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justin_fraser
AKA J-Frase
Join date: Jan 2006
50 IQ
#1
Well guys, the last singing thread was freakin' huge, so we figured that it was time to start up a new one. As you might have figured out, this is the thread where all questions pertaining to singing go. If you make a thread in the MT forum about singing, it will be closed, and the mods will tell you to come here, guaranteed.

Rules of the singing thread

There are only 3 rules guys, and they are pretty easy to follow.

1. No spam - this one should be pretty easy to follow. If you have a question, you ask
it. If you have a response to a question, you post it. Simple as that.

2. No flaming - this should also be really easy to follow. Just like our mothers have been telling us all of our lives; if we don’t have anything nice to say, don’t say anything at all. Not hard at all. If your question doesn’t get answered or it doesn’t get answered the way you like, just ask again and be more specific, don’t flip out on that person.

3. This is a renewed version of a old rule. This rule is no screaming questions. We do have a sound clip done by our own z4twnny (rock on Z!), so go to the bottom of this first post to find that. However, if you have a question, PM him, do not ask it in here, because posting that clip is going extremely far in the first place. My one hope with it is that the screaming questions will go away. And be so careful with it guys. You can ruin your voice so easily with screaming if done wrong.

Frequently Asked Questions

How do I sing?
Expel air through your mouth while making a noise pleasant to the ear. Easy enough I would think

But here are a few lessons that SingingSabre has written to help beginners…
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/general_music/singing_part_1.html
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/junkyard/singing_part_2.html
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/general_music/singing_part_3.html
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/general_music/singing_part_4.html

What about breathing?
Almost all of your breath should come from your diaphragm. Now you ask what a diaphragm is. It is a muscle right under your ribs that basically controls your lungs. When you breathe, your diaphragm contracts and air is brought into your lungs. When you breathe out, your diaphragm relaxes and air escapes through your mouth or nose. To breathe using your diaphragm, you have to imagine you are almost breathing from your toes. Breathe from deep within your stomach and you should feel your head go back and your chest should rise up. You may look stupid doing this, but you will get so much more air using your diaphragm. Now try breathing without your diaphragm. You can do this by raising your shoulders as you breathe. You will notice that you get considerably less air in your lung, therefore less air support.

How do I resonate?
Think of your head as acoustic guitar (as singingsabre put it). When you sing, if you raise your eyebrows, open your mouth, and almost put a smile on (even if its fake, doesn’t matter), your tone will increase considerably. That’s because the sound can resonate a lot more in your head, just as an acoustic guitar can resonate with all that space inside of it. If you try to sing with a scrunched up face with your eyebrows down as if you were mad, your tone will be very weak. Try them both out, and you will see. Now you may feel like an idiot for singing like this, but the truth is, when you are singing, people can’t tell facial expressions so an extreme extent. Its not a fashion show, it’s a singing show. You are there to sing and make great sound, not a great face.

How can I not be so nasally?
This is a problem that many singers face. You can mostly avoid this by opening your soft palate. You may ask what the soft palate is, well snort, the thing that vibrates, that’s your soft palate. Raise this by raising your eyebrows just like you would to have lots of resonance. Another trick so that you aren’t nasally (and this is the greatest trick in all of singing for me) is to keep your tongue at the bottom of your mouth rather than at the top. When you sing, air has to pass through your mouth. When your tongue is at the top of your mouth, the air has no where to go except through your nose, therefore creating a nasally sound. When you put your tongue more to the bottom than the top of your mouth, the air will go through your mouth and you will notice insane results immediately

How can I expand my range?
One of the most asked questions in the singing thread, and the answer never changes no matter who the person. Just sing! Every person has a different range and you cannot expect to be able to sing super high like lots of your hero’s. I am a low bass, and I know that I will never be able to sing along with some of my favorite singers. That’s just how it goes. Although there is a little thing called falsetto, it’s not the same. So just practice singing, and if you are a beginner you will find your range rather quickly. If you have been singing for a while, it will be much harder to expand your range. That’s why you have to accept your range for what it is but that doesn’t mean you should just give up. Keep singing, because I know guys that went from grade 10 only being able to sing middle C, to be able to sing the E above it by grade 12.

