Page 1 of 3
#1
Im still looking for a decent beginner guitar, recently landed on the Epiphones Les Pauls as they seem to suit the style of music i want to play. So i can get a Special II for £110, or the LP100 for £200, is the 100 worth an extra £90? According to the Epiphone site theyre identical minus the materials used for the body.
#3
go for the epi standard, the special II and the lp100 aren't that great, you'll probably want something better quite soon. the standard would be better plus upgrades/mods would work better with it.
Quote by Martyr's Prayer
I got crap to do, okay? Counter-Strike isn't going to play itself.
#4
Quote by jeremydeath
epiphone prophecy

/thread

.. oh wait thats too expensive


...Erm. Well can anyone help me with my question please?
#5
Quote by twistedmaggot
go for the epi standard, the special II and the lp100 aren't that great, you'll probably want something better quite soon. the standard would be better plus upgrades/mods would work better with it.


Ah right, What about the Epiphone Studio?
#6
Seriously, just save up and get a Standard, or at LEAST a Studio. The two that you mentioned won't last you nearly as long and they'll probably put you off playing from the problems that you are likely to encounter with them. Spend a little bit more and get one of the ones with a set neck.

Quote by Oxig3n
Ah right, What about the Epiphone Studio?


Yes, if you aren't willing to pay even more for a Standard. A Studio is much better than the two you initially mentioned, get a Studio.
#7
Quote by Les Paul Ell
Seriously, just save up and get a Standard, or at LEAST a Studio. The two that you mentioned won't last you nearly as long and they'll probably put you off playing from the problems that you are likely to encounter with them. Spend a little bit more and get one of the ones with a set neck.


Yes, if you aren't willing to pay even more for a Standard. A Studio is much better than the two you initially mentioned, get a Studio.


The Standard is far too expensive for me unfortunately. ): Whats the difference between the standard and the studio? On the Epiphone site their specs are exactly the same?

Ill be getting the Epiphone Les Paul Studio Chameleon though as it stands. Is the Chameleon the same as the normal Studio?
#8
I would not buy an Epiphone Studio unless you have some more experience. The quality on those is not constant and no offense, but I doubt a beginner will be able to tell the good Studios from the bad ones. I actually don't recommend any Epi below the Standard.

What style of music do you play? Well, no matter really, because this guitar here works better for any style than comparably priced Epis. Please check it out:
http://www.thomann.de/gb/yamaha_pacifica_112_blk.htm

If you want an LP so badly though, have a look at Vintage:
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop/flypage/product_id/14143

The Vintages I played so far have all been worth their money, which is quite not the case with lower end Epiphones.


On a different note: What amp are you planning to get?
#9
Quote by Oxig3n
The Standard is far too expensive for me unfortunately. ): Whats the difference between the standard and the studio? On the Epiphone site their specs are exactly the same?

Ill be getting the Epiphone Les Paul Studio Chameleon though as it stands. Is the Chameleon the same as the normal Studio?


It's pretty minor differences in the parts themselves, maybe just better wood and different pickups. But the quality control is stricter on Standards, so they're generally built better.

As to the other guy who said get a Yamaha Pacifica or a Vintage Studio. I definately would not recommend Vintage, and Yamaha aren't great for starter guitars either. I think that Fender Standard Strats or Ibanez RG321's make the best starter guitars, but the Strat is a little out of your price range. If you want an Epi Les Paul like you said then I think a Studio is at least a lot better than the two you originally looked at.
#10
Quote by TheQuailman
I would not buy an Epiphone Studio unless you have some more experience. The quality on those is not constant and no offense, but I doubt a beginner will be able to tell the good Studios from the bad ones. I actually don't recommend any Epi below the Standard.

What style of music do you play? Well, no matter really, because this guitar here works better for any style than comparably priced Epis. Please check it out:
http://www.thomann.de/gb/yamaha_pacifica_112_blk.htm

If you want an LP so badly though, have a look at Vintage:
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop/flypage/product_id/14143

The Vintages I played so far have all been worth their money, which is quite not the case with lower end Epiphones.


On a different note: What amp are you planning to get?


Thanks for that =] You sure i should stay away from the studio's though? I can get it for £179 which is quite cheap and seems like a nice guitar.

And im thinking of the Marshall MG10 for an amp.

Btw ill be playing things like GnR, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Coheed and Cambria, Boston, Rollingstones. That kind of stuff.
#11
An Epi Studio will be better than the Vintage. Also, for a starter amp the Roland Cube is very good.
#12
See if you can afford a 15 watt amp, they sound better because they have bigger speakers than the 10 watt models. Also check out the Roland Cube and Microcube, they sound a good bit better than the Marshall imo (though I admit that they're ugly as sin).
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop/flypage/product_id/34077
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop/flypage/product_id/30349
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop/flypage/product_id/12748

But hey, it's what sounds good to you that matters, just try the stuff out.

