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#1
2/12/2011 - Build Restarted. Page 4 post 61 for details.


v OLD PLAN, NOT CORRECT ANYMORE v


Alright, I suppose I should post this, considering I started purchasing parts yesterday. But I won't start putting things together until I'm done with exams on the 15th.

The plan is to build a prototype for my company if I actually go through with it. I'm using a shape of my own design, which I've never seen on a guitar before. It will have a traditional head, with traditional tuners, but the head will be in my signature shape.

I am building a custom, experimental tailpiece to replace the stopbar associated with a normal T.O.M. bridge. I drew up plans for a homemade T.O.M. bridge, but I haven't decided if I will build it or just buy one.

I'm not sure about the electronics, they depend on what I get for Christmas. I asked for upgraded pickups for my Les Paul, and if I get them I'll put the old pickups in this build, but I'll take them apart and wire them for coil split. If I don't get them, I'll probably steal the pups from my coffin guitar build.

Alright, so I got a good deal on a mahogany body blank big enough for a strat size body on the internet this morning. It only cost $30 shipped.

For the neck, I'm looking at a padouk neck blank right now, as it sounds like the tone would compliment the mahogany of the body nicely. It is more money than a mahogany or maple neck blank would be though, so I don't know if I will buy it. It's gonna be close whether or not I can squeeze in under budget.

I also purchased a quilted maple top yesterday, but I don't think I'm gonna use it on this build. It was the same price as every other top, with just as good of figure, but it's big enough for a double neck. I've been wanting to do a double neck for a while, so I'll probably save it for that. Also, it's only a 1/4" thick, and I want to do a carve with this build, and that's not thick enough.

Oh, and I almost forgot, I'm looking at a rosewood fingerboard blank, and It's gonna be a 25" or 25.25" scale. I find the 25.5" scale of fenders a bit awkward, but a gibson/epiphone 24.75" scale feels a bit cramped.

I will be staining the quilted maple, but I haven't decided the color yet. The back will either be natural or black, and it will have white binding around the edge of the body, fretboard, and head.

Alright, so now that I've typed a book to start this thread, Pics of my plans are in the next post, to keep this one readable on a non-widescreen monitor.
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Last edited by DuctTapeNinja at Feb 12, 2011,
#2
The Body design: (Neck is not correct length in this pic)



The homemade T.O.M. which I have the tools to build (including access to a lathe to make the studs that hold it up) but probably don't have the scrap metal.



And the tailpiece design. Does anyone know if 2 Bass strings will hold the entire draw of a guitar strung with 11's and tuned to E standard?



So, that's the plan. Well, besides the excel spreadsheet with the prices for each part, where to buy, etc, which is keeping me on track to stay on budget.......barely.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#3
looks like a wicked body what do you mean by "bass string" at the outer sides behind the tailpiece?

sorry, I'm unqualified in guitar building:P
I fell asleep on my arm once, scariest thing that ever happened to me. I thought it was kill.
#4
Quote by Lord Waltaa
looks like a wicked body what do you mean by "bass string" at the outer sides behind the tailpiece?

sorry, I'm unqualified in guitar building:P
The actual tailpiece is not attached to the body. The two pieces at the ends of the bass strings (strings from a bass guitar) are bolted down. The actual tailpiece will be suspended by this when it's tuned up. I will put some rubber on the bottom to protect the finish when I change the strings. :p
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#5
Quote by DuctTapeNinja
And the tailpiece design. Does anyone know if 2 Bass strings will hold the entire draw of a guitar strung with 11's and tuned to E standard?



Dude...

The tailpiece is floating there after the bridge attached to bass strings(?!) bolted to the body?

That is pretty bold, there's gonne be some ****ing tensin on those two bolted parts where bass strings connect to the body. They better go quite deep in to the body to actually staay on the guitar. And really, you really thinking bass guitar strings? They're going to stretch due time too. Innovative yes, but that's gonna bring some problems.
#6
Beast... It looks good. I'm confused as to what the tailpiece does differently, but I'm sure its a good idea.

By the way, where are you on the coffin build?
CuSO4

"I don't have an instrument, I don't have a great voice, I just have some nice clothes maybe." paul rutherford
#7
Only prob I see is the big 'ol chunk cut out of the back. That'll diminish your sustain, even with mahogany.But hey man, it's your axe. Welcome to the builders club where our motto is trial and error, tried and true.
Scarred for life!

Rig:
Gibson LPC
Jackson DK10D
Fender HM Strat
Custom built Tele-type
Alvarez 5040 Koa
Epiphone 12 string
Blue Voodoo 50
Dunlop 213 slide
Fender M-80 chorus
Digitech Jimi Hendrix Experience
#8
Quote by Keskimaki
That is pretty bold, there's gonne be some ****ing tensin on those two bolted parts where bass strings connect to the body. They better go quite deep in to the body to actually staay on the guitar.
I know, the plan is to use screws that are about 1.5" long. That should be long enough. And I'll get them in grade 8 (extra hard) if I can. There's a place where I should be able to get them for free.

