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#1
Hello,

No, I'm not asking what effects the band Placebo uses.

Could it be that we only BELIEVE that class A circuitry, tubes, vintage reissues etc. sound good because we're always TOLD they sound good?

If every UGer were to listen (while blindfolded) to someone playing a squier and a genuine '62 Fender Stratocaster through the same amp, would they be able to tell which is which?

Sure, some tones are more pleasant to the ear than others, but could it be that sometimes, in fact pretty often, we can't tell our ass from our elbow and we just accept whatever the mass opinion tells us?

On one side, if so many people say that something sounds good, I guess there is a reason behind it.
On the other side, generalisations made from such opinions can bias your views on what should sound good.

If a Line 6 Spider and a Bogner Uberschall produced the same, great tone, many would probably still say that the spider sucks.

What do you think?
(I myself am planning to buy a tube amp, but I think I might just be susceptible to propaganda)
#2
trust me, i can tell the difference between two guitars on a nice tube amp. now if it was a solid state, the difference between a $1000 guitar and $100 isn't that noticeable
"F*ck off with your sofa units and strine green stripe patterns, I say never be complete, I say stop being perfect, I say let... lets evolve, let the chips fall where they may." -

Tyler Durden
#3
well i think my squier sounds really good on the neck pickup

sayin that it doesnt compare to my RR24 in distortion terms
Lady Gaga if you're out there, i don't care if you have a penis or not, i will marry you
#4
i think that does have an effect as with most other things
but at the end of the day depends on what you like really.
but other peoples views constantly bias your own wether it be in a positive or negative way
#5
low volumes= maybe not as much difference
high gig volumes= definitely tube amp and good axe will sound much better
#6
Quote by sashki
Hello,

No, I'm not asking what effects the band Placebo uses.

Could it be that we only BELIEVE that class A circuitry, tubes, vintage reissues etc. sound good because we're always TOLD they sound good?

If every UGer were to listen (while blindfolded) to someone playing a squier and a genuine '62 Fender Stratocaster through the same amp, would they be able to tell which is which?

Sure, some tones are more pleasant to the ear than others, but could it be that sometimes, in fact pretty often, we can't tell our ass from our elbow and we just accept whatever the mass opinion tells us?

On one side, if so many people say that something sounds good, I guess there is a reason behind it.
On the other side, generalisations made from such opinions can bias your views on what should sound good.

If a Line 6 Spider and a Bogner Uberschall produced the same, great tone, many would probably still say that the spider sucks.

What do you think?
(I myself am planning to buy a tube amp, but I think I might just be susceptible to propaganda)



No they wouldn't.
No man has the right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training. It is a shame for a man to grow old without seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable


@gossage91
@overtimefitnessau
#7
Quote by jambi_mantra
No they wouldn't.

People jump on the bandwagon and say the Spider sucks without having tried it. After hearing all the time about how much it sucks, they wouldn't bother to listen to it, even if it sounded good. They'd dismiss it immediately.

I have tried all 3 series of Spiders. The third one was much better than the first two. It had much more density to the tone, whereas the others produced a horrible screeching noise. That said, I still think there are better amps for the money, but it wasn't near as awful as most people say.

I think if you blind-fold tested a bunch of UGers with it, they'd believe it was something else.
#8
Quote by sashki
People jump on the bandwagon and say the Spider sucks without having tried it. After hearing all the time about how much it sucks, they wouldn't bother to listen to it, even if it sounded good. They'd dismiss it immediately.

I have tried all 3 series of Spiders. The third one was much better than the first two. It had much more density to the tone, whereas the others produced a horrible screeching noise. That said, I still think there are better amps for the money, but it wasn't near as awful as most people say.

I think if you blind-fold tested a bunch of UGers with it, they'd believe it was something else.



That's beside the point. To say that people would still say one amp sucks because of the name even if it is producing the same tone is ludacrous.

Amps get a reputation for a reason.
No man has the right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training. It is a shame for a man to grow old without seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable


@gossage91
@overtimefitnessau
#9
There is an absolute difference. having never played or even known what a tube amp was, I was looking for a new amp, and the guy at a store plugged me into a Blues Jr. I did not know what tube amps were or even that they existed. I strummed one chord and my dad (who is deaf in one ear and doesn't play guitar) and I looked at each other like, "Woah. That's nice."
Yes, there is an audible difference, and it doesn't have a lot to do with propaganda.
Schecter Gryphon; Ibanez AEG20E
Peavey Rage 158 ; TRAYNOR YCS50
EHX Big Muff Pi; Dunlop CryBaby GCB-95 (modded); MXR M-108 10-band; DigiTech JamMan Looper
#10
Well, tube amps definitely have more life to them. Solid state amps artificially create distortion, which is meant to sound like real overdriven tubes. Solid states sound flat and dry, while tubes sound wet, if you know what I mean.