What is falsetto?
Falsetto is that little girly voice that guys have. To achieve falsetto, you have to crack your voice and keep it like that. It’s not a very practical way of singing, but for myself not being able to sing that E above middle C, I’ve gotten good enough from practice to disguise it from my chest voice.

How do I sing and play guitar at the same time?
Also a very common question, and one with an article in our own MT sticky here. It is right near the bottom of the sticky and will help you a lot…
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=503032

How can I take care of my voice?
On days that you are singing, try to only drink water (not cold) and tea. Coffee, pop, and alcohol are not good choices to drink on a day that you are supposed to sing. Especially if you have a gig of some sort. Dairy products also hinder your vocal cords. When you drink milk, it leaves behind a film in your throat which is not good for singing. This can be washed out with some water. And don’t smoke guys, it’s not good for you.

How can I stay in tune?

This comes with practice. It’s best to practice with live instruments as you will get a feel for what’s going on. Keep in mind that it’s very rare to have perfect pitch and to be able to hold a note for a long time without wavering off, so don’t get discouraged. Just keep practicing and it will get better.

How can I scream/growl?

Ok guys, after how many years of this thread, the truth is out, but its not up for debating. We have a sound clip done by a MT regular on how to scream. Its just the basics, but will stop all the stupid threads. I can not stress enough how dangerous screaming really is. You can ruin your voice so easily with it. If you feel any pain, stop immediately. Only do it when you feel no pain. So heres the link...

Screaming Clip


Try to ask your questions as clearly and detailed as possible. Doing this will ensure you are getting the right advice. Lets keep this place a learning environment and hopefully we can help many people improve their singing. Now, question time
Quote by funkdaddyfresh
justin, that was easily the most inspiring, helpful piece of advice anyone has ever given me in regards to my musical pursuits.


Screaming Help
Flaming Chaos
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2007
30 IQ
#2
any further tips at all on getting rid of nasal sound other than those in the first post? (which are great tips i must add)
also, anything to help projection across all of the range? i can hit good volumes on parts and not so good on others. just practise or are there some good techniques?
Guitars:
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Metallica Meat
Peace Brooother!
Join date: Jul 2008
50 IQ
#3
I have a Question

If your sorta new too singing Regularly, how do you keep from losing your voice constantly?
thats a problem ive had, and its taken almost 3 days too get it back
MichaelEMJAYARE
Last edited by Metallica Meat at Dec 14, 2008,
Flaming Chaos
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2007
30 IQ
#4
Quote by Metallica Meat
I have a Question

If your sorta new too singing Regularly, how do you keep from losing your voice constantly?
thats a problem ive had, and its taken almost 3 days too get it back

from my experience, if you lose your voice, you're pushing too hard, possibly for volume? just practise a lot but not forcing volume. build yourself up from quieter as you progress and eventually your voice will get used to adding more volume to it when needed. otherwise, im unsure
Guitars:
Jackson JS30KE Kelly
Jackson RRX10D
Fender Telecaster American Standard
Epiphone Acoustic
Amps:
Vox DA15
Marshall G80RCD
Pedals:
Boss GT-6
Boss MT-2
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
Join date: Aug 2006
230 IQ
#5
Quote by Metallica Meat
I have a Question

If your sorta new too singing Regularly, how do you keep from losing your voice constantly?
thats a problem ive had, and its taken almost 3 days too get it back


The only solution is to sing with proper technique. In nearly all cases, that means taking lessons.

Keep doing what you're doing and you will risk requiring surgery to even get your proper speaking voice back.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
Join date: Aug 2006
230 IQ
#6
Quote by Flaming Chaos
any further tips at all on getting rid of nasal sound other than those in the first post? (which are great tips i must add)
also, anything to help projection across all of the range? i can hit good volumes on parts and not so good on others. just practise or are there some good techniques?