Quote by Keskimaki
And really, you really thinking bass guitar strings? They're going to stretch due time too. Innovative yes, but that's gonna bring some problems.
I'm alright with a little stretching over time. I'm more worried about them breaking and sending the tailpiece flying.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#9
the bass string part wont work...you need something stable and obviously the strings will stretch and may even need tuning themselves-which would mean you would counter tune them when you tune your guitar. there's a reason why bridges are typically bolted.
EDIT: Not only that. but when you bend the strings on your guitar the bridge will move sideways. Also intonation is key to everything and it just cant happen if the bridge is moving up down and left and right...sorry man
people with large sig's are clearly compensating for something.
Last edited by Lamrick21 at Dec 4, 2008,
#10
what would you hope to gain by having the floating tailpiece....it would just be an extra brick of useless metal complicating things. you still have the strings bolted to the body with these bass strings..... once the strings hit the TOM thats the scale length, if you're trying to get length out of the strings for more sustain etc., you could instead just move the stopbar farther back, eliminating the float.... it seems like that would be just one more thing to go wrong, and not something that could bring much if any benefit.. not trying to be a douche, just interested in what you hope to gain by doing this...
#11
Quote by Hereiwas
Beast... It looks good. I'm confused as to what the tailpiece does differently, but I'm sure its a good idea.

By the way, where are you on the coffin build?
The tailpiece does the same thing, but it's suspended in mid air by the strings. I should have the first coat of paint down on the coffin in another two weeks.

Quote by damskippy
Only prob I see is the big 'ol chunk cut out of the back. That'll diminish your sustain, even with mahogany.But hey man, it's your axe. Welcome to the builders club where our motto is trial and error, tried and true.
Currently I'm playing on a cheap ($100) strat copy and a Epi LP100. This should have more sustain than either one, even without the chunk. :p

Oh, and if anyone's wondering, I didn't take a design and cut a chunk out, I drew that all up free hand from nothing. The horns kinda turned out strat-like, though. :p Probably my strat copy influencing me unconsiously.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#12
Quote by Lamrick21
the bass string part wont work...you need something stable and obviously the strings will stretch and may even need tuning themselves-which would mean you would counter tune them when you tune your guitar. there's a reason why bridges are typically bolted.
They will stretch a little, but as long as they don't break, I see no problem. Tuning up will work the same, although I will probably have to tune each string 2 or 3 times, as with a floating trem, since one string getting tighter will influence the tension in the rest.
Quote by cthuludawn21
what would you hope to gain by having the floating tailpiece
It looks cool.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#13
Quote by Lamrick21
Not only that. but when you bend the strings on your guitar the bridge will move sideways. Also intonation is key to everything and it just cant happen if the bridge is moving up down and left and right...sorry man
Bridge is bolted down as with any T.O.M. bridge. The tailpiece is the suspended piece.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#14
what if instead of using bass strings, you use metal bars, still get the cool float, but a much more stable design without the possibility of bass string snap, etc. i imagine those strings would be under considerable tension. 2 strings holding back 6 strings is bad math. this design would also alleviate the need for rubber, as when the strings are off, then that would still be "floating".. nother cool possible idea, keep the metal bars for strength, but put them in a ball pivot connecting to the part attached to the body, and change the tom to a roller bridge, i.e. gretsch, so that pushing down lightly on the floating stopbar would raise the pitch a little?
#15
I was doing a little research on your "floating" stop bar design. I can't come up with any dimesional parameter stats on whether your bass strings could give support to the six 11s but your geometry is gonna be a hair odd. You'd better have the machining angle for the anchor points on the S.B. figured out, as well as the distance to the S.B. to the actual anchor points figured out, or the height required at the bridge to maintain an effective angle at the S.B., will elevate the action to an uncomfortable level. Too little pressure between the anchors and S.B.= too little sustain, too much= torquing angle. But it looks like you've done your research, have you got the geometry of your S.B. design down?
Scarred for life!