Les Paul Ell is right about the Ibanez RG321, if you want to pay the extra money, it is a fantastic beginner's or even intermediate instrument:
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop/flypage/product_id/15402

Quote by Les Paul Ell
I definately would not recommend Vintage, and Yamaha aren't great for starter guitars either.

May I ask why? The Yamahas and Vintages I played so far have all been really nice.

Quote by Les Paul Ell
An Epi Studio will be better than the Vintage. Also, for a starter amp the Roland Cube is very good.

Once again, only if he can tell the good ones from the bad ones, and that's unlikely for someone who's just starting out. I don't want to bash Epiphone, hell, I own an Epi myself and I think it's a lovely instrument, but Epi's been going downhill in recent years. I think their lower end guitars are among the worst you can buy in the price range currently.

EDIT: Oh, and +1 about the Cube.


Quote by Oxig3n
Thanks for that =] You sure i should stay away from the studio's though? I can get it for £179 which is quite cheap and seems like a nice guitar.

And im thinking of the Marshall MG10 for an amp.

Btw ill be playing things like GnR, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Coheed and Cambria, Boston, Rollingstones. That kind of stuff.

The Yamaha is still better value imo. Both guitars would work for the music you want to play, with the Yamaha being a bit better for Stones songs because it has single coil pickups and a humbucker, while the Studio only has humbuckers. Single coils are nice for a Stones-esque clean sound. This is not the reason I'd dismiss the Studio though, it's because I think that it is a low quality guitar in general.
Last edited by TheQuailman at Nov 19, 2008,
#13
Thanks guys but the MOST i have to spend on the guitar is £180, and then £80 for all the other stuff; amp, stand, straps, tuner, picks.

Thats why i thought the Epi Les Paul Chameleon Studio was good, as it's only £179. I thought it was the best guitar within my £180 limit.

*EDIT* What do you mean i wouldnt be able to tell the good Studios from the bad Studios? Are all studios not built with the same parts?

But, would you guys pay an extra £70 to get a Studio over a Special II ?
Last edited by Oxig3n at Nov 19, 2008,
#14
Honestly: I'd go for a different amp than the Cube or the MG. MG's are really horrid honestly. I'd go for a Peavey Vypyr 15, or if you have a bit more money, a Vypyr 30.
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Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
#16
Quote by oneblackened
Honestly: I'd go for a different amp than the Cube or the MG. MG's are really horrid honestly. I'd go for a Peavey Vypyr 15, or if you have a bit more money, a Vypyr 30.


Peavey Vypyr 15 is FAR too expensive.


Can anyone else answer my previous questions?
#17
Quote by TheQuailman

May I ask why? The Yamahas and Vintages I played so far have all been really nice.


Once again, only if he can tell the good ones from the bad ones, and that's unlikely for someone who's just starting out. I don't want to bash Epiphone, hell, I own an Epi myself and I think it's a lovely instrument, but Epi's been going downhill in recent years. I think their lower end guitars are among the worst you can buy in the price range currently.


The Yamaha is still better value imo. Both guitars would work for the music you want to play, with the Yamaha being a bit better for Stones songs because it has single coil pickups and a humbucker, while the Studio only has humbuckers. Single coils are nice for a Stones-esque clean sound. This is not the reason I'd dismiss the Studio though, it's because I think that it is a low quality guitar in general.


Well admittedly I haven't tried any of either brands guitars from about two years onwards so maybe their new models are better and you seem to have confidence in them so you're probably right. But in the past I've played some nasty Vintages (the Metal AXXE or something like that, big red thing with a licenced floyd, also an SG) and some nasty Pacificas.


But yeah, if you are certain that you would like a Les Paul then the Studio is definately better and worth the extra money. Have a look at the Ibanez RG321, I don't know if it's in your price range because I'm used to English prices, but it's a very very good beginner guitar (Mahogany body!!). My guitar teacher plays one and it's worth every penny. If you want to go for a Les Paul Studio then I'd recommend playing the exact one that they are trying to sell to you in the shop. Just make sure that the electronics are fully working and there are no unusual buzzes or anything like that. If you are unsure about anything just ask them to fetch another one and check that out.
#19
Quote by Oxig3n
*EDIT* What do you mean i wouldnt be able to tell the good Studios from the bad Studios? Are all studios not built with the same parts?

