile around the fretboard but your execution is poor, your notes don't ring out clearly, your picking is inconsistent, muting isn't good enough for the speeds you're trying to play at. Basically your over stretching yourself and trying way too hard to "be" good instead of focussing on the things you need to do to get good.

This thread shouldn't even exist because the brutal truth is you are nowhere close to being able to do that piece justice yet. If your been painting for two and a half years would you be bitching and whining that you couldn't paint the Mona Lisa yet?

A little humility goes a long way when it comes to learning the guitar, and you need to pull your head out of your arse and instead of telling yourself how amazing you are start being far more objective and self critical of your playing. The videos you've posted, yes you can kinda play them but you're playing them badly and it all looks very forced and mechanical which is the exact opposite of what you're trying to achieve. And you won't fix that by trying to learn more advanced stuff. You have to go back to basics and fix the fundamental flaws in your technique and understanding if you ever want to get close to the level you aspire to be at.
Actually called Mark!

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Livingtime
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#22
Couldn't agree more Steven

If you intend on learning Wonderful Slippery Thing you're going to have to really into it! unlike Yngwie songs, it's not mechanical in the slightest, it's all about groove, feel and control. That said, it could take many months or even a year before you could get it stage-ready (consistent practice)

And the slapping intro, it's sounds like he's using a filter of some sort i'm not very knowledgeable about effects but I do know the basic ones

I doubt this, considering I absolutely fail at slap but in WST the tab seems like pop and slapping BUT the uh.. arpeggio? seems like a pop, tap then slap. It could be a slap tap slap one of those.
Last edited by Livingtime at Feb 1, 2013,
Zaphod_Beeblebr
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#23
Quote by Livingtime
And the slapping intro, it's sounds like he's using a filter of some sort i'm not very knowledgeable about effects but I do know the basic ones


He uses a Guyatone WR-3 Wah Rocker for that sound ( http://guyatone.com/Wr2.php ); it's a touch-sensitive filter effect so the harder you hit the strings the more the wah opens up. He consistently says it's one of his favourite effects because it really forces you to play dynamically.

I don't know what you're talking about when it comes to the 'arpeggio' you mentioned though, could you clarify a bit?
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ch1ng_chung
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#25
I have a problem, every time I try to slap any string beside the low E, it barely sounds

EDIT: is it even possible to slap the G, B, and High E strings? (not pull, slap)
Last edited by ch1ng_chung at Feb 3, 2013,
cip 123
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#26
The fact that you have to ask this just shows you need to practise more theres nothing wrong with the strings just practice.