Rig:
Gibson LPC
Jackson DK10D
Fender HM Strat
Custom built Tele-type
Alvarez 5040 Koa
Epiphone 12 string
Blue Voodoo 50
Dunlop 213 slide
Fender M-80 chorus
Digitech Jimi Hendrix Experience
#16
Quote by cthuludawn21
what if instead of using bass strings, you use metal bars, still get the cool float, but a much more stable design without the possibility of bass string snap, etc. i imagine those strings would be under considerable tension. 2 strings holding back 6 strings is bad math. this design would also alleviate the need for rubber, as when the strings are off, then that would still be "floating".. nother cool possible idea, keep the metal bars for strength, but put them in a ball pivot connecting to the part attached to the body, and change the tom to a roller bridge, i.e. gretsch, so that pushing down lightly on the floating stopbar would raise the pitch a little?
Believe me, I've considered all this, but the reason I want to use bass strings is they're simple, and I should be able to get them for free from some bassist who just changed his strings. Also, I think it'd look cooler, even if the metal bar could move
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#17
Quote by damskippy
I was doing a little research on your "floating" stop bar design. I can't come up with any dimesional parameter stats on whether your bass strings could give support to the six 11s but your geometry is gonna be a hair odd. You'd better have the machining angle for the anchor points on the S.B. figured out, as well as the distance to the S.B. to the actual anchor points figured out, or the height required at the bridge to maintain an effective angle at the S.B., will elevate the action to an uncomfortable level. Too little pressure between the anchors and S.B.= too little sustain, too much= torquing angle. But it looks like you've done your research, have you got the geometry of your S.B. design down?
The geometry will be a bit odd, but I think I've got it figured out well enough.


Alright, guys, I didn't expect so many questions so fast, or I would've posted this up earlier. I have to go to class now, but I'll answer any more when I return.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#18
i know that you like the idea of the bass strings, but have you considered the springs from the back of a guitar trem that could work also. and thinking about it, they have stuff that could grip on.

looks like a sweet build tho - i hope all goes well, im glad to be seeing someone else doing things differently
#19
Quote by CobenBlack
i know that you like the idea of the bass strings, but have you considered the springs from the back of a guitar trem that could work also. and thinking about it, they have stuff that could grip on.
I didn't think of that. That might look pretty neat too. Tuning would be harder though cuz the springs would stretch more. And I dunno if they'd be strong enough. There's a bit of a mechanical advantage involved at least in strat trems, where the springs actually aren't pulling the full force. I don't think it's a big difference, but it might be significant. I'll give them a little thought.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#21
Quote by guitarcam123
why can't you just bolt the tailpiece down?
Cuz it wouldn't look as cool.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#23
Chain would be neat.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#24
Alright, I've been sick, so I haven't made much progress, but I'm finally moving. There's been a few changes to the plan though, mostly because of the crappy piece of mahogany I got on eBay. It arrived with a nasty hook, a bunch of severe cracks, and it appeared to have been last touched by a chainsaw with a nasty temper. I should've been more careful. He didn't mention any of this stuff in the auction, but he also didn't explicitly say any of it wasn't there. I'll be honest. I got suckered. But I don't mind, as it was cheap and I got to leave him some nasty feedback.

However, the 1/4" thick quilty maple top I ordered is beautiful. So, this guitar will be a Home Depot special, in terms of wood choice, other than that. I purchased some poplar and oak for a 5 piece laminated neck-through and some pine for the wings. The quilted maple will go on top of this with a special stain, and the whole thing will get buried in clear, front and back.

I have a few choices for the fretboard. I have a stewmac rosewood blank, and some extra quilted maple that I was sent with the rest of the quilted maple. I'm thinking the body would look good with a black binding, to contrast with the light colored wood that makes up the majority of it. A rosewood fretboard doesn't look good with black binding, imo, and I don't mind the feel of a clearcoated maple fretboard, so I'm leaning that way at the moment. I'm not sure if I should stain it or leave it natural, though. I'm thinking of doing a brown stain, then sanding it back, so it just accentuates the quilt, without really changing the color of the board.

I'm not sure what to do for inlays yet, and am open to suggestions. Keep in mind I've never done inlays before.

So that's where I'm at.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
Last edited by DuctTapeNinja at Dec 23, 2008,
#26
shape kinda looks like a spider with a few of its legs cut off. i like it. im also very intrigued by your floating tail piece, and a chain would be bad ass as hell! can't wait to see where this goes
#27
Looks good,
but I just have to wonder why for the whole tailpiece thing.
Yeah, it looks cool I suppose...but strings stretch. So sure, they'll support it (maybe) but they'll stretch out and throw everything off.

I don't think it's worth it. It'll look cool for about 30 minutes, and then it'll piss you off.
#28
Quote by Duval67
Looks good,
but I just have to wonder why for the whole tailpiece thing.
Yeah, it looks cool I suppose...but strings stretch. So sure, they'll support it (maybe) but they'll stretch out and throw everything off.