One important thing is that a guitar is made of wood, which has a bearing on it's tonal capabilities. Naturally, no two trees are exactly the same, so no two pieces of timber are, so no two electric guitars can be the same, even if they have been build with exactly the same technical specifications.
That goes for pretty much any kind of guitar.

Another thing is that the guitars we're talking about are all being made in factories by people who usually are not trained luthiers, but just people like you and me. Because of this, they only get to do small jobs, like putting in the truss rod or wiring the pickups. Such jobs are quite tiring and you sure can imagine that you lack concentration and dedication after doing the same thing over and over again for hours. As a consequence, the guitar's are often put together badly and will perform poorly. You often get badly filed nuts, sharp fret ends, bad wiring, etc.
Those are all small things, but if they accumulate (and often enough they do) the guitar is practically not usable. And Epiphone has become notorious for letting quality control slide concerning their lower end instruments.
On a side note, Epis have horrid stock pickups, even the Standard and Custom models.

Once again: There ARE good Studios. But unfortunately, there are also many bad ones.


@ Les Paul Ell: I see, I'll have a closer look at Pacificas and Vintages in the future.
Last edited by TheQuailman at Nov 19, 2008,
#20
Quote by TheQuailman
You're right, but he's only got 80 bucks.

ah, didn't see that
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Adam S3A monitors
Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
#21
Quote by TheQuailman
One important thing is that a guitar is made of wood, which has a bearing on it's tonal capabilities. Naturally, no two trees are exactly the same, so no two pieces of timber are, so no two electric guitars can be the same, even if they have been build with exactly the same technical specifications.
That goes for pretty much any kind of guitar.

Another thing is that the guitars we're talking about are all being made in factories by people who usually are not trained luthiers, but just people like you and me. Because of this, they only get to do small jobs, like putting in the truss rod or wiring the pickups. Such jobs are quite tiring and you sure can imagine that you lack concentration and dedication after doing the same thing over and over again for hours. As a consequence, the guitar's are often put together badly and will perform poorly. You often get badly filed nuts, sharp fret ends, bad wiring, etc.
Those are all small things, but if they accumulate (and often enough they do) the guitar is practically not usable. And Epiphone has become notorious for letting quality control slide concerning their lower end instruments.
On a side note, Epis have horrid stock pickups, even the Standard and Custom models.

Once again: There ARE good Studios. But unfortunately, there are also many bad ones.


@ Les Paul Ell: I see, I'll have a closer look at Pacificas and Vintages in the future.


Good advice. It's a shame but Gibson also have big quality control problems. Even more unfortunately, they can get away with it and still make tonnes of money as a company as people generally are buying the Gibson name.
#22
I'm just going to throw it out there for what it's worth.. I love my Epi LP Standard. Zero complaints about quality, sound, anything. Get one. Now. Do it.
#23
Argh, now I'm not sure what to get, the Studio is probably still top of the list as its definately better than the LP100 and Special II, and I'm not convinced the Vintange/Yamaha is better as ive seen quite a few people disagree strongly.

But I'm a brand new beginner to guitar, so surely the Studio will suffice while being better than the LP100 and Special II, right?

*EDIT*

Also, say I DO get the Studio, should I pay £180 for the Studio Chameleon, or pay £200 for the normal Studio??
#24
it is worth saving the extra for a standard. the studio model isnt up to much really... you should be able to get a used LP standard for about £200. that'll be grand.
Thank you please.
#25
Quote by deadlydunc
it is worth saving the extra for a standard. the studio model isnt up to much really... you should be able to get a used LP standard for about £200. that'll be grand.


Alright Ill try my best to get a Standard, if not ill have to get the Studio unfortunately it seems.

Whats the G-400 like for me needs and in comparison to the Les Paul Studio/Standard?
#27
Just saying, you're saying you're a brand new beginner to a guitar.. Maybe for practicality you'd want to go pick up something second hand, just incase you get outrageously frustrated and decide you want nothing to do with guitar.. You could resell a second hand guitar and not lose as much money as you would reselling a guitar you bought new?

I started on a.. I don't even know what it was but it wasn't great, but because it wasn't great I wrote the numbers of each fret on the neck to help me memorize where each fret was, which was a huge help for me at the time.

But again, I'll stand behind my Les Paul Standard almost enough to say that if it disappoints you I'll personally buy it from you.
#28
Quote by moofoodooloo
Just saying, you're saying you're a brand new beginner to a guitar.. Maybe for practicality you'd want to go pick up something second hand, just incase you get outrageously frustrated and decide you want nothing to do with guitar.. You could resell a second hand guitar and not lose as much money as you would reselling a guitar you bought new?