Check www.thebelcantotechnique.com and go to the How it Works tab. The lift of the throat helps to relax the throat. The mask of the face helps to get the voice out of the throat and in front of the face.... the beginning of projection. Inhalation helps with resonance. The hold of the breath helps with projection.

The nasal sound specifically happens as a result of the sound being produced and resonating too far towards the soft palate and into the throat. You want the sound to resonate in your sinus cavities, which means having the sound away from your throat and soft palate. Placing it in front of your face helps to keep it away from your throat too.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
demonofthenight
UG Spammer
Join date: Mar 2007
91 IQ
#7
Quote by Flaming Chaos
any further tips at all on getting rid of nasal sound other than those in the first post? (which are great tips i must add)
also, anything to help projection across all of the range? i can hit good volumes on parts and not so good on others. just practise or are there some good techniques?
I've found tilting my head back and extending my neck (but don't strain your neck) and looking upwards helps a bit with resonation and not sounding nasally. Smiling also helps alot. Pity it makes me look like a dick, but it'd probably be great for recording.

Flattening my tounge like (I think) CT said also helps alot.

If your sorta new too singing Regularly, how do you keep from losing your voice constantly?
As in, you run out of breath? Make sure you are singing with your diaphram (you should be using your stomach/abs, and not your upper torso, to sing) and let out as little air as possible but make as much sound as possible (if that makes sense). I guess you have to find a balance between how much air you let out and the volume you make.

Just a few tips my sister gave me (who's an awesome singer)
Flaming Chaos
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2007
30 IQ
#8
cheers for the tips guys, much appreciated
Guitars:
Jackson JS30KE Kelly
Jackson RRX10D
Fender Telecaster American Standard
Epiphone Acoustic
Amps:
Vox DA15
Marshall G80RCD
Pedals:
Boss GT-6
Boss MT-2
Cyberbob
Floating In Space
Join date: Oct 2004
30 IQ
#9
Quote by Flaming Chaos
any further tips at all on getting rid of nasal sound other than those in the first post? (which are great tips i must add)
also, anything to help projection across all of the range? i can hit good volumes on parts and not so good on others. just practise or are there some good techniques?


I'm not sure what exactly you mean by nasal sound (it can mean a lot of things), do you have an example. Just for your information, during correct singing there is no resonance in the nose, you should be able to shut your nostrils with your fingers and the sound should be exactly the same. I believe only certain (and rarely used) vowels require resonance there.

Regarding volume, you should find higher parts easier to sing loud and lower parts harder to sing with high volume (obviously dependant on your range). This is perfectly normal. Low notes are hard to sing loud, but there are tricks around this. This will be a bit technical, but bear with me and I'll try make it as simple as possible.
Firstly, any note sung is not a single solitary note but a harmonious group of notes of varying volumes (with the exception of certain vowels).



If you look to the left of this diagram (its a bad example but I can't find anything better) it shows a Bb4 and G4. Notice the range being sung and the strength shown by the thickness of the lines. How the lower frequencies are weak and the middle ones are strong. Even when singing lower notes correctly this does not really change. The low notes will still not be as prominent, but manipulation of the voice can essentially trick the ear into perceiving the lower note as the most prominent.

This is done through manipulation of vowels and is particularly useful at sounding out notes you otherwise could not. This is an advanced technique best understood with a teacher who can tell you where you are aiming wrong.

Essentially, for yourself, if you are having trouble maintaining volume on a particular piece, then seek to alter the vowel so as to have maximum resonance. This page here I find useful since it demonstrates the vowels for you. Remember that closed vowels (ah as in 'father') are harder to put volume into whereas open vowels (eeee as in 'beet') are easier to produce loud volume in. (just so you know, I believe the reverse is also true).

I'm not sure if that helps you or not, I think I've gone on more of a tangent than answering the question, but its just something useful I've been learning about recently.
Martyr's Prayer
Hates his username.
Join date: Aug 2005
60 IQ
#10
Quote by axemanchris
The only solution is to sing with proper technique. In nearly all cases, that means taking lessons.

Keep doing what you're doing and you will risk requiring surgery to even get your proper speaking voice back.