I don't think it's worth it. It'll look cool for about 30 minutes, and then it'll piss you off.
Yeah, that's why I've decided on chain instead. It shouldn't stretch as much, and it's easier to ensure I get some that is strong enough to not break, sending the tailpiece flying into the next county. I found some from McMaster Carr that should do nicely.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#29
This will look BEASTLY.

but....how does one palm mute without getting a whammy/floyd rose effect?
BACK LIKE A HEART ATTACK
#30
Quote by Kai07
This will look BEASTLY.

but....how does one palm mute without getting a whammy/floyd rose effect?

you found the advantage! palm whammy!

the chains are a great idea, much better than bass strings, I am a bass payer and even those will eventually break, as I have found. now the body shape... it seems a little bit small. you may experience a little dive.
Quote by FatalGear41
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Quote by Jason Jillard
HUMANITY WHATS WRONG WITH YOU.


Warwick Fortress>>Acoustic AB50

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#31
Quote by the humanity
now the body shape... it seems a little bit small. you may experience a little dive.
The neck on the drawing I put up makes it seem a bit smaller than it will be. I didn't bother drawing the neck the correct length. In reality, the body will be about as big as a strat body.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#32
Quote by the humanity
you found the advantage! palm whammy!

the chains are a great idea, much better than bass strings, I am a bass payer and even those will eventually break, as I have found. now the body shape... it seems a little bit small. you may experience a little dive.


Quote by the humanity
palm whammy!




TS, DO THIS.

it'll sound so crazy live
BACK LIKE A HEART ATTACK
#33
Gettin close to cutting now. I've almost finished laminating the neck. One more lamination and it's done.

I lol'd at the palm whammy thing. I never use the trem on my Starcaster, but I'll at least play around with palm whammying. I mean, who wouldn't?

Oh, and Merry Christmas everyone! I got some nice Lace Sensors for my Starcaster, so the old pups from that will prolly end up in this build. I'd put the Sensors in this build, but I can't wait to try them out.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
Last edited by DuctTapeNinja at Dec 25, 2008,
#34
=o
PALM WHAMMY FTW!
I like the Idea of the tailpeice/stopbar, and if all goes well, I may build one for myself, if thats alright with you. Also, diggin the body shape


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#35
Alright guys, I'm back at college, so time is limited. I can only work on it when i go home for the weekends. As such, it's gonna be close whether or not i finish this before the end of january. So I'm eliminating the fun tailpiece and using a stopbar instead. Don't fear, I'm going to do another build over the summer, and it will definitely make it onto that one. Also, I'm ordering a pre-slotted fretboard off the internet. It should be here before friday, so I can proceed without any delays. As it sits, I have the body glued up and cut to shape, and sanded flush with the neck. The neck profile is rough cut, and I'll round it/etc next weekend probably, after gluing on the fretboard. Along with that, I'm going to try to get the control cavity routed and the quilted maple top glued on. Everything's progressing nicely, albeit slowly, and barring some major mishap I should finish on time. Unfortunately I forgot to take pictures before I left to come back to college, but I promise pics next weekend.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
#37
Well guys, I might've lost my chance to finish this by the end of January. I've been lazy and easily distracted, so I got almost nothing done this weekend. However, if I work fast, and don't make any mistakes, I can get it done next weekend and assemble it on the 31st. Anyway, here's pics: It's clamped down so I can finish leveling it so the top glues on nicely.





Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
Last edited by DuctTapeNinja at Jan 20, 2009,
#38
DTNinja all your builds are definately one of a kinds keep it up I like the creative ideas.
Hearing about a pair of great boobs is like hearing about a really cool bug or lizard as a kid and you just gotta see it.
#39
very cool.
Quote by FatalGear41
I wouldn't call what we have here on the Bass Forum a mentality. It's more like the sharing part of an AA meeting.

Quote by Jason Jillard
HUMANITY WHATS WRONG WITH YOU.


Warwick Fortress>>Acoustic AB50

http://www.myspace.com/rustingbloom
#40
This build has me nervous. I created a schedule for myself, so I could make sure I'd finish. It scares me. Sunday will make or break this build. A couple weeks ago I promised my grandfather I'd help set up his house for their Superbowl party, and it's gonna take a while. He runs an O-gauge train track around his house along the walls and behind couches and runs trains through the house during the game. It has to be perfect, though, or the trains can derail, or get caught in the curtains/couch, or the track can move, etc. Anyway, there's a lot I have to do on the build on sunday to keep on schedule. I've moved everything I can to saturday, and I will be returning from school monday night and staying till tuesday morning to work on it, as I have no classes till 1:00 on tuesdays. Things that need time to dry or cure (Glue,Paint,Stain) are a pain.
Quote by Øttər
Ninja, I dunno who you are but I like you.... so far....
Quote by Shaggy Shadric
My Teddy bear is God. DO NOT QUESTION MY TEDDY!
Quote by MatrixClaw
It's a good thing I like boobs or I'd be more pissed that you just bumped a 2 week old thread for that


Not part of the Bass Militia
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