I started on a.. I don't even know what it was but it wasn't great, but because it wasn't great I wrote the numbers of each fret on the neck to help me memorize where each fret was, which was a huge help for me at the time.

But again, I'll stand behind my Les Paul Standard almost enough to say that if it disappoints you I'll personally buy it from you.


Heh, I don't think I'll get frustrated/quit guitar, I can play Piano at a pretty good level, so I'll stick with guitar. I REALLY want to learn to play.

So about that site, should I buy the Les Paul Standard from there?
#29
Quote by Oxig3n
Argh, now I'm not sure what to get, the Studio is probably still top of the list as its definately better than the LP100 and Special II, and I'm not convinced the Vintange/Yamaha is better as ive seen quite a few people disagree strongly.
Take it from someone who owns a couple of Epis and a Gibson Custom Shop: Vintage are just as good as Epi but cost less. Vintage are actually made in the same factory as Epi, so there you go.

But I'm a brand new beginner to guitar, so surely the Studio will suffice while being better than the LP100 and Special II, right?
Why spend £200 on a Studio now that you'll be replacing in 6 months? Waste of £200 to be quite honest.

Also, say I DO get the Studio, should I pay £180 for the Studio Chameleon, or pay £200 for the normal Studio??
The Chameleon usually costs more than the regular. Huh.
Basically the only difference is the Chameleon has the special 'flip flop colours, which change colour drastically depending on what light they're under and what angle you're looking at them from. They'll do things like change from blue to green to purple, from silver to pink to orange, and so on. Since the LPs have curved tops you never get them in one solid colour, so it's a bit unusual. You may or not like it, it's quite an acquired taste.

Other than that - the Chameleon will be older. They stopped making those almost a year ago now, so any you buy now are obviously old stock that's been sitting around for a while. They won't have the better tuners and bridge that the newer made Epis have; the flip side is that generally the older Epis were made slightly better. All the Studios have always been rubbish though so this is a moot point.




Overall, save up a little bit more money, and get a Vintage or Rally LP (Rally are another 'copy' brand like Vintage, they're made in the same place and are essentually identical). You can buy a Vintage or Rally LP that is the same quality as an Epi Standard, for only a tiny bit more money than an Epi Studio.
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#30
Quote by MrFlibble
Take it from someone who owns a couple of Epis and a Gibson Custom Shop: Vintage are just as good as Epi but cost less. Vintage are actually made in the same factory as Epi, so there you go.

Why spend £200 on a Studio now that you'll be replacing in 6 months? Waste of £200 to be quite honest.

The Chameleon usually costs more than the regular. Huh.
Basically the only difference is the Chameleon has the special 'flip flop colours, which change colour drastically depending on what light they're under and what angle you're looking at them from. They'll do things like change from blue to green to purple, from silver to pink to orange, and so on. Since the LPs have curved tops you never get them in one solid colour, so it's a bit unusual. You may or not like it, it's quite an acquired taste.

Other than that - the Chameleon will be older. They stopped making those almost a year ago now, so any you buy now are obviously old stock that's been sitting around for a while. They won't have the better tuners and bridge that the newer made Epis have; the flip side is that generally the older Epis were made slightly better. All the Studios have always been rubbish though so this is a moot point.




Overall, save up a little bit more money, and get a Vintage or Rally LP (Rally are another 'copy' brand like Vintage, they're made in the same place and are essentually identical). You can buy a Vintage or Rally LP that is the same quality as an Epi Standard, for only a tiny bit more money than an Epi Studio.


Ah right, well I'll be getting the Epi LP Standard if anyone can confirm the one on this site:

http://www.mzonline.co.uk/epiphone-les-paul-standard-ebony--black-101-p.asp

is actually the Epi LP Standard. Then I'll get it.
#31
Quote by Oxig3n
Thanks guys but the MOST i have to spend on the guitar is £180, and then £80 for all the other stuff; amp, stand, straps, tuner, picks.

Thats why i thought the Epi Les Paul Chameleon Studio was good, as it's only £179. I thought it was the best guitar within my £180 limit.

*EDIT* What do you mean i wouldnt be able to tell the good Studios from the bad Studios? Are all studios not built with the same parts?