CT


I have questions about that as well. I've never lost my voice singing or screaming, and on only a few occasions have I felt any amount of pain. When I sing a lot my tone never really changes except it gets a bit more full (maybe just because I get warmed up), but when I'm not singing it has very slight effects on my voice. Like when I'm talking with no breath support in a quieter voice, it cracks a lot more.

This doesn't happen often. Basicly, tl;dr, I'm just wondering how much change in your voice is too much? I don't think that any singer (save the few who know true Bel Canto, of course), can sing for a good amount of time without experiencing any changes. Is that true?
We're only strays.
MusicalMinority
someone's listening in.
Join date: Dec 2006
130 IQ
#11
This is an idea I mentioned in the Chat thread, but could one of the singing gurus make some videos demonstrating proper technique and stick 'em on YouTube? I mean, all that you guys have typed up on the first post is brilliant and all, but some people learn best by listening and doing, not necessarily reading the theory. I, for one, learn a LOT better when I can actually hear/see the difference between right and wrong technique.

Just a thought, but I think it'd be really good for all the beginners here.

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE
lcphr3ak
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2007
10 IQ
#12
Would a classic rock type grit be considered screaming? I'm thinking Bon Scott, Steve Tyler, Axle Rose, Blackie Lawless, etc. I'd like to know how to get that quality into my voice.
demonofthenight
UG Spammer
Join date: Mar 2007
91 IQ
#13
^yes and no

Melodic screamers (like Alexi Laiho from Bodom and Mikael Åkerfeldt from Opeth) probably use similar techniques to how Rob Halford grits his voice in some of his songs. They're still playing a melody, just gritting it up to various levels.

But non-melodic screamers (as heard in screamo and *core music) uses completely different techniques and is pretty much just barking out words in time to the music.

To get a melodic scream, follow this link: https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/member.php?u=258661
This really helped me.
xrawrockkillsx
Im Back Baby!
Join date: Oct 2005
190 IQ
#14
how bad are pure throat screams for you? it sounds better for me, and i have more control over it, but im worried itll eventually mess me up.

oh, and if growls come from pushing from the diaphram, how can my screamer growl at less than a speaking volume?
demonofthenight
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Join date: Mar 2007
91 IQ
#15
Quote by xrawrockkillsx
how bad are pure throat screams for you? it sounds better for me, and i have more control over it, but im worried itll eventually mess me up.

oh, and if growls come from pushing from the diaphram, how can my screamer growl at less than a speaking volume?
Don't. Honestly this will be the best advice anyone can give you about your voice. Stop throat screaming and scream using z4's method (the link I gave you). That idiot from bullet for my valentine or avenged 7 fold or something destroyed his voice and needed surgery just to start singing again.

I'm not really that good at it, but I think all you do is apply pressure in your diaphram (I know Chris want's to E-slap me at the moment) and lower your voice to a whisper. It should come out raspy and gritty. Painless and relatively safe and you can still maintain a singing melody (which is the most important part of singing).

Seriously, don't scream with your throat. Best case scenario you have a permanently raspy voice or you get a few throat warts which go away, worst case scenario is that you become a mute.
lcphr3ak
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2007
10 IQ
#16
Quote by demonofthenight
^yes and no

Melodic screamers (like Alexi Laiho from Bodom and Mikael Åkerfeldt from Opeth) probably use similar techniques to how Rob Halford grits his voice in some of his songs. They're still playing a melody, just gritting it up to various levels.

But non-melodic screamers (as heard in screamo and *core music) uses completely different techniques and is pretty much just barking out words in time to the music.

To get a melodic scream, follow this link: https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/member.php?u=258661
This really helped me.