On guitars, the differences are less obvious. The only major difference between a Squier and a real strat are the pickups, (and maybe the wood? not sure), and the name on the headstock.

But a guitar with neck-through-body construction WILL have more sustain than a bolt-on neck + floyd rose. With the Floyd, the string vibrations are mostly absorbed by the tremolo. With neck-througs, the string vibrations vibrate the wood more, causing it to resonate more and have more sustain. The tremolo "dampens" the strings, absorbing the sound into it as opposed to the guitar body, if you know what I mean.

But a little more on-topic, I think "vintage reissue" stuff is just a big gimmick. Maybe there's a little difference (like older pickups), but not a whole lot.

I agree with you that a lot of people are jumping on "vintage is better", "line 6 sucks", etc bandwagons without actually trying them, though. They just believe what they are told, and as you said, it could have a placebo effect on them, making them believe it when they try.
#11
I've played a good number of amps and genre per genre they are miles apart. For classic rock a vintage amp is spot on becuase guess what, thats what they used. Now the same can be said in reverse. Can a vintage amp get you great modern metal tones? Nope your out of luck on that one. Also vintage amps had issues and half the time the tolerances were off so you had some amps that sounded amazingly good and some were dirt. Versus todays modern amps are all the same and sound cloned in comparision. Nothing stands out on the new market when it comes to trying to play classic rock you need the orginals.

Also I used to think the same thing, like ok why does this old busted up Marshall cost 5 grand and why is everyone raving about it so much. Then I plugged into one... The tone was truly amazing. Touch sensitive, creamy as hell, perfect crunch and perfect classic rock tone.

Now that said there are people out there that truly cant tell the differnce from a SS amp and a Tube amp. There just there saying what they sound the same I dont get what the deal about tubes is. So everyone is different..
#12
I've played amps without knowing if they were tube or SS, and I could tell.
I've played tube amps which I thought were ****, so I guess I'm not fully convinced by the "tubes are always better" bandwagon.

That said, not all tube amps are good, but all the best amps I've tried were tube. I hear a difference, but is that difference real or just in my head?

I guess if so many people subscribe to it, it's probably true.

But for a cheap tube amp like the Peavey Valveking: does its tube-ness change anything? Are you better off spending the money on a solid state amp? Is it only popular because its marketed as an affordable ALL-VALVE amplifier?
Quote by Zecromancer

But a guitar with neck-through-body construction WILL have more sustain than a bolt-on neck + floyd rose. With the Floyd, the string vibrations are mostly absorbed by the tremolo. With neck-througs, the string vibrations vibrate the wood more, causing it to resonate more and have more sustain. The tremolo "dampens" the strings, absorbing the sound into it as opposed to the guitar body, if you know what I mean.

An experiment proved the exact opposite.
http://www.liutaiomottola.com/myth/neckJointSustain.htm

I agree with fixed bridges giving more sustain. It makes sense. But this experiment says bolt-ons actually have longer sustain than set necks.
Last edited by sashki at Dec 29, 2008,
#13
Well, I was referring to the Floyd Rose part. Thanks for teaching me something new, though I think I should have said "string-through-body", not "neck". Sorry, my bad. The point I was trying to make was about tremolos, not necks.
#15
Quote by sashki
Hello,

No, I'm not asking what effects the band Placebo uses.

Could it be that we only BELIEVE that class A circuitry, tubes, vintage reissues etc. sound good because we're always TOLD they sound good?

If every UGer were to listen (while blindfolded) to someone playing a squier and a genuine '62 Fender Stratocaster through the same amp, would they be able to tell which is which?

Sure, some tones are more pleasant to the ear than others, but could it be that sometimes, in fact pretty often, we can't tell our ass from our elbow and we just accept whatever the mass opinion tells us?

On one side, if so many people say that something sounds good, I guess there is a reason behind it.
On the other side, generalisations made from such opinions can bias your views on what should sound good.

If a Line 6 Spider and a Bogner Uberschall produced the same, great tone, many would probably still say that the spider sucks.