But, would you guys pay an extra £70 to get a Studio over a Special II ?


get a yamaha pacifica 112v (£160 or so) and a roland microcube (£60) or vox da5 (similar price to microcube). for a lot of the stuff you play, you'd need single coils, but the pacifica still has the bridge humbucker for the heavier stuff. those low-end epiphones are meant to be not very good. at all.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#32
Quote by Oxig3n
But I'm a brand new beginner to guitar, so surely the Studio will suffice while being better than the LP100 and Special II, right?


regardless of your level on guitar, it makes no sense to buy a guitar which you know is worse, when there are better options available for the same or less money. it's a false economy.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#33
Quote by Dave_Mc
regardless of your level on guitar, it makes no sense to buy a guitar which you know is worse, when there are better options available for the same or less money. it's a false economy.



Yeah I know its just >

"Ah right, well I'll be getting the Epi LP Standard if anyone can confirm the one on this site:

http://www.mzonline.co.uk/epiphone-...black-101-p.asp

is actually the Epi LP Standard. Then I'll get it."

Its pretty cheap for the Standard, elsewhere it costs £260-£300
#34
It's clear that this kid wants an epiphone, nothing is changing his mind, the quailman has provided flawless evidence that he should go for something other than the studio, then he claims that the LP studio is still top of his list.

So I say, buy it, you're doing noone any favours by trying to trick yourself into thinking that you need help with this decision, many people do the same, they'll say "Which guitar should I get out of [big list]" then go onto say how much they want one of them but still want opinions, if you've made your mind up don't waste everyone's finger energy

But as the amp thing still seems to be open, I'd say a Vox AD15 is very worthwhile, as are the roland cube series, but )if you can make the price) the Laney LC series is class for the price, £150 for a 15 watt valve amp that's proffesional quality (ask Paul Gilbert )

And if that guitar's on a website with other real guitars and isn't clearly fake, it's real.
#35
Quote by Oxig3n
Ah right, well I'll be getting the Epi LP Standard if anyone can confirm the one on this site:

http://www.mzonline.co.uk/epiphone-les-paul-standard-ebony--black-101-p.asp

is actually the Epi LP Standard. Then I'll get it.
If it says it's a Standard then it must be, otherwise they'd be taken to court for false advertising.

The thing that strikes me though is they list the wood as being mahogany/alder, which suggests their stock is very old. About three years ago Epi started making their Standards without alder (don't worry, they're better off without the alder!), so if they're still selling Standards made with alder, then those guitars must be at least three years old if not older, and if a guitar's just been sitting in a warehouse for three years, it's not going to be in very good condition.

Or of course they've just been lazy and not updated their website in a long time!

Also as far as prices go, it could be just because of the plain black finish that one has. Some finishes cost more/less than others.
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#36
Theres a chance it is old stock, but that always means there's a chance it's better quality (if it's from before Epiphone started going downhill or early in it's mayhem) you can always clean it up to make it feel good as new.
#37
Quote by Punk_Ninja
It's clear that this kid wants an epiphone, nothing is changing his mind, the quailman has provided flawless evidence that he should go for something other than the studio, then he claims that the LP studio is still top of his list.

So I say, buy it, you're doing noone any favours by trying to trick yourself into thinking that you need help with this decision, many people do the same, they'll say "Which guitar should I get out of [big list]" then go onto say how much they want one of them but still want opinions, if you've made your mind up don't waste everyone's finger energy

But as the amp thing still seems to be open, I'd say a Vox AD15 is very worthwhile, as are the roland cube series, but )if you can make the price)

And if that guitar's on a website with other real guitars and isn't clearly fake, it's real.


+1

also that epi LP standard says the body is mahogany/alder- isn't that one of the older ones which aren't meant to be so good? could be wrong, though.

what mr flibble said, in other words, he beat me to it.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#38
At least have a look at these:
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/search/index/?keyword=ibanez+rg+321&search_button=
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop/flypage/product_id/17529

Epiphone LP Standards are not good unless you change the pickups. The cheaper models usually aren't good no matter what you do.

By the way, I believe the site you linked to is legit. Like Flibble said, the finish makes a difference in pricing and sometimes you're just lucky. Which is the case with the Yamaha Pacifica 412 I linked to, too. Nice guitar, usually costs 250 pounds or more.

EDIT:
Look man, we're not trying to force our opinions on you (though it may seem like it), we're trying to help you. I know that Punk_Ninja, Flibble and Dave are experienced people who have played lots and lots of guitars, and they sure will tell you that I know this and that about guitars as well.
That's four guys already who advise you to rethink your decision.

Just pointing this out.
Last edited by TheQuailman at Nov 20, 2008,
#39
Well ive decided to spend the extra for the Standard as you guys say its alot better than the Special II/100/Studio.

I've emailed the shop asking if its older stock or if they just havent updated their site, ill ask for a serial number so i can check for myself aswell.
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