Not sure if you're referring to me, but if you are, thanks for responding

Listening to that, I can come to a conclusion that what I'm talking about is definitely not screaming. What I seek is a (instead of specific singers, maybe they're more recognized by their band) AC/DC (older), W.A.S.P., Aerosmith, Buckcherry (not older, but same type of goal), etc. type sound. I just envy them for their ability to sing with a edge to their voice.
demonofthenight
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#17
Quote by lcphr3ak
Not sure if you're referring to me, but if you are, thanks for responding

Listening to that, I can come to a conclusion that what I'm talking about is definitely not screaming. What I seek is a (instead of specific singers, maybe they're more recognized by their band) AC/DC (older), W.A.S.P., Aerosmith, Buckcherry (not older, but same type of goal), etc. type sound. I just envy them for their ability to sing with a edge to their voice.
Same-ish technique (I think), just don't apply it as heavily.
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[U]     | \|_ |     |     .-|      [/U]
      *-|-*    (_)     `-’
        |
        L.
xrawrockkillsx
Im Back Baby!
Join date: Oct 2005
190 IQ
#18
Quote by demonofthenight
Don't. Honestly this will be the best advice anyone can give you about your voice. Stop throat screaming and scream using z4's method (the link I gave you). That idiot from bullet for my valentine or avenged 7 fold or something destroyed his voice and needed surgery just to start singing again.

I'm not really that good at it, but I think all you do is apply pressure in your diaphram (I know Chris want's to E-slap me at the moment) and lower your voice to a whisper. It should come out raspy and gritty. Painless and relatively safe and you can still maintain a singing melody (which is the most important part of singing).

Seriously, don't scream with your throat. Best case scenario you have a permanently raspy voice or you get a few throat warts which go away, worst case scenario is that you become a mute.


i can do one from like the very back/bottom of my throat to where it doesnt hurt my throat at all. i have the one that sounds great, but it sucks a weewee for my throat so im probably not gonna do it, but is the other one safe?

thanks for the growling tips. ill try it.
lcphr3ak
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2007
10 IQ
#19
Quote by demonofthenight
Same-ish technique (I think), just don't apply it as heavily.


I guess, it'll probably take some work (it seems like what he is doing is a lot different), but I can see what you're saying
Valderama
CxC
Join date: Nov 2004
130 IQ
#20
Hey guys, question:

When im sorta singing to a song while playing (no mic - just sort of singing like i think i would with a mic) i appear to be hitting the right notes and have it sounding right,but when i eventually sing into a mic at practice or whatever, its usually slightly off, even after i warm up.
Can the volume of my singing effect my pitch?
michal23
=D
Join date: Jan 2007
117 IQ
#21
I think we've all noticed that when we record ourselves, we always hate what we sound like, no matter how normal it may sound to others.

But when we listen to ourselves as we talk, we sound normal to ourselves - but we think we sound different than we do.

When we ask other people how we sound, they tell us we sound normal; but I don't particularly like to rely on the opinions of others...

So my question is, how can we judge our voice without any such biases and without getting anyone else to judge us?
ADireStraight
Registered User
Join date: May 2008
10 IQ
#22
Anyone wanna give feedback on my singing, "all i want is you" u2 cover in my profile

To the poster above me, I know exactly what you're talking about. I have been trying to learn to sing for a couple of months now and I'm still not close to being happy with my singing voice/tone although i think ive learned how to semi-properly sing now with my diaphragm and that so i doubt the tone will improve/change drastically from now on, I guess its mostly a confidence issue and just becoming used to it
tobysaurus
UG Newbie
Join date: Apr 2007
10 IQ
#23
So i recently recorded a short song and decided for the first time ever i would put vocals on it.

It didn't come out as planned and i'm really not happy with my voice at all but can't for the life of me figure what i'm doing wrong and what i need to do to correct it

any pointers?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=z21rkXsNAqY
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#24
How do i get rid of those few notes that dont make any sound between my low voice and my hight voice(falsetto i think)?
Martyr's Prayer
Hates his username.
Join date: Aug 2005
60 IQ
#25
Quote by demonofthenight
Don't. Honestly this will be the best advice anyone can give you about your voice. Stop throat screaming and scream using z4's method (the link I gave you). That idiot from bullet for my valentine or avenged 7 fold or something destroyed his voice and needed surgery just to start singing again.