What do you think?
(I myself am planning to buy a tube amp, but I think I might just be susceptible to propaganda)


I'm going to bite on this one.

I am a firm believer that if I made a recording with a Marshall MG and dialed it in right and told the rest of the board it was a JTM45, many people would believe me. I don't doubt anyone's ability to be able tell difference between the two if I were to do a direct comparison, but as many people say "get a tube amp" around here, many of them would not be able to tell me if I did a recording, whether it was a tube amp or not because few of them actually know what tubes do or know what to listen for. They've just heard from others that tube amps are better.

There is a lot of propaganda and misconceptions out there. Here is my opinion, the cleaner the sound is, the less the difference between tube and solid state amps become apparent, and likewise the more distorted the sound is. This is especially the case with some of these high gain amplifiers, when players want pristine clean tones and then the ability to switch to these super high gain, brutal metal tones. In those high gain situations, you lose the dynamics that make tubes feel reactive, your tone loses it's touch sensitivity, there are reasons to still buy tube amps and still qualities that set tube amps apart from solid state amps even in these extreme settings, but I guarantee you that half the people who say "get a tube amp" would not be able to tell you what they are and would not be able to hear a real difference. The best part is when people say... "solid state amps have buzzy, harsh unmusical distortion, get a 5150/XXX/Mesa/etc, they're tube amps," or any of these types of amps in particular. Preamp gain is also buzzy, harsh and can sound rather unmusical sometimes, but in a tube amp setting these ah..."aficionados" like it for it's aggressive qualities.

If you'd like a good book on the subject, one of my favorites is David Hunter's "The Guitar Amp Handbook," it's a very good introduction to tube amps, dispels a lot o myths and gives a good overview of how tube amps work. I think it's essential reading for any guitarist.
#16
If you have any ear for tone, you will easily tell the difference between guitars, pickups, strings, tube type, amp types.

When you first start playing, you won't be able to tell the difference between a tube amp and a ss amp, but after around the year mark you will start to discern differences in tone better.

Oh and I totally agree with what al112987 said. It is true that the cleaner the tone, or higher gain the tone the harder it will be to tell a tube amp from ss. But, if you always play with a good metal tone you will be able to tell very subtle differences in distortion, just as players that always play with sparkling clean tones. But if you go from playing clean then to a high gain amp, you might not be able to tell the difference between a distortion pedal and a tube amp's distortion.

But mid gain amps, it is very easy to tell differences which is why you should never have your gain up too high.
Last edited by yoyodunno at Dec 29, 2008,
#17
Well it is the same thing as commercials on tv for new cars, or soft drinks, or restaurants... Its all about marketing. Marketing is not geared toward the people of a certain demographic who may know the most about said field, i.e.; cars or what have you. Instead they gear their advertising and marketing strategies for those who are more easily convinced that what ever product has the best advertising is obviously the best. People become willing to pay tremendous amounts of money for something that is only as good as the competition and when they realize this they must then try and justify to themselves that they did indeed buy the superior product...

Its not only a matter of marketing but also a matter of psychology... Corporations have to convince people to buy their products and then convince them that their purchase was the right choice and that they should do repeat business with them. Eventually that person develops a brand loyalty and the only brand they tout is the brand that they buy.

This carries over into every market in life, from what underwear you buy or what style to what type of car you drive or house you live in or amplifier that you buy to play your guitar through in your bedroom. Individuality has gone out the window because now days everyone is trying to "keep up with the jones"...
#18
Quote by yoyodunno
If you have any ear for tone, you will easily tell the difference between guitars, pickups, strings, tube type, amp types.

When you first start playing, you won't be able to tell the difference between a tube amp and a ss amp, but after around the year mark you will start to discern differences in tone better.

Oh and I totally agree with what al112987 said.


You're a hypocrite, who clearly listens with his eyes.
Quote by sargasm
There are no genres in metal that end with "core."
#19
Quote by `digitaL.braVo
You're a hypocrite, who clearly listens with his eyes.

No. I'm not talking about listening to a recording and telling a difference between pickups and guitar woods. When you are playing, it is easy to tell small differences in tone.

I agree with what al112987 said about the recordings, which is a completely different thing.
Last edited by yoyodunno at Dec 29, 2008,
#20
Quote by yoyodunno
If you have any ear for tone, you will easily tell the difference between guitars, pickups, strings, tube type, amp types.

When you first start playing, you won't be able to tell the difference between a tube amp and a ss amp, but after around the year mark you will start to discern differences in tone better.