I'm not really that good at it, but I think all you do is apply pressure in your diaphram (I know Chris want's to E-slap me at the moment) and lower your voice to a whisper. It should come out raspy and gritty. Painless and relatively safe and you can still maintain a singing melody (which is the most important part of singing).

Seriously, don't scream with your throat. Best case scenario you have a permanently raspy voice or you get a few throat warts which go away, worst case scenario is that you become a mute.


I dunno about that. To my knowledge, I throat scream. I inhale correctly, I use my diaphragm, but I scream with my throat. It never hurts, though. And a lot of the screamers in bands (bands like Misery Signals, Veil of Maya) definitely throat scream. There is no way you can get such a full, aggressive sound otherwise.

My question is, if something doesn't hurt your throat or effect your singing at all, could it still be doing irreparable damage?
We're only strays.
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
Join date: Aug 2006
230 IQ
#26
Quote by Valderama
When im sorta singing to a song while playing ... i appear to be hitting the right notes and have it sounding right,but when i eventually sing into a mic at practice or whatever, its usually slightly off, even after i warm up.
Can the volume of my singing effect my pitch?


There are a few things at work here. Maybe all of them, or maybe just one.

1. When you sing loudly, you use more air. This might cause you to sing sharp if you're not careful. When you sing quietly, you use less air. This could cause you to sing flat.
2. You may think you sound fine singing along with the recording, but using a mic can be like putting your voice under the microscope. Now that people can *really* hear it, we can hear the inaccuracies that went unnoticed before.
3. similar to #2, when you sing into a mic, you sound a lot louder. This can cause you to become much more self-conscious, which will adversely affect your pitch.... usually towards going flat, as being inhibited means less air...
4. Hearing yourself singing into a mic can be disorienting at first. You create your voice in the center of your head, where the mic is, but you hear your voice coming out 15 feet away to your left, or whatever.... it really messes you up at first. This compounds the issues in #3.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
Join date: Aug 2006
230 IQ
#27
Quote by michal23
I think we've all noticed that when we record ourselves, we always hate what we sound like, no matter how normal it may sound to others.

But when we listen to ourselves as we talk, we sound normal to ourselves - but we think we sound different than we do.

When we ask other people how we sound, they tell us we sound normal; but I don't particularly like to rely on the opinions of others...

So my question is, how can we judge our voice without any such biases and without getting anyone else to judge us?


The more you record yourself singing, the more you can reconcile the difference between that voice you hear and the voice others hear. You hear yourself, but you have a really good idea what others are hearing too. It's kinda like knowing what your guitar and amp sound like, but playing with the volume off on the guitar. Even though all you hear is 'plink, plink, plink,' you can aurally 'visualize' well what the end result will really sound like.

From there, you can hear what you need to hear - pitch, resonance, etc. - and make adjustments accordingly as you sing. If those things are good in your own head as you hear them, they'll sound fine out front.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
Join date: Aug 2006
230 IQ
#28
Quote by ADireStraight
Anyone wanna give feedback on my singing, "all i want is you" u2 cover in my profile

... i think ive learned how to semi-properly sing now with my diaphragm and that so i doubt the tone will improve/change drastically from now on, I guess its mostly a confidence issue and just becoming used to it


The last bit sorta caught me first... Your tone is dependent upon breath support with the diaphragm, yes. But, perhaps even more importantly, your tone is dependent upon how it resonates. If your voice is resonating in your sinus cavities and in your chest, you will get a tone (round, rich, vibrant) worlds better than if it is resonating in the back of your throat (pinched, nasal, etc.).

For your recording... you have a voice that sounds naturally very rich. That's a good thing. You're a bass. Go with it, and accentuate those rich bass frequencies.

That said... you are singing right out of your throat. I can hear it. Chances are, you can feel it. The solution to that is here: http://thebelcantotechnique.now-here-this.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=33&Itemid=35 Read the lift of the throat and the mask of the face.