Oh and I totally agree with what al112987 said. It is true that the cleaner the tone, or higher gain the tone the harder it will be to tell a tube amp from ss. But, if you always play with a good metal tone you will be able to tell very subtle differences in distortion, just as players that always play with sparkling clean tones. But if you go from playing clean then to a high gain amp, you might not be able to tell the difference between a distortion pedal and a tube amp's distortion.

But mid gain amps, it is very easy to tell differences which is why you should never have your gain up too high.

I'll address the first part right off the bat... I have been playing for quite a while and I am able to tell in some instances when a person is using a solid state amp and when someone is using a tube amp... However, I , and most people I know who have been playing longer or are accomplished musicians, cannot tell what type of strings someone is using simply from their tone. Maybe the gauge but not the brand. Nor any of us can determine if someone is using a Peavey or a Marshall, given that they are both dialed in properly. And you can go ahead and flame me for that being said, but we all know that it is true.

But its not fair to say that everyone should buy mid gain amps... You are doing exactly what I said people do in my previous post... Telling people that they should only buy what you like... Hence there is a placebo effect in buying gear, and you have just proved it.
#21
Quote by music_mike
I'll address the first part right off the bat... I have been playing for quite a while and I am able to tell in some instances when a person is using a solid state amp and when someone is using a tube amp... However, I , and most people I know who have been playing longer or are accomplished musicians, cannot tell what type of strings someone is using simply from their tone. Maybe the gauge but not the brand. Nor any of us can determine if someone is using a Peavey or a Marshall, given that they are both dialed in properly. And you can go ahead and flame me for that being said, but we all know that it is true.

But its not fair to say that everyone should buy mid gain amps... You are doing exactly what I said people do in my previous post... Telling people that they should only buy what you like... Hence there is a placebo effect in buying gear, and you have just proved it.


Quote by yoyodunno
No. I'm not talking about listening to a recording and telling a difference between pickups and guitar woods. When you are playing, it is easy to tell small differences in tone.

I agree with what al112987 said about the recordings, which is a completely different thing.



Yeah of course probably no human being could tell what someone else is playing just from listening. It's all about the person experiencing the equipment.
#22
Quote by yoyodunno
No. I'm not talking about listening to a recording and telling a difference between pickups and guitar woods. When you are playing, it is easy to tell small differences in tone.

I agree with what al112987 said about the recordings, which is a completely different thing.


Can you tell the brand, style, and location of where rubber was harvested on different tires for your car? I didn't think so.

What about motor oil, can you tell the brand and viscosity while driving? Didn't think so.

Why people assume sound is far from different than my above examples, is just crazy. Heck they've even proven that tube amps don't actually get louder they just fool your ear into thinking they're louder.
Quote by sargasm
There are no genres in metal that end with "core."
#23
Quote by music_mike
I'll address the first part right off the bat... I have been playing for quite a while and I am able to tell in some instances when a person is using a solid state amp and when someone is using a tube amp... However, I , and most people I know who have been playing longer or are accomplished musicians, cannot tell what type of strings someone is using simply from their tone. Maybe the gauge but not the brand. Nor any of us can determine if someone is using a Peavey or a Marshall, given that they are both dialed in properly. And you can go ahead and flame me for that being said, but we all know that it is true.

But its not fair to say that everyone should buy mid gain amps... You are doing exactly what I said people do in my previous post... Telling people that they should only buy what you like... Hence there is a placebo effect in buying gear, and you have just proved it.


I'll aggree on the string brand, but as far as peavey between a marshall theres a huge tonal difference there most if not 95% of people can pick up on. Thats straight up British vs American voicing.

Also I can usually even pick up what amp is being used. Example I can generally pick a Peavey Valveking, 6505, Mesa and so on out of a crowd. Same with EL34's and 6L6's. Most tube amps have very distinctive voicings that are not hard to pick up on tone wise. And SS vs Tube in most of the blind studys done on this site most have been able to pick an SS out of the crowd with ease.
Last edited by IbanezPsycho at Dec 29, 2008,
#24
Quote by `digitaL.braVo
Can you tell the brand, style, and location of where rubber was harvested on different tires for your car? I didn't think so.

What about motor oil, can you tell the brand and viscosity while driving? Didn't think so.

Why people assume sound is far from different than my above examples, is just crazy. Heck they've even proven that tube amps don't actually get louder they just fool your ear into thinking they're louder.



You can tell the end result.