It sounds like you have some breath support, but you tend to lose most of it by the time you get to a longer line. The trick is to learn how to control the diaphragm so that you aren't expelling all your air so quickly, yet maintaining the breath support required for the power and projection you want. Most of us need a teacher to show us that.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
Last edited by axemanchris at Dec 16, 2008,
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
Join date: Aug 2006
230 IQ
#29
Quote by Martyr's Prayer

My question is, if something doesn't hurt your throat or effect your singing at all, could it still be doing irreparable damage?


You might not notice the effects short term. What happens if you did those things for a solid hour or two, as if you were doing it at a gig? And then imagine what would happen if you did that four nights a week.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
madbasslover
UG's ***** Hands
Join date: Feb 2005
111 IQ
#30
Can someone give some examples of what tenors sound like in normal singing? I've heard tenors singing opera, but it's kind of hard to compare.

I used to think I was a baritone, but I realized recently that I've been using vocal fry to get a lot of the lower notes I was singing and that I seem to be pretty impaired in the lower range of singing. I've done some reading up on the ranges of different tenors and different baritones, and it seems to me that if I'm a baritone at all, the only baritone I could possibly be is baryton-martin.
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
Join date: Aug 2006
230 IQ
#31
Quote by madbasslover
Can someone give some examples of what tenors sound like in normal singing?


Paul McCartney.
Bruce Dickenson
Bon Jovi - (most of the '80's hair metal bands, actually)
Chris Cornell
Goo Goo Dolls
Boston/Journey
Don Henley (Eagles)
Billy Squier

... SO many....

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
axemanchris
Awwww.... NOW what?!
Join date: Aug 2006
230 IQ
#32
Quote by tobysaurus


You seem to have good breath support, and the timbre of your voice works well for this song.

The biggest problem I hear is that your voice lacks resonance. The best solution to this is lessons. You're pushing your voice, which becomes really apparent when you try to hit high notes and they break up in pretty unflattering ways. By pushing your voice, it goes past your vocal cords and straight out your mouth. It speeds right by your sinus cavities, which are your natural and best-utilized resonance chambers, before it has a chance to pick up those overtones. The end difference is a one-dimensional tone, closer to a yell or a shout than to a robust singing voice. Also, this leads one with a tendency to go sharp.

Try opening your throat up more and keeping it there, too.

A few of these factors, all typical of an untrained singer, are all working against you, which is what is resulting in your pitch going off here and there too.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
QuiteTheFellow
Pastafarian.
Join date: Oct 2006
70 IQ
#33
I recently started taking vocal lessons, and after my last lesson on Saturday I felt a very drastic improvement. But now I've been singing so much that my voice has become hoarse and the improvement reversed; how can I make my voice feel good again, or do I just have to wait it out?
Quote by cubedeathk

No my friends Dinosaurs walked this earth with Man.


z4twenny
UG's resident Psychopath
Join date: Nov 2005
50 IQ
#34
Quote by axemanchris
You might not notice the effects short term. What happens if you did those things for a solid hour or two, as if you were doing it at a gig? And then imagine what would happen if you did that four nights a week.

CT

thought i'd drop in just to look around and lo' and behold my "how to scream" clip has been totally wh0red out which is awesome! glad to see its still helping people.

to second this, yes, if you can "throat growl" for an hour or 2 straight and you don't feel excessive strain, pain or you don't go hoarse afterwards its probably safe to say initially that you're doing it right. but again, i remember being younger it didn't hurt but once i started getting older i started noticing it. so always be paying attention to what you're doing to yourself when "screaming"
lcphr3ak
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2007
10 IQ
#35
Quote by z4twenny
thought i'd drop in just to look around and lo' and behold my "how to scream" clip has been totally wh0red out which is awesome! glad to see its still helping people.

to second this, yes, if you can "throat growl" for an hour or 2 straight and you don't feel excessive strain, pain or you don't go hoarse afterwards its probably safe to say initially that you're doing it right. but again, i remember being younger it didn't hurt but once i started getting older i started noticing it. so always be paying attention to what you're doing to yourself when "screaming"


Ahh , hopefully you'll check the thread again, but I was wondering if your technique could be applied to gain a edge to my voice? Such as a Bon Scott (or Steven Tyler, or Josh Todd, etc).
ADireStraight
Registered User
Join date: May 2008
10 IQ
#36
Quote by axemanchris
The last bit sorta caught me first... Your tone is dependent upon breath support with the diaphragm, yes. But, perhaps even more importantly, your tone is dependent upon how it resonates. If your voice is resonating in your sinus cavities and in your chest, you will get a tone (round, rich, vibrant) worlds better than if it is resonating in the back of your throat (pinched, nasal, etc.).