And I know that tube amps aren't louder, and it's just about the frequencies that they amplify that make them seem louder. Not sure what significance that has?
#25
Quality judgements aside, famous amps have their own sonic signature. Whether it is judged as good or bad tone doesn't matter. You can recognise a familiar voice, can't you? Wouldn't you be able to recognise a guitar or amp the same way?
#26
Quote by yoyodunno
Yeah of course probably no human being could tell what someone else is playing just from listening. It's all about the person experiencing the equipment.

Well in a blind comparison of amps for people to tell what tone is what and to list every piece of gear appropriately, it would more then likely be done like most other comparisons, by being recordings. Or at least a literal blind test. And in those cases I would bet that most people wouldn't be able to get the answers right, just a general direction to the gear being used.

And even a person experiencing the equipment will still be based on bias... People begin to look for the little "awesomenesses" that people say are there until they fool themselves into believing it as well. If everyone told you that a 1992 Ford Festiva had the best torque ratings and off-the-line speeds, you would test drive one until you believed that that was indeed the case...
#27
We're also leaving out the one major point:

Solid-state amps are knowingly "entry level" and some far lower quality (MG's have lots of breaking-down threads for instance). But why would they want to have cheaper higher quality solid-states that they could develop and produce, when dogs of habit (Eg: YOU) continue to shout tubes are so much better.

So they over price tube amps, and leave the solid-states to be over priced and practice amps which they use to bait/switch the new guitarist.
Quote by sargasm
There are no genres in metal that end with "core."
#28
Quote by IbanezPsycho
I'll aggree on the string brand, but as far as peavey between a marshall theres a huge tonal difference there most if not 95% of people can pick up on. Thats straight up British vs American voicing.

Also I can usually even pick up what amp is being used. Example I can generally pick a Peavey Valveking, 6505, Mesa and so on out of a crowd. Same with EL34's and 6L6's. Most tube amps have very distinctive voicings that are not hard to pick up on tone wise. And SS vs Tube in most of the blind studys done on this site most have been able to pick an SS out of the crowd with ease.


It's one thing to do this with a cheap SS amp.

But let me ask you this, would you be able to tell the difference between a AxeFX and a tube amp?
#29
Quote by al112987
It's one thing to do this with a cheap SS amp.

But let me ask you this, would you be able to tell the difference between a AxeFX and a tube amp?

Yeah that would be tough. But isn't the AxeFX around 1000 dollars? My palomino was less than 200 dollars and when cranked, it's tone can compete with most amps.
#30
There's definitely a pretty huge placebo effect. There is a difference in tone quality, but it is almost always blown out of proportion. I probably wouldn't be able to tell a tube amp apart from a solid-state at low volumes with clean tones. But I can definitely hear my old SS dying when I crank the volume, as opposed to my new tube amp, which develops a beautiful overdriven sound. As for guitars, I own two, one of which is roughly twice the price of the other. With enough fiddling with settings, I could probably get them to sound around the same. But one of them just feels so much nicer to play. And I know this isn't a placebo effect, because the first time I played it I didn't know the price, but was still amazed by how it played.
#31
Quote by IbanezPsycho
I'll aggree on the string brand, but as far as peavey between a marshall theres a huge tonal difference there most if not 95% of people can pick up on. Thats straight up British vs American voicing.

Also I can usually even pick up what amp is being used. Example I can generally pick a Peavey Valveking, 6505, Mesa and so on out of a crowd. Same with EL34's and 6L6's. Most tube amps have very distinctive voicings that are not hard to pick up on tone wise. And SS vs Tube in most of the blind studys done on this site most have been able to pick an SS out of the crowd with ease.

The first part is not true... I have seen people think that the Peavey Windsor head sounded just as good if not better then a Marshall JCM800 head and who honestly couldn't differentiate between the two...

But if there was a blind study done, with people having absolutely no knowledge of what amps were going to be used, most people would not be able to pick up what amp types or brands are which...
#32
on some things, to an extent yes. i think guitar cables are a good example of this. for example if you can tell the difference between the homemade cables i made for very little money and a set of high end cables in a double blind test, i will be extremely surprised. likewise, if you do blind comparisons between amps, people notice the difference far less than you'd expect. they hear a difference, but they find it much harder to say which is which.

so to an extent, people are blinded by brand. i don't think that is at all controversial. but it isn't purely a placebo effect; some stuff just does sound better (although obviously better is pretty subjective really...)
my name is matt. you can call me that if you like.
#33
Quote by al112987
It's one thing to do this with a cheap SS amp.

But let me ask you this, would you be able to tell the difference between a AxeFX and a tube amp?


I know you didn't ask me: but no. He, and no one else, would be able to.

It makes my point all the more important, people want their amps to be "high end tube amps" so that's what is made. Solid-states are "practice" amps, and otherwise badly created amps for entry level guitarists.
Quote by sargasm
There are no genres in metal that end with "core."
#34
Quote by `digitaL.braVo
Can you tell the brand, style, and location of where rubber was harvested on different tires for your car? I didn't think so.

What about motor oil, can you tell the brand and viscosity while driving? Didn't think so.

Why people assume sound is far from different than my above examples, is just crazy. Heck they've even proven that tube amps don't actually get louder they just fool your ear into thinking they're louder.


Actually you would be surprised what some car nuts can pickup on. When I used to drag race there where some guys/mechanics that could literally tell you pretty much anything when came to a car lol

Its the same thing with amps.. If you have been around them for 30+ years theres people out there that can pick out anything and tell you what it is.
#35
Quote by `digitaL.braVo
We're also leaving out the one major point:

Solid-state amps are knowingly "entry level" and some far lower quality (MG's have lots of breaking-down threads for instance). But why would they want to have cheaper higher quality solid-states that they could develop and produce, when dogs of habit (Eg: YOU) continue to shout tubes are so much better.

So they over price tube amps, and leave the solid-states to be over priced and practice amps which they use to bait/switch the new guitarist.

I'll be completely honest here, I was going to try and say something in regards to this post, but I have no idea what you are trying to say...
#36
Quote by IbanezPsycho
Actually you would be surprised what some car nuts can pickup on. When I used to drag race there where some guys/mechanics that could literally tell you pretty much anything when came to a car lol

Its the same thing with amps.. If you have been around them for 30+ years theres people out there that can pick out anything and tell you what it is.


I still don't believe it. Period.

Quote by music_mike
I'll be completely honest here, I was going to try and say something in regards to this post, but I have no idea what you are trying to say...


It was sort of confusing wasn't it... basically:

You have "high end" tube amps compared to a Marshall MG, well yeah the difference is huge.
Quote by sargasm
There are no genres in metal that end with "core."
Last edited by `digitaL.braVo at Dec 29, 2008,
#37
i can hear the difference between my amp and a crap amp

and thats enough for me
Get off this damn forum and play your damn guitar.
#38
Quote by music_mike
The first part is not true... I have seen people think that the Peavey Windsor head sounded just as good if not better then a Marshall JCM800 head and who honestly couldn't differentiate between the two...

But if there was a blind study done, with people having absolutely no knowledge of what amps were going to be used, most people would not be able to pick up what amp types or brands are which...


Hate to tell ya but a peavey windsor head is a clone of a JCM800 and its hot rodded so yes in most aspects it can sound better then the orginal. If someone prefers the hot rodded tone of a JCM800.

Also thats why I said 95%, theres always those people that dont have a clue. And usually when I think of these studies where not talking about rangling up 100 bums off the street that have never heard a tube amp let alone music in the last 10 years. If you take a person that has been around and played all this amps for minimum of a year they should be able to generally pick the amp out of a crowd. Even a non guitarist can be told hey this is what your listening for and they should be able to make and educated guess when it comes to tube vs ss.
#39
The thing that bothers me about the talk about tube amps is that a lot of people pimping up tube amps haven't the slightest clue what they're actually talking about. Especially the "your amp sucks, get a tube." That irks me the most, when the word "tube" is used in substitution for the word "amp." I play a tube amp, and I love my tube amp, it gets tone that I love not because it's a tube amp but because of it's overall design. There was a reason why I went for a JTM45 rather than say... you know, a Mesa Boogie or something. But you know how the whole word of mouth goes, especially amongst people who don't actually have their own opinion. "She sells sea shells by the sea shore" eventually becomes "Apparently she sold all the shells on the shore back to the sea."
#40
I'm sure an expert could hear THE DIFFERENCE between 2 amps when blindfold tested, but would he be able to tell WHICH AMP IS WHICH if he were told what they were?

Suppose it was a Windsor vs. JCM 800 test. One is a modern, medium priced tube amp, the other is hailed as the legendary sound that fueled 80's rock. The Windsor might sound better than the 800, but you'd never notice that unless you were blindfold tested.
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