For your recording... you have a voice that sounds naturally very rich. That's a good thing. You're a bass. Go with it, and accentuate those rich bass frequencies.

That said... you are singing right out of your throat. I can hear it. Chances are, you can feel it. The solution to that is here: http://thebelcantotechnique.now-here-this.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=33&Itemid=35 Read the lift of the throat and the mask of the face.

It sounds like you have some breath support, but you tend to lose most of it by the time you get to a longer line. The trick is to learn how to control the diaphragm so that you aren't expelling all your air so quickly, yet maintaining the breath support required for the power and projection you want. Most of us need a teacher to show us that.

CT


Thanks a ton, again. I found it surprising that you said I was singing right out of my throat. I compared with some older recordings of mine and I sound MUCH less "breathey" now than I used to, so I assumed that meant I was singing from my throat much less.

I will look into those bel canto technique tips.
tobysaurus
UG Newbie
Join date: Apr 2007
10 IQ
#37
Quote by axemanchris
You seem to have good breath support, and the timbre of your voice works well for this song.

The biggest problem I hear is that your voice lacks resonance. The best solution to this is lessons. You're pushing your voice, which becomes really apparent when you try to hit high notes and they break up in pretty unflattering ways. By pushing your voice, it goes past your vocal cords and straight out your mouth. It speeds right by your sinus cavities, which are your natural and best-utilized resonance chambers, before it has a chance to pick up those overtones. The end difference is a one-dimensional tone, closer to a yell or a shout than to a robust singing voice. Also, this leads one with a tendency to go sharp.

Try opening your throat up more and keeping it there, too.

A few of these factors, all typical of an untrained singer, are all working against you, which is what is resulting in your pitch going off here and there too.

CT

aha!
makes sense to me

thank you
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Tobysaurus is one sexy man.

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I think I love you Tobysaurus!

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God damn, you've given me a boner Toby!
symba05
hey kids
Join date: Oct 2007
100 IQ
#38
Something that usually happens to me and maybe to other people here as well is when I hang out with friends/family and they ask me to play and sing something in the moment, I notice that my voice is rough because I really need to warm up first.

When I play guitar it's fine, because I don't really play demanding stuff and I don't need to warm up my hands, but I'm not comfortable at all singing when this type of situations happens.

I know it'll sound silly but is there a way that I can prepare my voice or warm up a bit without doing all the weird vocal exercises that everybody will notice and make fun of?
z4twenny
UG's resident Psychopath
Join date: Nov 2005
50 IQ
#39
Quote by lcphr3ak
Ahh , hopefully you'll check the thread again, but I was wondering if your technique could be applied to gain a edge to my voice? Such as a Bon Scott (or Steven Tyler, or Josh Todd, etc).

yes it can, but the idea to that is to not loosen the vocal chords as much as you would while growling/screaming and to emphasize the singing with the diaphragm, this will give you a bit of an edge. Bon Scott actually sings alot looser than steven tyler generally. but again, this is something that practice should help you nail down how you want it to sound.
Kenit
Final Coercion!
Join date: Dec 2006
20 IQ
#40
I just recently got into singing. Just a couple of days ago actually, and I'm still looking into some easy songs to start with. I'm going for alternative rock, post-grunge kinda thing. I tried Staind, it wasn't bad but I had to move it down half a step.

Can anyone suggest easy songs to start with? Preferably ones with which I can also play with (easy chords etc since I am still finding it tough to sing and play at the same time)
Quote by Seryaph
Great.


You just single-handedly caused an entire future generation of people to be flushed down the toilet.

Good job, TS.